twelfthrootoftwo

Why did the DF target Joel and Jae? Joel had been posting occasionally, bringing up bits and pieces of discussion. He proposed the WG gambit for Waes' attack, but later retracted this comment and supported coordination through Waes. Jae had also posted sporadically; after day 1, his only post was to argue his suspicion of Waes. Neither have been particularly active in the thread. Unless they were very active in PMs I haven't seen, they weren't attacked for stimulating lots of discussion. Both were regular Villagers. The Dragon Fang, while certainly useful, is not nearly the threat to the DF that something like the Viewer or Wisdom would pose. They may be trying to take control of the Fang vote, but in the process they a) reveal lots of Villager deaths, making the Fang suspicious, and b ) waste kills that could be applied to bigger problems. Both voted Witless for mayor on day 1, but this doesn't seem like a big enough thing to get them killed. Finally, both voted Bela on day 2. I think this is the real reason. There are two possibilities: the DF are inexperienced and are killing people who suspect one of their own, or they're trying to deflect suspicion onto her, through this and the Dreamwalker message. Which is correct? Well, several people have expressed suspicion of Trimat above, due both to his defence today and his bandwagon voting yesterday, which was theorised to be protecting Bela. Further, there is Kaim's idea that the Forsaken didn't kill the first night because s/he expected to be scanned. So a leading player such as Wilson or Waes, or someone who had come up suspicious on the first day - again, Bela. There's my reasoning. Shoot holes in it. edit: smiley where I didn't want it

Just to double-check: kills happen before corruptions, so Kaim had not corrupted anyone (despite mashadar showing up), correct? With Fain removed so early, trust is a lot easier to maintain once earned. Anyone who held off networking for that reason can now 'safely' discuss. I am in favour of using a hub of coordinators as has been proposed - while including a DF is more likely, it will significantly reduce the damage they can do with the information, and I feel collective organisation will do more to aid the villagers than that power will help the DF. Also (credit to Kaim for this bit of logic): Forsaken was active last night, but not the first night. That suggests s/he was expecting to get scanned on the first night.

I was never intending the bandwagon to grow as it did. I was hoping that if Jim were intending to play, I could encourage him to come on and defend himself. Instead, it seems a lot of people want him dead. So, Jim Bob Dirt, have a reprieve. I could vote for Bela, but that would tie the votes, and I really think her move was too obvious for the DF. Instead -yes, it's something of a bandwagon, but they've all been well-argued votes from a big group of experienced players - Jain.

I apologise if I wasn't clear, Grimlah. My logic was: inactivity is suspicious there are two players who are (mostly, since Lam has since posted) inactive one has three votes and the other has no votes => I'll vote for the one with no votes ​I didn't mean to cause a bandwagon, though... Jim Bob Dirt, if you post before the deadline, I'll withdraw my vote.

I read the writeup as Waes surviving because he was tough (Aiel/earth), not because someone specific saved him (wisdom/air). Great Time-Keeping Voice specifically confirmed that Aiel and earth would look the same, which tells me wisdom and air would be noticeably different (from the other two, though not necessarily each other). Bela's vote was certainly suspicious, but it was an incredibly obvious move and has drawn a great deal of scrutiny. If s/he does turn out to be a Darkfriend, then we may be looking at a largely inexperienced evil team. Regarding inactivity and Fain/Forsaken, it's possible that they were role-blocked. That would require another Whitecloak, or a Chaneller with enough information to be using their spirit or water weave accurately (on the first night, no less). I also wouldn't be certain about Fain, as it's possible he's waiting for more info before exposing him/herself. But Forsaken definitely should have used his kill. I'll vote Jim Bob Dirt, for the sake of balance. Also, a Darkfriend dreamwalker seems unlikely to me. Overall PMs seem to benefit the villagers more than the Darkfriends, and the anonymous message...maybe I'm not very imaginative, but its use in manipulation seems restricted. I feel that a Darkfriend dreamwalker would be a liability. With the two messages, there's a substantial difference, not just in message style and content, but also in format. Is it possible the second message came from the Great Time-Keeping Voice and his Trollocs in the speculation doc?

