Jezrien Stormfather confusion (possible spoiler alert)

[Pathfinder]

Ok, so I understand that Jezrien is the King figure of the 10 Heralds. I also understand that he was the Herald that founded the windrunners, and he hates the radiants now because of all the spren that were killed. What I don't understand is that Jezrien is the Stormfather. It doesn't make sense to me. 

 

First: Why would the FOUNDER of the windrunners bond with bondsmith?

 

Second: Does this mean Heralds are spren too? So does that then mean they all can potentially bond?

 

Third: I thought certain spren tended to bond with certain orders, such as honorspren to windrunners, cryptics to lightweavers and so on. If Jezrien being the Stormfather means he is a spren, then what kind of spren is he that he is bonding with a bondsmith?

 

Any help or insight would be appreciated because this feels contradictory to me, and I am hoping I am just missing something. Btw, I am new on these boards, so if this is located in the wrong thread, or has been discussed before, I apologize and would appreciate any instruction/advice in navigating this forum for a newb. Thanks!

[Awesomeness Summoned he/him]

First off, welcome to the forum!

Where are you getting that Jezrian hates the Radiants? If it's because the storm father has a dislike for the Radiants and their broken oaths, see the next point below.

All indications are that the storm father is not Jezrian but in fact the largest portion of Honor's power that formed sentience of its own after Honor was splintered by Odium. The relationship between Jezrian and the storm father is something that likely developed over millennia of mythology since Jezrian was the head of the windrunners and thus The Lord of Storms

Spren are essentially just pieces of adonalsium's power that have gained a purpose, and in some instances actual sentience. So, the storm father is a spren, just a very powerful one. The excerpts about the Bondsmiths indicate the spren they bond are unique and that there are only a small number of Bondsmiths. They either all bonded the storm father or they each bonded very powerful spren like the storm father and Cusiceth

Edited April 11, 2014 by Awesomeness Summoned

[Argent he/him]

Still, it is odd that the Alethi use both Jezrien and Stormfather to refer to the face in the highstorms - weird enough for me to not write off immediately as "it's just a cultural quirk."

[Pathfinder]

@awesomeness summoned Thank you for the great welcome! As I said in the earlier post, if there are any pointers, or decorum (such as including my notation about spoilers, which I only thought to include because of one other thread I saw had one as well) please feel free. The information would be greatly appreciated. 

 

Yep, that is where I got the idea that Jezrian hates the Radiants.

 

On the stormlight wiki, it mentions that Jezrian is the Stormfather, and I did see one or two posts in this forum that referred to him as such. That is why I felt so confused because so many points in the book seemed to contradict that for me. I have been on these forums all of a week or two, so I was wondering if I missed something. Thank you very much for clearing that up for me! 

 

@likes to italicize good point, and that would explain where the thought on the two being the same was coming from for me online/in the forum. 

Edited April 11, 2014 by P4thf1nd3r

[WeiryWriter he/him]

Jezrien is not actually the Stormfather, but modern Vorins don't know what we know and have combined the two in their mythology.  It's similar to how people think that the Sword in the Stone is Excalibur when they are actually different swords.

 

It is just a quirk of 4,000 years of history, very little of what they "know" is actually correct.

[Awesomeness Summoned he/him]

Still, it is odd that the Alethi use both Jezrien and Stormfather to refer to the face in the highstorms - weird enough for me to not write off immediately as "it's just a cultural quirk."

The way I imagine it, Jezrian was known as the stormfather prior to the breaking of the oathpact. After Jezrian disappeared and a giant face started showing up in the highstorms, they naturally transferred the name.

[Awesomeness Summoned he/him]

As I said in the earlier post, if there are any pointers, or decorum (such as including my notation about spoilers, which I only thought to include because of one other thread I saw had one as well) please feel free. The information would be greatly appreciated.

If you haven't checked out the site rules yet, it should answer most of those questions.

http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6-welcome-to-17th-shard/?p=12693

[kaellok he/him]

Well, you could take it from the Stormfather's mouth:

 

"'The Stormfather,' Dalinar said.  'Are you a Herald?'

NO.

'Then are you a spren or a god?'

BOTH

 

We've seen the Stormfather be wrong before, so this isn't necessarily the final word, but I think that exploring whether Jezrien is the drunk at the party in the Prologue of WoK would be more fruitful at this point.

[Pathfinder]

@awesomeness summoned, Thanks for the link! Read and bookmarked . 

 

@weirywriter, The theory that the distinction got blurred over the years sounds about right to me, and seems to align with Sanderson's past works (i.e. Mistborn). 

 

@kaellok, Touche lolol

[SmurfAquamarineBodies he/him]

Why do people assume that Bondsmiths Bond with the Stormfather? I thought he only appeared after Honor died. Because if that's the case then he isn't as old as the Knights Radiant. Or am i missing something, is the Stormfather as old as the Knights?

[Awesomeness Summoned he/him]

(Spoilers ahead for WoR)

The idea for Bondsmiths bonding with the stormfather comes mainly from the excerpt in WoR:

“But as for the Bondsmiths, they had members only three... Their spren was understood to be specific, and to persuade them to grow to the magnitude of the other orders was seen as seditious.”

That statement implies that there was something different about the spren they bond and it's been theorized based on the fact that Dalinar bonded the stormfather that they either all bond a single powerful spren together or they each bond one of the rare large spren an Roshar such as Cusiceth, Nightwatcher, and the stormfather.

You are right, the stormfather probably should have arisen after the KR were founded so it is more likely they bonded the large rare spren in general rather than all bonding the stormfather specifically.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Awesomeness Summoned

[Pathfinder]

Well that leads to another inquiry. My impression when Kaladin was first bonded was certain TYPES of spren bond with certain TYPES of radiants. So honor spren bond with windrunners. I assumed this meant that they didn't bond with any other radiants. Syl stated she was the Stormfather's daughter, and Lift's spren (sorry i forget his name), implied in my mind he was the child of the Nightwatcher. So I assumed they were of the same class, i.e Stormfather and Syl are one class, Lift's spren and Nightwatcher are another and thereby exclusive to the class of radiants they bond to. Dalinar bonding with Stormfather kind of threw that right out the window. I am guessing then when they state they are the child of this spren or that spren, It is like slightly what someone mentioned above (sorry typing this quick, so don't have time to make a specific reference), where they are referred to as children, because they are further split slivers, while the Stormfather and Nightwatcher are either bigger slivers, or multiple slivers combined. Does that make sense? Sanderson's magic systems tend to be very organized and rule bricked, so the idea that any radiant can bond with any spren doesn't feel right. I also have a theory that anger spren, pain spren, etc will end up being what bonds with voidbringers other forms. Would be cool to see how they manifest in the other forms

Edited April 15, 2014 by P4thf1nd3r