Theories/Wild Speculation on Stormlight Archives Structure

[Ammanas]

So Brandon has stated that Stormlight Archives will be 10 books total or two sequences of five.

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=675#8

We can gather that book five will have a ending, of a sorts, that will satisfy readers until he gets started on the next set. So does that mean it will close on one desolation and the next set will be another desolation? Or will the voidbringers merely be contained for a period of time (like in Wheel of Time where it eventually breaks down seals). Does the next set of books take place 20-30 years later and is about the next generation? Obviously we cannot know these things (unless I am missing some important words of Brandon somewhere) but it may be fun to bounce ideas around.

[Calderis he/him]

Don't know the cause of the gap. But there is supposed to be a 10-15 year gap between the two halves. If someone doesn't beat me to it, I'll edit in a WoB. 

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=1097#7

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BRANDON SANDERSON (PARAPHRASED)

There's also going to be about a 15 year gap in-world between The Stormlight Archive arc 1 and arc 2.

TAGS

stormlight archive

 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Calderis

[Kered he/him]

I always saw the first arc ending with the new KR beating Odium's champion. Then with a pause to prepare or maybe they thought they won, the next five books will be the KR fighting Odium himself. Beating the champion casted off Odiums influence on Roshar, but Kaladin, Dalinar and the others weren't satisfied with that and want to finish Odium for good. This is just a blind prediction. Don't really have any evidence to support it other than the possible foreshadowing of Tanavast telling Dalinar about the champions thing in Dalinar's final vision. 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Kered

[Jonathon]

I don't know how to find the exact WOB but there's one that states that odium is alive after the end of the first arc, but isn't strictly worded so as to leave open the possibility that he may or may not have a different vessel

[Calderis he/him]

@Jonathon It's in Pagerunners Collected Reddit WoBs #145

 

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Q: RAFOed I'm sure, but you said you are planing 2 arcs of 5 books each in Stormlight Archive. Having read all of your published works (and some unpublished:)) I know your storytelling pace is astronomicaly quick. I'm positive you will end current desolation story in the first 5 books, since as I understod, other 5 books will be set in near future in SA universe. So I guess my question is; can you drop any hint will Odium survive to see 6th SA book:)?
 
A: Oh, Odium will survive. Now, whether the one HOLDING that power will survive...that's a different question. (Not quite a RAFO.)
 

 

[Kered he/him]

2 minutes ago, Calderis said:

@Jonathon It's in Pagerunners Collected Reddit WoBs #145

 

 

Ya beat me to it. I, being a foolish mortal, tried to find it on TL instead of the collected WoB's. 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Kered

[Calderis he/him]

@Kered I did a search through all instances of the word "Odium" for another thread about an hour ago, so I already knew where to look. 

It definitely gets easier the more you do it. 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Calderis

[Jonathon]

 

13 minutes ago, Calderis said:

@Jonathon It's in Pagerunners Collected Reddit WoBs #145

 

 

Thanks Calderis! 

[Kered he/him]

12 minutes ago, Calderis said:

@Kered I did a search through all instances of the word "Odium" for another thread about an hour ago, so I already knew where to look. 

It definitely gets easier the more you do it. 

The day I post a WoB before you or Extesian is the day I quit the internet. 

 

But going back to the what second arc will be, thanks to the WoB, it opens up a cool concept. Instead of the champion being beaten, it could be Rayse himself that gets beat. Then upon his death Rayse tricks whomever beat him into picking up Odium. As put in the letter, Odium is more of a force than individual, so its feasible that instead of trying to survive himself, Rayse just makes sure Odium will continue on. And with Odium tricking the person who killed Rayse into picking up the shard(Kaladin would be an example) this could fulfill the part on the WoK dust cover about "One betraying". 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Kered

[Calderis he/him]

11 minutes ago, Kered said:

The day I post a WoB before you or Extesian is the day I quit the internet.

I've got nothing on @Extesian. He consistently pulls WoBs I've never seen that makes me rethink my understanding of things.

To your post... I don't know. I feel like the wording is Brandon being tricky on purpose. If Rayse dies, I feel like he's the type who try to splinter the Shard on purpose in a "if I can't have it no one can" type of deal. 

I don't doubt that if Rayse dies someone else will take up the Shard, and that could very well be worse. Who it could be at the moment though? I think the most hate driven character we've seen is Moash. 

Guess we'll just have to RAFO. 

Edit: or, to bring up a character I typically forget about, Venli. She obviously knew more about the Everstorm than she should have been able to, and stormform didn't seem to have changed her...

