Parshendi-Human Relationship

[SilverTiger she/her]

Okay, so I have an interest in biology and evolution, and I like learning about life on Roshar because of it. However, I was going over some stuff and realized, humans and Listeners must share a recent common ancestor on the evolutionary family tree. My reasoning:

1) The first, and most obvious, is that they have a very similar body structure. Oh, there are some differences, but both are bipedal, with two legs directly below the torso, two arms, and a head, all in the same place and with the same general outline.

The problem with this is that it could just be parallel evolution, like with felines and nimravids (an extinct group of carnivores which look very much like saber-toothed cats). But there is some more evidence, though its more hard science.

2) Hybridization. This is a key factor. In order for two species to have hybrid offspring (horse+donkey=mule), they must be related to a certain degree (I think they must be in the same family or order, but would need to reread my bio notes to be sure). Hence, a horse and cow will not have offspring with each other. A horse will only hybridize with another species of equine. Therefore, humans can only hybridize with another hominid. Which means that Listeners must be a species of hominid, because both Horneaters and Herdazians are known to have Listeners ancestry.

3) Even more than this, two species must have the same number of chromosomes in order to have fertile offspring. Horse and donkeys have different numbers of chromosomes, which is why mules are sterile. Animals with the same number of chromosomes typically share a genus. For instance, house cats have the same number of chromosomes as several other species of small cats, which is where we get the ocicat breed, among others. Therefore, Listeners likely share the same genus as humans since they have had fertile hybrids in the past (again, Horneaters and Herdazians).

Conclusion: humans and Listeners very closely related, since they have fertile hybrids with each other. I suspect, depending on the amount of time available, that either Adonalsium itself or the natural Investiture/spren caused a kind of accelerated evolution that turned the humans into Listeners. Moreover, I propose the scientific name Homo audiere for Listeners.

Edited December 5, 2017 by SilverTiger
Added scientific name, changed parshendi to listener.

[The One Who Connects he/him]

1 hour ago, SilverTiger said:

humans and parshendi must share a recent common ancestor on the evolutionary family tree.

They don't actually.

Quote

HorseCannon
I didn't realize horneaters had parshmen blood, didn't even realize that was possible. How closely are humans and parshmen related, do they have a common ancestor? Or is one an artificially created version of the other?

Brandon Sanderson
There was intermixing long ago. Horneaters and Herdazians are both a result. (Signs of this are the stone carapace on Herdazian fingernails and the Horneater extra jaw pieces--in the back of the mouth--for breaking shells.)

Humans and parshmen don't have a common ancestor. And as a side note, both of these strains of humanoids predate the ascension of Honor, Cultivation, and Odium.

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1 hour ago, SilverTiger said:

1) The first, and most obvious, is that they have a very similar body structure. Oh, there are some differences, but both are bipedal, with two legs directly below the torso, two arms, and a head, all in the same place and with the same general outline.

From the WoB I posted above, the strain of humans and Parshendi that currently populate Roshar both predate the Shards, so odds are they could've been created by Adonalsium. (Fairly certain we know the Parshendi were, since Adonalsium made Roshar too. R&P used Yolish Humans as the template on Scadrial, so why not have Adonalsium do it too?)

Being made by the same creator/being patterned off the same template could explain the physical similarities between them. Could also explain the reproductive viability, if Adonalsium didn't make too many changes when he created the Parshendi.

As for points 2 and 3, Parshendi break some of the natural rules via Spren Bonds. They physically change from a neuter gender to a proper male/female gender when entering Mateform. They grow carapace armor when entering Warform. Thinner facial structure and swirling skin patterns in Nimbleform, etc.. there's gonna be a little suspension of disbelief going on eventually.

[SilverTiger she/her]

The problem is, it seems like an awfully big breach of science for Brandon to make, especially since he's tried to stick very close to scientific laws so far.

[Wandering Investor]

On 11/28/2017 at 3:13 PM, The One Who Connects said:

R&P used Yolish Humans as the template on Scadrial, so why not have Adonalsium do it too?)

Scadrial didn't exist before Ruin and Preservation made it. The humans there were based on the Yolen template by the Shards as well.

Nevermind! I read RIP, you said R&P. Adonalsium making the parsh as an alternate design to humans seems likely considering the similarity and lack of common ancestor.

Edited December 5, 2017 by Wandering Investor

[The One Who Connects he/him]

3 minutes ago, Wandering Investor said:

Scadrial didn't exist before Ruin and Preservation made it. The humans there were based on the Yolen template by the Shards as well.

I thought that was what I said. What did it look like I was saying? Edit:

3 minutes ago, Wandering Investor said:

Nevermind! I read RIP, you said R&P

Genuinely surprised this hasn't happened before. No worries.

Edited December 5, 2017 by The One Who Connects

[Wandering Investor]

@The One Who ConnectsI misread, fixed it.

[SilverTiger she/her]

If Listeners evolved from humans, then it may not count as having a common ancestor, hmm?

[Wandering Investor]

I would consider evolving from as being a common ancestor. The only way that would work is if Adonalisium created two different strains of "human" and they never mixed.