Didn't Nath vote for Weas? Wilson makes a good argument for Grimlah; he did indeed argue for not killing everyone in game 5: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/7960-game-5-noble-secrets/?p=136434 http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/7960-game-5-noble-secrets/?p=136835 The stark change of character is suspicious. I'll hold back my vote though, seeing as the deadline is close and there's a good chance he won't be around to defend himself. edit: I swear, things are blue in the editor then black when I post.

Douza backed away from the gruesome scene. The body - or the pieces of it, he'd been told - had been removed before he arrived, but the blood...and the smell! He managed to get away from the crowd of people before his stomach heaved. At least he wouldn't ruin any shoes. He turned back to the crowd hesitantly. With the mayor gone, and the threat of more deaths, it was time to choose a course of action. Douza set his jaw. He would reach manhood within the year. He had to take part. Any particular reasoning for choosing those two? Newan made the first lynch vote, but Trimat hasn't posted yet.

To clarify a few things: 1) The Darkfriends get one to two kills, depending on whether or not the Forsaken uses his extra kill. 2) The Dreamwalker being alive means any player can start a PM with any number of people. Am I correct?

I've never read the WoT books, so apologies if I get things completely wrong RP-wise. Douza set the bundles of weapons down at the edge of the training ground. Most were spears; the old war veteran had called them the simplest to learn, and their reach might be valuable. There were a smattering of swords - without sheaths, due to lack of time - and a few axes and maces for the stronger villagers. He'd been surprised how much his father knew of weaponsmithing. But then, his father didn't speak of the war either. Leas Fel barely spared him a glance, thankfully. The veteran was intimidating. He was always so calm, which meant you couldn't tell what he was thinking. Or how close he was to one of his rare, but famous, outbursts. Douza hurried back towards the workshop. The village needed steel, which meant he was on the bellows again. Thankless work, but he was strong because of it. Hopefully strong enough to swing an axe, when the time came.

Four votes to the Sharders, five to the Darkeyes. The balance of power lies with us, Nobles and Merchants.

I do indeed have a preference out of the remaining Sharders - Trahar. Other Ghostblood - your choice. Just remember we're walking a knife edge. (Incidentally, what's happened to Jim Bob Dirt? He hasn't posted for a few cycles, but he wasn't caught in a highstorm.) edit: blue. again.

Bleh, so it does. For whatever reason, in my head the assailant was there and took the shardblade. We heard nothing about your role. But there's a lot more to being a key player than just what powers you have due to the rules. What's more, everything else we were presented with then has proven reasonably accurate. edit: blue

Okay. We have a Shardblade in play, and I'm willing to bet that it's the double kill item. But it was used on Aonar. This could mean two things: there is an ability that changes the target of an action (separate to the Worldsinger, which only affects votes), used on the 17S member with the Shardblade, or the Shardblade belongs to someone other than the 17S. ​Either way, there's a Nightwatcher ability in the hands of someone other than the 17S, counter to Rengar's claims. The balance of power has swung back towards the darkeyes. Since we're now to the point of the game where alliances are necessary to act, I propose this. Based on information the Sharders revealed in our doc - namely, that he's a key player - I propose we lynch vote Clanal. If you want evidence he is in fact a Darkeyes, look at his strongly worded argument for last cycle's alliance.

Trahar and Aonar have admitted they're 17S. I think it's safe to assume Sarmas and Heron are as well, and probably Magam and Luckat. It amuses me to imagine the 17S members travelling between storm shelters via the Cognitive Realm.

I'm enjoying the Quick Fix, so I'll sign up for this one! Douza is the fifteen-year-old first son of the town blacksmith, reluctantly learning the family trade.