Edited July 9, 2017 by Calderis

[Kered he/him]

6 minutes ago, Calderis said:

I've got nothing on @Extesian. He consistently pulls WoBs I've never seen that makes me rethink my understanding of things.

To your post... I don't know. I feel like the wording is Brandon being tricky on purpose. If Rayse dies, I feel like he's the type who try to splinter the Shard on purpose in a "if I can't have it no one can" type of deal. 

I don't doubt that if Rayse dies someone else will take up the Shard, and that could very well be worse. Who it could be at the moment though? I think the most hate driven character we've seen is Moash. 

Guess we'll just have to RAFO. 

I never thought of the "if i can't have it no one can" bit before. That sounds more like someone how's spent millennia consumed by hatred than what I said. I personally don't think it's going to happen, but I think it would be awesome if a "good" character ever picked up Odium. It would be the opposite of a redemption story. A morally grounded character being slowly corrupted by the most hate filled thing in the cosmere. Would be especially interesting if Kaladin picked it up, as he already has been destroyed and built back up. It would happen all over again. Plus I could see Kaladin picking up Odium in order to save one of his friends from that fate. Would make for some epic reading. But, like ya said, it's all speculation at this point,  

Edited July 9, 2017 by Kered

[Ammanas]

56 minutes ago, Kered said:

 but I think it would be awesome if a "good" character ever picked up Odium. It would be the opposite of a redemption story. A morally grounded character being slowly corrupted by the most hate filled thing in the cosmere. Would be especially interesting if Kaladin picked it up, as he already has been destroyed and built back up. It would happen all over again. Plus I could see Kaladin picking up Odium in order to save one of his friends from that fate. Would make for some epic reading. But, like ya said, it's all speculation at this point,  

It reminds me of (Dresden Files Spoiler)

Spoiler

Harry Dresden taking up the Winter Knight title in order to save his daughter. 

 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Ammanas

[Calderis he/him]

10 minutes ago, Ammanas said:

It reminds me of (Dresden Files Spoiler)

  Reveal hidden contents

Harry Dresden taking up the Winter Knight title in order to save his daughter. 

 

Off topic, he needs to finish Peace Talks

[Ammanas]

Just now, Calderis said:

Off topic, he needs to finish Peace Talks

Definitely but I am willing to cut him some slack; some not all. His life has been in turmoil for the year or so, but it now looks like things are settling down that he can finish it. He has gotten a divorce, dog died, and building a new house with the contractor coming up with several delays. 

[IntentAwesome]

2 hours ago, Kered said:

I always saw the first arc ending with the new KR beating Odium's champion. Then with a pause to prepare or maybe they thought they won, the next five books will be the KR fighting Odium himself. Beating the champion casted off Odiums influence on Roshar, but Kaladin, Dalinar and the others weren't satisfied with that and want to finish Odium for good. This is just a blind prediction. Don't really have any evidence to support it other than the possible foreshadowing of Tanavast telling Dalinar about the champions thing in Dalinar's final vision. 

I always pictured the first half having a tragic ending, with whoever is picked as Honor's champion actually losing the duel. Then the next arc would open up with them having to figure out some other way to defeat odium. Seems to me like a tragic ending is really the only way to carry momentum into another arc. And it would be perfectly ironic for Kaladin to be the champion and for him to fail when it actually does mean everything. Though I hope not as I actually really don't want to Kaladin to die.  

[Calderis he/him]

21 minutes ago, IntentAwesome said:

I always pictured the first half having a tragic ending, with whoever is picked as Honor's champion actually losing the duel. Then the next arc would open up with them having to figure out some other way to defeat odium. Seems to me like a tragic ending is really the only way to carry momentum into another arc. And it would be perfectly ironic for Kaladin to be the champion and for him to fail when it actually does mean everything. Though I hope not as I actually really don't want to Kaladin to die.  

I don't think it's going to be a duel. I just went off on this in another thread earlier so I'll just quote what I said there. 

7 hours ago, Calderis said:

Once "champions" are brought in, I don't think it's going to be some formalized battle or duel. 

HoA spoilers 

  Reveal hidden contents

After Vin had ascended, the clash between Elend and Marsh is a perfect example of meeting of champions.

There were no rules, no predetermined test, but they were clearly marked by the battling shards. And in that example Vin/Preservation won, despite Her champions death. 

So I don't think there's going to be a predetermined perfect showdown between the Shards champions. 

I think the entire purpose of getting him to appoint a champion is to get him to invest into something/one in order to weaken him. 

