kaellok he/him Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 I feel like the grammar of the topic title is wrong, but it's 2am and I'm having troubles fixing it. Anyway. Basically what it says: do we know if the science behind fabrials is actually voidbinding? Anyone know of WoB that specifically differentiates between the two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern he/him Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 (edited) I don't have WoBs at hand - and I am really bad at finding them. Fabrials we have seen so far seem to use "normal" spren, that is spren of Honor, Cultivation or perhaps Adonalsium. The gemstones of the fabrial seem to capture the spren and make use of its Investiture somehow. This would not be voidbinding. However, I don't see a reason why it should not be possible to capture voidspren (spren of Odium) too. Spoilers Oathbringer, WoR: Spoiler It looks like Parshendi capture spren in their gemhearts to assume their forms (see reading and transcription of the prologue of Oathbringer). While the rediscovered forms like warform, workform, artform (research corrupted, Venli was looking for stormform instead), mateform and dullform let the Parshendi keep their free will and probably are given by spren of Cultivation or Adonalsium (there is a WoB that the Parshendi are not of Honor), stormform - and all other forms of Power - are assumed by capturing a voidspren. So voidspren can be captured in gemhearts, therefore they should also be able to be caught in gemstones. In conclusion, fabrials using voidbinding seem to be possible for me. Edited July 25, 2017 by Pattern Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Extesian he/him Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 Brandon separates them as different systems Quote QUESTION How many magic systems are in The Stormlight Archive, and how many of them [have been seen?] BRANDON SANDERSON I would see the only major one you haven’t seen is Voidbinding, it depends on how you count them. I count fabrials as one, Surgebinding as one, and Voidbinding as one. And then the Old Magic is kind of its own weird thing. As to whether there can be overlap, fabrials that voidbind, or Odium influencing something other than voidbinding, there's interesting wording in this WoB Quote Q: Shards. Are the ten orders of the Knight Radiants related to specific gods? Because Honor, child of Honor-Kaladin B: So all the magic on Roshar, all the surgebinding on Roshar, is going to have its roots in Honor and Cultivation. Um... There is some Odium influence too, but that’s mostly voidbinding, which is the map in the back of the first book. Note that he says "mostly"... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pattern he/him Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Extesian said: Note that he says "mostly"... On Roshar there are also spren of Adonalsium, which by definition would also contain some Odium, since Odium is a shard of Adonalsium. Taking Honor, Cultivation and Adonalsium quark spren, it would be possible to build a baryonic spren decuplet, each spren representing one of the ten orders of the KR. These would be |hhh>, |hhc>, |hcc>, |ccc>, |Honorspren>, |Highspren>, |Dustbringerspren>, |Cultivationspren> |hha>, |hca>, |cca>, |Truthwatcherspren>, |Cryptic>, |Inkspren> |haa>,|caa>, |Willshaperspren>, |Stonewardenspren> |aaa> |Godspren of Bondsmiths> I have written the combinations in Dirac bracket notation. For information, in particle physics the baryonic decuplet consists of quarks all with spin up, resulting to a total angular momentum J=3/2 (nucleons are part of the baryonic octet with J=1/2). The detailed spin-flavour part of the wave function still would have to be symmetrized in regard to particle exchange, so for example |uud>=1/sqrt(3) [|uud>+|udu>+|duu>]. The problem with this notion is that Adonalsium spren would have as much influence in surgebinding as Honorspren and Cultivationspren have. Until now we haven't seen them at all, so this is probably not how it works ;-( Edited July 25, 2017 by Pattern 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaellok he/him Posted July 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 Thanks guys! almost complete with my latest re read, and was seeing things that could have implied that the two were the same. the WoB saying I'm wrong is pretty solid tho, haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostlander Posted July 26, 2017 Report Share Posted July 26, 2017 I'm pretty suspicious of modern fabrials, as they trap "living ideas," forcing them into a sort of bondage on a planet where mutual, symbiotic bonds are really important to "our heroes." I doubt that the books would drop scientific advances into the story only to trash science and use it as a foil for "real magic." That said, it would be surprising if the books didn't explore the compromises people make in exchange for scientific progress. I can see this playing out in several different ways, though I'm not sure if we'll be worried about windspren or about taking the tech to its logical conclusion with more aware spren. Now I'm off to see how many scenes feature modern fabrials and Syl or Pattern... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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