Red shirt. Messy black hair, but neat beard. Dirk just short enough to be allowed for a darkeyes, and more than one suspicious shape beneath his clothes. Walks like he expects people to get out of the way. Not afraid to display his wealth, even with the city in an uproar. Twei fingered the hastily sketched map in her pocket, mentally rehearsing her accent. For once, her fair foreigner’s skin would be useful. Her young assistant –Jem, his name was – peeked round the alley corner. If everything went to plan, what she had promised him would only be a tiny fraction of what she’d get. It was a big ‘if.’ She’d done this hundreds of times. She was good – a natural, supposedly. But never for real. Jem waved her attention, and they backed up a few metres. He started counting down with his fingers. Three…two… As he reached one, Twei shouted. “Hai!!” A moment later, they both started running, though her gait was – intentionally – slightly awkward. Jem turned a sharp right as they left the alley, and cut through just on the far side of her target. He’d timed it perfectly. “Hai!” she shouted again, before barrelling into her target. They fell in a tangle of limbs. As she pulled herself free, Twei glanced at her target’s face. His consternation had only showed for a moment before being replaced by disdainful composure, but it was long enough. She looked pointedly in the direction Jem had gone. He was out of sight. Good. “Sorry. I sorry.” He patted his hip. It would have been a terrible pickpocket attempt. Tripping your target was fine, but falling yourself wasn’t. Evidently satisfied she wasn’t a thief, he shrugged, and turned to leave. No you don’t. “You help, please? I…I have map.” She held it out. He sighed internally, but he stepped towards her and took the map. As he did so, she removed the metal chain around his wrist. She moved around, ostensibly so she could see the map. “I want here”, she said, pointing and unhooking his dirk from his belt, “so I walk here and turn here. Then – ” one hidden knife. It looked expensive – “the urchin. I follow him. Now,” she squinted at the map, “I here? Follow this street?” He sighed. “No, we’re here. And that’s the wrong way.” He turned to point, and she cut his sphere pouch from the hip now closest to her. “Take the second left, then the third right. You’ll end up here” – he pointed to the map – “facing where you want to go.” “Wait, left, wait, wait, right, ahead.” He nodded. “Tankyou! Tankyou!” She bowed quickly as he handed the map back to her, and she pulled off two of his rings as she took it. She walked quickly in the direction he had indicated. She took the first left instead of the second, and ducked around a few more corners. She could just walk away with her prizes, but she’d been taught that cheating a business partner was rarely wise. Jem was waiting for her. She handed him his payment, then gave him one of the rings. “That’s for such a tight job.” He grinned and ran off. Storms, success felt good.

Twei was soaked. The nook she had curled up in had shielded her from most of the wind - and most of the rain with it - but in a highstorm, there was a lot of rain to go around. Even after being protected by her thick travelling cloak, her freehand was a mass of wrinkles. She suspected the rest of her was similar. She almost regretted refusing the offer of shelter from that man in the long grey coat. Almost. Well, the winds had let up somewhat, and she was shivering violently. One of her allies was reasonably close. She couldn't bring herself to care about potentially putting her trust in a spy; she just wanted a warm, dry fire.