And in this case unless Cultivation becomes more directly involved, it can't be a formalized duel between Shard appointed champions as there is no Shard of Honor to empower a champion. 

So the champion will be a gambit to force Odium to take a more direct role at a cost, but it isn't going to be an arena with spectators watching on the edge of their seats. It will be a chance to get him directly involved so that he can actually lose something. 

 

[+Extesian he/him]

2 hours ago, Calderis said:

I don't think it's going to be a duel. I just went off on this in another thread earlier so I'll just quote what I said there. 

 

I agree with much of this but I don't believe it's just about getting him to invest more, I think Tanavast's words indicate it's about binding himself realmatically.

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“I wish I could do more,” repeated the figure in gold. “You might be able to get him to choose a champion. He is bound by some rules. All of us are. A champion could work well for you, but it is not certain. And … without the Dawnshards … Well, I have done what I can. It is a terrible, terrible thing to leave you alone.”

It may not be a single designated battle but I believe it's about Odium feeling impotent and being offered the chance to be released in exchange for agreeing to be bounded by the Champion rules, and that he can be bound to that promise (either because of the nature is Shards generally, or of Honor, or of Roshar). 

[The One Who Connects he/him]

15 hours ago, Ammanas said:

We can gather that book five will have a ending, of a sorts, that will satisfy readers until he gets started on the next set. So does that mean it will close on one desolation and the next set will be another desolation?

We don't know what it is yet, but there is a throughput line connecting the halves of the story.

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Link389

With Stormlight being in your mind 2 five book arcs, is there still a single "through-line" so to speak (aka, the Everstorm, A clash with Odium, or the like).

Brandon Sanderson

Yes

 

[galendo]

My thoughts are that the first arc will end in a sort of "bittersweet tragedy" or something like that.  For instance, maybe Roshar is wrecked but the KR and/or Mr. T. manage to keep some people alive and Odium still bound to the greater Roshar system.  At the very minimum I expect the Stormfather to be mortally wounded, making life difficult for the new Radients in the second arc, though I suppose technically that could wait for book six or so.

I also expect Dalinar to die, almost certainly in a climactic fashion, but then I've been expecting that for two whole books now.  I doubt he'll be the only character to kick the bucket, either; there's plenty of people in Bridge Four for a few tragic deaths there, and while I really wouldn't mind Shallan going out in a blaze of glory, I'm not holding my breath, though I expect more deaths among the Radiants as well.

Basically, the only way I can really see the story working is for the fifth book to end on a "downer but with hope" ending.  There's been too much tragic foreshadowing for anything else.  I don't know how well that will satisfy most people, but it's the ending I'm hoping for right now.

[maxal she/her]

28 minutes ago, galendo said:

My thoughts are that the first arc will end in a sort of "bittersweet tragedy" or something like that.  For instance, maybe Roshar is wrecked but the KR and/or Mr. T. manage to keep some people alive and Odium still bound to the greater Roshar system.  At the very minimum I expect the Stormfather to be mortally wounded, making life difficult for the new Radients in the second arc, though I suppose technically that could wait for book six or so.

I also expect Dalinar to die, almost certainly in a climactic fashion, but then I've been expecting that for two whole books now.  I doubt he'll be the only character to kick the bucket, either; there's plenty of people in Bridge Four for a few tragic deaths there, and while I really wouldn't mind Shallan going out in a blaze of glory, I'm not holding my breath, though I expect more deaths among the Radiants as well.

Basically, the only way I can really see the story working is for the fifth book to end on a "downer but with hope" ending.  There's been too much tragic foreshadowing for anything else.  I don't know how well that will satisfy most people, but it's the ending I'm hoping for right now.

I do think some characters arcs will end tragically, but some will end somewhat more happily. If Dalinar indeed dies, then his sons would be impacted, but the book could end with them finding a new balance. My personal thoughts are Renarin will be the Highprince within the next arc.

This being said, I do think most of the characters we know will survive. I expect Kaladin, Shallan, Renarin and Jasnah to survive. I hope Adolin survives and quite frankly if there is no Kholin heir but Elhokar's son (who does not have the golden hair and is boringly a full bload Alethi) I will be VERY disappointed.

[Calderis he/him]

5 hours ago, FiveLate said:

Yes he does, but he's on that whole steampunk theme right now......did you know he used to have short hair?....I have said it before, ill say it again....it's the long hair and beards that slow down the writing.

He had long hair forever, buzzed it and shocked people. Did he grow it again?