Aleksiel Posted June 10, 2014 Posted June 10, 2014 @kaellok Sure, he could. But he would loose all his power and ability. Can a broken Knight Radiant mesh with another spren? It just doesn't seem to work for him to be Odium's champion. Though you have a point that he might break his oath again. But wouldn't Odium give powers to his champion? And if he does (which I'm inclined to believe so), then Kal losing his surgebinding powers will have no impact. 1
traceria she/her Posted June 10, 2014 Posted June 10, 2014 I know we all love to speculate around here, but I'd personally like to know a little more about voidspren and how they interact/bond(?) with people other than the Parshendi/Listeners before accepting Kaladin as a potential choice for Odium's champion. We see how voidspren can affect the Parshendi, but do we know yet how they affect other races, notably, humans? If they can bond, how would they do so with humans and is that even how Odium would give powers to his champion? The wiki doesn't have a lot of info on them, but maybe some obscure WOB does... Or maybe I'm just being overly optimistic about Kaladin.
SmurfAquamarineBodies he/him Posted June 10, 2014 Posted June 10, 2014 Random theory ahead: Odium could always try and invest in Sylphrena to corrupt her making both of them his champion. That could be the reason the Recreance happened, without the Heralgs protecting humanity now Odium finds it easier to corrupt Radiant Spren like Sylphrena.
Fatebreaker he/him Posted June 12, 2014 Posted June 12, 2014 But Dalinar has a horsey... Doesn't that automatically grant him more hero points? 1
Gabriele she/her Posted June 12, 2014 Posted June 12, 2014 But Dalinar has a horsey... Kaladin doesn't need a horse. He can fly.
Terisen he/him Posted June 12, 2014 Posted June 12, 2014 Kaladin doesn't need a horse. He can fly. Actually, now he can fly WITH the horse! Tell me that wouldn't inspire terror in an opponent.
kaellok he/him Posted June 12, 2014 Posted June 12, 2014 Actually, now he can fly WITH the horse! Tell me that wouldn't inspire terror in an opponent. And the horse. 3
Fatebreaker he/him Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 Kaladin doesn't need a horse. He can fly. Not the same. While flying is undeniably awesome, it's not the same as the hero riding into battle on a magnificent steed. Just look at the precedents: Gandalf, George Washington, Peter Pevensie, Aragorn son of Arathorn, the list goes on and on.
Gabriele she/her Posted June 13, 2014 Posted June 13, 2014 Yeah, that's certainly one of the more fun tropes, the hero and his steed. It basically goes back to Alexander and Bukephalos and was pretty popular in Medieval epics (Roland and Veillantif, Renaud de Montalban and Bayard, Sigurd and Grani). Often a named, special sword is involved, too (Durendal, Excalibur, Anduril, Gram - Notung in the German version, Ice ....). I admit I've done it myself.
Localconfusi0n Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 About the whole "Kaladin becoming Odiums champion" thing, it could work out fairly easily and with Kaladin coming through with his Surgebinding wholely intact. All his Windrunner oaths deal with protecting, well none of them said who he must protect in a detailed way, i.e. the human race, squids, the rabid raccoon in my back yard, he could just switch allegiance to the Parshendi and protect them instead. Also, while Syl probably wouldnt approve of this, as a Spren her identity is defined by human perception, wouldnt it make sense that Kaladins perception of her would affect her more? So she could become entirely alright with Kaladins choice, or, even if she's not, she might only be able to break the bond if Kaladin breaks his oaths, which could switch.
Zmann966 he/him Posted June 16, 2014 Posted June 16, 2014 Ahh but yes, you forget one thing, my friend jefftucker0525... Kaladin has Jezerezeh's Honorblade. End of WoR Syl told him the blade was dangerous, that ANYONE could have the power of the winds without the "checks a spren requires" As for the above little discussion, @Traceria I don't believe voidspren can bond humans, as the whole thing that MAKES them human is the sliver of investiture of the shards (probably Honor and Cultivation on Roshar) since spren are splinters/pieces of these shards, the bond makes sense. But voidspren are of Odium. I think human souls would be completely incompatible in that regard... unless... Unless it's not really the shards themselves that give humanity their souls. If humanity's souls are fragments of Adonalsium as a whole... Wait... O_O Ohh... My... God... I know what the Shattering of Adonalsium truly is/was. 1
Aether he/him Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 Unless it's not really the shards themselves that give humanity their souls. If humanity's souls are fragments of Adonalsium as a whole... Wait... O_O Ohh... My... God... I know what the Shattering of Adonalsium truly is/was. Woah! This suddenly got Dark Souls deep!
kaellok he/him Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 But voidspren are of Odium. I think human souls would be completely incompatible in that regard... unless... Unless it's not really the shards themselves that give humanity their souls. If humanity's souls are fragments of Adonalsium as a whole... Wait... O_O Ohh... My... God... I know what the Shattering of Adonalsium truly is/was. Except that people pre-date the shattering of Adonalsium. Mistborn spoilers! Ati and Leras were human-ish before they obtained their Shards. They worked together to make humans similar to ones that they knew, so humans would have to have existed somewhere before they could do that. And even if Adonalsium's shattering is what gave humans their souls, there's no reason to think that individual Shards in certain combinations would not be able to do the same thing. After all, Shards contain the power of creation and the cosmos; it's only logical to think that if Adonalsium could do something, Shards working together could replicate the effort as well.
Zmann966 he/him Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) No no... Yes humans predate the shattering, obviously. Yolen was around as kind of the "seed" world. But the shards get their "power" by taking up these fragments of Adonalsium. And humans on the current cosmere worlds get their sentience, their "power" from investiture. But you stated my point for me just now. "Shards working together could replicate the effort." What if humanity IS the remaining fragments. Each and every one of them HAS a piece of creation in them. Adonalsium was simply that power, whole and balanced. The shattering wasn't a "bad" thing... It was Adonalsium choosing to create. Just as Leras was forced to give up pieces of herself (himself? Was that ever clarified?) in order to "create" the Scadrians, Adonalsium could not create humanity as it exists w/o giving up a piece of itself.The Sixteen were chosen to (as the WoR epigraphs put it) "bear the weight of God's own virtues" and took up the largest shards to do so (be it at a command or mistakenly, who can speculate?) But my emphasis is the Shattering was to create humanity as it now exists in the cosmere. Perhaps Yolen was dying (likely, if the unpublished Liar/Dragonsteel is anything to go by) and this was the only way? Maybe it was accidental? Idk, but considering how widespread the power and forces of creation was spread (big chunks in shards, small chunks in people and things like spren) the shattering feels more like an explosion of power and life across the cosmere rather than a cracked glass. "Limited in his nature, infinite in his desire, man is a fallen god who remembers heaven." Edited June 17, 2014 by Zmann966
Recommended Posts