on the lam Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 Hey all, I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, so if it has, someone point me to the thread. In any case I finished reading Oathbringer (again, for the 5th(?) time), and some things have been bothering me. In chapter 119 "Unity", Dalinar is counting off the Knights Radiant that have assembled in Thaylen City: Kalladin: Windrunner Shallan: Lightweaver Renarin: Truthwather Lift: Edgedancer Dalinar: Bondsmith Szeth: Skybreaker Jasnah: Elsecaller So then the text says: Quote ...That was seven. He would have expected three more. There, the Stormfather said. Behind your niece. Two more people appeared in the shadow of the wall. A large, powerful man with an impressive physique, and a woman with long, dark hair. Their dark skin marked them as Makabaki, perhaps Azish, but their eyes were wrong. That last part referring to Talenel and Shalash. I assume that Dalinar is expecting a representative from each order of Knight Radiant, ten in all. Here’s what's bothering me: Dalinar’s sudden and miraculous knowledge of Szeth’s, Taln's and Shalash's status as KR and associated order. Just, how? (Also, though unrelated, Dalinar has no reaction that the man who killed Gavilar, and who did his darnedest to kill Dalinar himself, and who is supposed to be dead just shows up? He just takes it in stride?) Dalinar’s expectation that all orders of KR should be present. Why in the world would he have this expectation? I don’t remember anything foreshadowing this. Dalinar seems to count Shalash from an order other than Lightweaver, since he says “Those two only make nine”. Talenel does make eight as Stoneward, but isn’t Shalash the patron saint of Lightweavers (see the Coppermind page on Shallash)? She would be a duplicate Lightweaver along with Shallan, making Dalinar’s statement of having nine incorrect. If we are to assume that Dalinar is right and that the missing tenth KR is Venli as Willshaper (can’t remember if that was confirmed or not, though Timbre doesn’t seem like she’s Ashspren), then Shalash would have to represent Dustbringer. TL;DR How does one explain Dalinar’s insta-knowledge of Szeth’s, Taln’s, and Shalash’s order of KR and the KR order representation discrepancy?
Scion of the Mists Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 Dalinar may have recognized Taln as the man who claimed to be a Herald. And then just assumed that the woman next to him would be from a new order (it's commonly thought that Ash, in her present "destroy art" state, will become a Dustbringer). As for Szeth, Dalinar may have seen his Gravitation abilities during the battle (can't remember), but definitely not Division. Venli is definitely a Willshaper.
Toaster Retribution he/him Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 There are a ton of wierd things regarding Dalinar in that scene which we dont understand yet. It will probably become more clear in the next book.
Kon-Tiki he/him Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 It certainly helps that he'd just received a direct injection of Spiritual Realm. Probably a lot of things made sense to him in that moment for reasons he probably didn't think too much about. 1
Kidpen he/him Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 Wait, since when is Taln even a member of his own order?
RShara she/her Posted December 21, 2018 Posted December 21, 2018 (edited) Dalinar was Ascended during that period, so it's reasonable that he gained some knowledge and a sense of who is/will be in what Order. The Spiritual Realm is time-independent, so recognizing people who are likely to be Radiants in the future should be something that he could do. Edited December 21, 2018 by RShara 1
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