This turned out much longer than I expected... Feel free to TLDR. Twei’s newly filled sphere pouch felt comfortably heavy against her chest. Her allies had agreed to the loan, which meant she would have a roof over her head for the next few weeks. It meant she was in debt, though, and Twei had no intention of losing her head to her creditors. There was a crowd ahead. Curious, she craned her neck, and caught a glimpse of a thick-set man charging a door. Looters. An unsavoury occupation – but then, this was a riot. She wove her way towards the front of the mob, and cheered with them when the door finally burst open. The inside was dimly lit. The terrified shopkeeper huddled against one wall, watching the looters pour through the door like a flood. Navigating by flickering torchlight, Twei moved to the back, feeling for her lockpicks. An initial glance found a strongbox and a locked drawer, neither of which had visible light coming through. She took her chances with the strongbox. The lock was tricky, but it clicked in place after a few tries and she was rewarded with a faceful of coloured light. That, unfortunately, got the attention of everyone in the shop. Twei hastily hid a handful of spheres in the sleeve of her safehand, then cast the rest of the strongbox on the floor. She fled the ensuing scramble, ducking into a corridor at the back. The next door was barred, but she managed to move the steel rod with some careful leverage. As the door swung open, she smelled smoke. This one was an oil fire. She hoped the looters hadn’t hurt the shopkeeper too badly, else he might be caught in the blaze. She looked down at her handful of spheres. Was that…yes, it was a ruby broam. This was about half of what she owed, and several times what she had expected to pick up. She turned a corner, and glanced back to see a dark plume rising into the sky. For all her opportunistic drive, the riots were frightening. She would have left for a safer city, if she’d only been able to afford it. It was a comforting truth – perhaps the only one she had - to know she had allies with a common goal, who wouldn’t set her on fire on a whim. She pulled out her pouch of spheres, and poured in her newfound wealth. As she did so, her thumb brushed a slip of paper. Surprised, she pulled it out. There were two glyphs, drawn in a simple style - “danger” and “faith.” What? Pain erupted from the side of her head. She blacked out momentarily, then found herself pinned to the ground by someone much stronger. Something cold was at her neck. Then the stranger stood up, and she sluggishly realised he was holding her sphere pouch. “Shouldn’t flash your wealth like, that, lass. No hard feelings.” Twei wasn’t sure how long she was on the ground. The sun was certainly lower than she remembered when she eventually got to her feet. What would she do now? Without her spheres, she couldn’t pay for accommodation. Perhaps she could ask one of her allies for shelter – ridicule was infinitely preferable to cold stone. But…”danger” and “faith.” The note’s meaning was suddenly clear. She couldn’t trust them. The only allies she had in the city, and she couldn’t trust them. The thought was far more frightening than it should have been. She glanced around, looking for the scrap of paper, but it was nowhere to be seen. Part of her was certain it had been a figment of her imagination, a voice she couldn’t silence. Twei sighed. Truthless, roofless and proofless. If she wanted to survive, she would need to ad ruthless to that list.

A whiff of smoke reached Twei through the open window. It was a pleasant smell, if strange. The person responsible had to be determined, finding something to burn in this city of stone - and during the riddens, no less. She glanced outside to see if she could spot the fire, but saw only rooftops. Kholinar was impressive. Perhaps it would be more so if she hadn't arrived two days after the riots had started. But she had work to do, and the chaotic violence could prove invaluable there. MDT is GMT-6:00, correct?

Another new player! Call me Twei.

Axies permanently has a Cognitive realm shadow, pointing towards the light. Jasnah and Shallan have them when they enter Shadesmar. And from memory, Rysn refers to it as a "Voidbringer shadow," and hece identifies him as an Aimian. Not conclusive evidence, but it does link the Cognitive realm and Voidbringers. I don't remember any mention of Parshendi/parshman shadows behaving strangely. Maybe the Parshendi's minds are closer to the Cognitive, and the Aimians' bodies work similarly. That could mean they don't need a spren to become sentient, but they can be (forcefully?) bonded. We see a "corrupted spren" in one of Dalinar's vision, so I think in general Cognitive realm things are easier for Odium to influence.

Interesting. So there's more than one...but the first one has a singular "I". Does that mean it's one person per book, or at least that each blurb is an individual of this group? If they have more in common than just being the blurb authors, maybe the collective pronouns "us" and "we" are referring to this group, rather than the more general interpretations of spren or humans.

The writer seems to have a good knowledge of current (past?) events, so unless Tanavast gets revived later on, I doubt it's him. If it's written in the present, I think it might be Cultivation. A Shardholder seems to fit the apparent omniscience, and the overall pessimism ("may redeem us", "will destroy us") is in line with her turning her back on the people of Roshar. Further, there's precognition involved, at least in the first. The problem with someone like Sigzil is that there's a strong implication that the writer was alive in "the days before the Last Desolation." If it's written in the future, it could be one of the Heralds. Or a member of the surviving KR order, if the theory that they don't age is correct.

It's a small thing, and probably nothing, but to parallel Kaladin's attitude to the wind/storms: The infused ruby, encased in a metal enclosure, glowed softly and gave off a comfortable heat. It was convenient, though it felt wrong to Adolin that no fire lay crackling there. - TWoK, ch52

Aesudan's probably not with the Diagram, as Mr T hadn't visited the Nightwatcher at that point, so the Diagram as we know it couldn't exist. The Ghostbloods think Bordin stayed in Alethkar to keep an eye on her, for unstated reasons. Either they're aware of whatever plot she's part of, or she's with them.