Dizzy he/him Posted January 6, 2019 Report Share Posted January 6, 2019 Ok, so from a WOB a while back, it was said that Allomancy was powered by the pattern of the molecular structure of the metals, similar to the patterns that Elantrians must draw to access the Dor. This begs the question... would an Elantrian on Scadrial b able to draw the molecular pattern of... let’s say iron... and have access to the metallic arts? The whole “location based” aspect of the Magic really confuses me so there may be something I’m not understanding. This is a question I’ve had for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSuperLee he/him Posted January 6, 2019 Report Share Posted January 6, 2019 The metalic arts draw power directly from Ruin and Preservation. If an Elantrian had some way to access that power, perhaps they could. But, normally, an Elantrian's power is derived from the Dor, which only exists around Sel and has no connection to the metalic arts. In other words, it's hypothetically possible, but would require lots of work to make it possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy he/him Posted January 6, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2019 28 minutes ago, HSuperLee said: The metalic arts draw power directly from Ruin and Preservation. If an Elantrian had some way to access that power, perhaps they could. But, normally, an Elantrian's power is derived from the Dor, which only exists around Sel and has no connection to the metalic arts. In other words, it's hypothetically possible, but would require lots of work to make it possible. Ok... I was thinking that Connection to Ruin/Preservation are what allows Scadrians to actually burn the metals, willing investiture through the molecular structure, and someone who could already access investiture, albeit from another planet and shard(s), could just automatically access the investiture from another if it knew the "key." At least I thought that that'd explain things like Nalthian worldhoppers wanting to go to Roshar to get Breaths easier and whatnot. I think my understanding is lacking less about the location-based aspects and more about the whole Connection system of the Cosmere. I guess it is time to do more research! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShara she/her Posted January 6, 2019 Report Share Posted January 6, 2019 The metals are a key, but the ability to use them is genetic. A person from Sel wouldn't have the genetic component that lets them access metals, unless they managed to get their hands on some lerasium. In which case they'd be drawing on Preservation, anyway. The Dor, unlike most cosmere magics, is region dependent, and so it wouldn't work off-world without some interesting shenanigans. Now, if an Elantrian was also an Allomancer or Feruchemist, it's entirely possible for them to "hack" the system, and get Preservation to power their Aons. But we have no idea how or how difficult this would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy he/him Posted January 6, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2019 7 minutes ago, RShara said: The metals are a key, but the ability to use them is genetic. A person from Sel wouldn't have the genetic component that lets them access metals, unless they managed to get their hands on some lerasium. In which case they'd be drawing on Preservation, anyway. The Dor, unlike most cosmere magics, is region dependent, and so it wouldn't work off-world without some interesting shenanigans. Now, if an Elantrian was also an Allomancer or Feruchemist, it's entirely possible for them to "hack" the system, and get Preservation to power their Aons. But we have no idea how or how difficult this would be. This makes a bit more sense to me now. I noticed the Brandon stressed that Elantrian and Scadrian magics were both similar and thought it was somehow relevant beyond just standard mechanics. Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scion of the Mists Posted January 7, 2019 Report Share Posted January 7, 2019 On 1/6/2019 at 2:09 AM, Dizzy said: This makes a bit more sense to me now. I noticed the Brandon stressed that Elantrian and Scadrian magics were both similar and thought it was somehow relevant beyond just standard mechanics. Thank you! They're similar in that they're both drawing power from a large reservoir of Investiture. On Scadrial, it's from Preservation in the Spiritual Realm. On Sel, it's from the Dor (i.e. Dominion/Devotion) in the Cognitive Realm. The Dor being in the Cognitive Realm is unique in the Cosmere and why Selish magic is so localized (and wouldn't work on other planets without serious hacking). This is in contrast to magic systems like Awakening and Surgebinding, which are fueled by small, discrete chunks of Investiture that you have to collect ahead of time (Breath and Stormlight). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TequilaJack Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) On 1/6/2019 at 1:58 AM, RShara said: The metals are a key, but the ability to use them is genetic. A person from Sel wouldn't have the genetic component that lets them access metals, unless they managed to get their hands on some lerasium. In which case they'd be drawing on Preservation, anyway. The Dor, unlike most cosmere magics, is region dependent, and so it wouldn't work off-world without some interesting shenanigans. Now, if an Elantrian was also an Allomancer or Feruchemist, it's entirely possible for them to "hack" the system, and get Preservation to power their Aons. But we have no idea how or how difficult this would be. The Spiritual Realm is common across worlds, right? For example in Hemalurgy a spike is invested with part of spiritweb (I assume this has something to do with spiritual realm) and this is then inserted into a person's body in physical realm. So in theory you can invest a spike with Dor or even Stormlight and put that in a person to give him that ability. A Spren is Rosharan equivalent to a Scadrial spike. It randomly occurs in Sel. Almost all powers are part of Dominion, so there must be a underlying thread tying all together and it probably lies within the Spiritual Realm, manifested in Cognitive and used in Physical. Edited January 9, 2019 by TequilaJack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShara she/her Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, TequilaJack said: The Spiritual Realm is common across worlds, right? For example in Hemalurgy a spike is invested with part of spiritweb (I assume this has something to do with spiritual realm) ans this is then inserted into a person's body in physical realm. So in theory you can invest a spike with d'Or or even Stormlight and put that in a person to give him that ability. A Spren is Rosharan equivalent to a Scadrial spike. Investing a piece of metal with the Dor or Stormlight isn't creating a Hemalurgic spike, though. Creating a spike requires shoving it through a living entity (likely killing it) and ripping away part of its spiritweb. Then stapling that chunk of spiritweb to another entity. A spiritweb is a pretty distinct chunk of investiture--not just any investiture will do, but the innate, intimate portion of investiture that sometimes is called a soul. A spren is another living piece of investiture. It exists without having to kill another entity. And it can voluntarily meld itself with a human, granting them Radiant abilities. Comparing them to a Hemalurgic spike is like comparing a blood transfusion to a firing squad. Almost all powers are part of Dominion, so there must be a underlying thread tying all together and it probably lies within the Spiritual Realm, manifested in Cognitive and used in Physical. I'm not sure what you mean by that? Dominion and Devotion mixed together are what form the Dor, which is limited to Sel, because the Dor is crammed into the Cognitive Realm, rather than the Spiritual. Edited January 9, 2019 by RShara 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TequilaJack Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 1 minute ago, RShara said: Investing a piece of metal with the Dor or Stormlight isn't creating a Hemalurgic spike, though. Creating a spike requires shoving it through a living entity (likely killing it) and ripping away part of its spiritweb. Then stapling that chunk of spiritweb to another entity. A spiritweb is a pretty distinct chunk of investiture--not just any investiture will do, but the innate, intimate portion of investiture that sometimes is called a soul. I take Spiritweb as the thing which grants or determines Investiture and not a Investiture in itself. It can in theory grant any Investiture if manipulated and used properly. In theory, assume you kill a person who can use Stormlight and create a spike and then use it on a person in different planet. Worldhoppers retain their abilities we can see from Hoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShara she/her Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) A Hemalurgic spike doesn't grant investiture, it grants the ability to use investiture. A Hemalurgic spike doesn't grant Stormlight, but the ability to use Stormlight. It's a fine, but critical distinction. Whether the spiritweb is made of investiture or not, we don't have a clear answer for, but it makes sense to me, since everything in the Spiritual Realm is made of investiture. Yes, if you spike a person who can use Stormlight, you would be able to transfer that ability to someone else (of course, the spren could decide to break the bond and you're back where you started, but that's beside the point). Even so, I'm not sure how this is relevant to the point? Edited January 9, 2019 by RShara 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts