Elsecallers, Teleportation, and Jasnah Kholin wearing a havah made from her own hair.

[ShardShaper]

So, reading the sample chapters from The Rythm of War has given insight into the longterm question of whether or not Elsecallers can teleport. From what we've seen the new fused do, it seems that Elsecallers should be able to teleport. Previously seen fused teleportation seems to show that short-ranged teleportation is a thing, but you can't take anything with you that's not directly part of you (I assume that this means something part of your spirit web). Now, here's the big question. As far as we know, Elsecaller Jasnah Kholin should be able to teleport. Unless she's sworn the 4th ideal (which, granted, could have happened) she probably can't summon shard plate to use as clothing. The fused we've seen teleport seems to get around the issue of not being able to take clothing with you by wearing its own hair as clothing.

Will Jasnah Kholin, queen of Alethkar, begin wearing a Havah made from her own hair? Discuss.

[Innovation]

The Fused use Surges, but use them differently than Radiants do. The Growth Fused can change the shape of his Carapace, and Radiant Growth cannot. That is what I believe we are seeing here, with Transportation Fused unable to take item with them when they teleport.  

[I Am A Fish]

52 minutes ago, ShardShaper said:

Will Jasnah Kholin, queen of Alethkar, begin wearing a Havah made from her own hair? Discuss.

Do we really want to know?

29 minutes ago, Innovation said:

The Fused use Surges, but use them differently than Radiants do. The Growth Fused can change the shape of his Carapace, and Radiant Growth cannot. That is what I believe we are seeing here, with Transportation Fused unable to take item with them when they teleport.  

Except generally instead of a disadvantage it's a tradeoff. What will this fused be able to do, that Jasnah can't?

[Turtle]

I’m really confused. Why would Jasnah do that, and how would Jasnah do that?

[Pathfinder]

54 minutes ago, turtle said:

I’m really confused. Why would Jasnah do that, and how would Jasnah do that?

I believe it is because the original poster theorized that you cannot carry anything with you when you teleport. Which is why the hair of the fused was used as clothing. So unless Jasnah wanted to arrive as bare as she was born, she would need to do the same (based on the OP's premise)

 

Now having said that, I personally disagree considering we have seen Jasnah transfer between realms and keep all her clothing and belongings. I theorize the way teleportation works is that the body breaks down into investiture, and then moves via the spiritual realm to the location, and is reformed from investiture. The reason why the fused leaves a body that breaks down, and forms a new one, is because I believe the fused cannot use investiture in such large amounts in short bursts like radiants can. For instance the flying fused have to slowly accelerate, and cannot reach the speeds a windrunner can from adding multiple lashings in a row. That I believe results in an elsecaller and willshaper being able to teleport greater distances and objects as well as other people with them for a lot of stormlight, while fused can do short hops, more often, with less expenditure. 

[Turtle]

Ok. Good, I was both confused and scared.

[Solant]

Best TED talk ever.  

[+Oltux72]

14 hours ago, Innovation said:

The Fused use Surges, but use them differently than Radiants do.

We have little evidence of that. In particular we have no evidence comparing them operating on the same fuel.Among the things we have seen Fused do there is nothing a Radiant could not do, except for the carapace thing. Maybe not as long, but the ability is basically identical.

14 hours ago, Innovation said:

The Growth Fused can change the shape of his Carapace, and Radiant Growth cannot.

1. No Radiant ever tried to change his or her body. Whether it would work is an open question.
2. We have seen no Radiant with a carapace and being capable of using Progression

14 hours ago, Innovation said:

That is what I believe we are seeing here, with Transportation Fused unable to take item with them when they teleport.  

Well, no. He was taking nothing with him. The body was remade.

 

14 hours ago, I Am A Fish said:

Do we really want to know?

Absolutely, I do.

11 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

Now having said that, I personally disagree considering we have seen Jasnah transfer between realms and keep all her clothing and belongings.

Exactly.

11 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

I theorize the way teleportation works is that the body breaks down into investiture, and then moves via the spiritual realm to the location, and is reformed from investiture.

1. Why then is everybody transported in the form they actually were and not in a spiritually ideal form?
2. How can Transportation affect extremely invested objects?

11 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

That I believe results in an elsecaller and willshaper being able to teleport greater distances and objects as well as other people with them for a lot of stormlight, while fused can do short hops, more often, with less expenditure. 

Or we use the alternative explanation that he was using Progression or a power granted by a Form of Power.

[I Am A Fish]

6 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

Absolutely, I do.

I find your lack of propriety, disturbing....

[Pathfinder]

7 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

Exactly.

1. Why then is everybody transported in the form they actually were and not in a spiritually ideal form?

I believe for the same reason cosmeric healing does not change you to your spiritually ideal form. It is still interpreted through the cognitive. 

7 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

1. How can Transportation affect extremely invested objects?

We know soulcasting can push through an objects innate investiture to still transform the object. So I believe the same would stand for transportation. Though that may not be an issue at all, because you are not trying to destroy the investiture, or even change it fundamentally. You are just temporarily changing its state. That would still require energy to accomplish, but I see it as changing water from solid, to liquid to transport, and then back to solid. Actually that may be a fair illustration of what I envision.

Have two containers with a tube connecting them. A block of ice is in one, the other is empty. The block of ice is melted to water, and drained through the tube to the other container. The other container is then frozen, resulting in a block of ice. You transferred the block of ice from one container to the other. You did not change the nature of the water. You just changed its state. That is a rough approximation of how I see transportation. Ice is the object physically. The tube is the spiritual realm. Liquid is when the object is broken down into pure investiture, since everything is made of investiture and investiture is the fourth state in the cosmere. It transfers via the tube/spiritual realm to the new location, and then is restored to its former form/ice. 

[Pcheinze]

I feel like she would just summon shardplate when she teleports. Interesting idea but I feel like shardplate is a major difference(also how would you make her hair into that...)

[+Oltux72]

9 minutes ago, Pcheinze said:

I feel like she would just summon shardplate when she teleports. Interesting idea but I feel like shardplate is a major difference(also how would you make her hair into that...)

We have seen her either teleport or return from Shadesmar. Alas, she was not nude, nor in Plate.

[I Am A Fish]

37 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

We have seen her either teleport or return from Shadesmar. Alas, she was not nude, nor in Plate.

Well yeah,

But that's inter-realm transportation, not the normal surge.

[+Oltux72]

22 minutes ago, I Am A Fish said:

But that's inter-realm transportation, not the normal surge.

1. Technically we cannot know that she returned there, as opposed to a normal teleport
2. Do you really want to propose that Transportation does two completely different things based on how you use it
3. And do you really want to propose that the oath gates, which you can use to transfer to Shadesmar, really do something else again, but only in one of their modes?

[earthexile]

Elsecallers also have Transformation, which could be a big part of how this all works. Like in the Wheel of Time books, the magic users describe one way of connecting distant places as "making them so similar that they temporarily become the same place" or something along those lines. Maybe your location in the Physical is something you can Transform in the Cognitive. 

[+Oltux72]

2 hours ago, earthexile said:

Elsecallers also have Transformation, which could be a big part of how this all works.

Not really, because Willshapers have Transportation, too, and they use it to go to remote places to fortify.

[I Am A Fish]

22 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

1. Do you really want to propose that Transportation does two completely different things based on how you use it
2. And do you really want to propose that the oath gates, which you can use to transfer to Shadesmar, really do something else again, but only in one of their modes?

Yes. Yes I do.