Truthwatcher ability?

[Stormingstormblessed]

I'm new to the 17th shard community so please do excuse me for any mistakes on my part and feel free to give your opinions on this. I don't know if this topic has already been covered, anyway I'll get to it:-

I was bored so i thought i'd re-read the dueling scene of adolin, Kaladin and renarin against the four shardbladers. While doing so I came across a particular section.

After renarin dismissed his blade, he closed his eyes and looked upward, "exposing his throat". When reading for the first time I initially thought he was giving up and accepting his faith, and that the reason for relis to hesitate was because he didn't want to strike down the defenseless renarin. 

On re-reading though, I thought it had something to do with his surgebinging ability as a "truthwatcher". I figured he used his surge - and to do so closed his eyes and looked upward - this showed relis a memory of his past and made him hesitate. In another chapter renarin had told his father that it wasn't a sin to look into the past when conversing about dalinars visions so I believe being a truthwatcher has something to do with the past (given that renarin was the one who told that)

Earlier it was noted that syl saw something close to renarin, I still don't know if she was referring to pattern or glyss.(or both)

This is my opinion and it's a complete speculation but please do give your feedback as well as your own theories of the abilities of "truthwatcher"

Edited March 26, 2017 by Stormingstormblessed

[Landis963]

1 hour ago, Stormingstormblessed said:

I'm new to the 17th shard community so please do excuse me for any mistakes on my part and feel free to give your opinions on this. I don't know if this topic has already been covered, anyway I'll get to it:-

I was bored so i thought i'd re-read the dueling scene of adolin, Kaladin and renarin against the four shardbladers. While doing so I came across a particular section.

After renarin dismissed his blade, he closed his eyes and looked upward, "exposing his throat". When reading for the first time I initially thought he was giving up and accepting his faith, and that the reason for relis to hesitate was because he didn't want to strike down the defenseless renarin. 

On re-reading though, I thought it had something to do with his surgebinging ability as a "truthwatcher". I figured he used his surge - and to do so closed his eyes and looked upward - this showed relis a memory of his past and made him hesitate. In another chapter renarin had told his father that it wasn't a sin to look into the past when conversing about dalinars visions so I believe being a truthwatcher has something to do with the past (given that renarin was the one who told that)

Earlier it was noted that syl saw something close to renarin, I still don't know if she was referring to pattern or glyss.(or both)

This is my opinion and it's a complete speculation but please do give your feedback as well as your own theories of the abilities of "truthwatcher"

Yes, this is in all likelihood Lightweaving.  However, where's the end result?  Where is the illusion that Renarin showed Relis?  Unless he was able to do it with enough precision as to lightweave a scene directly in front of Relis' corneas (or 'weave a phrase directly into his ear).  

However, if this is not, in fact, Lightweaving (and it's definitely not Regrowth because no one is actually wounded in this scene, nor are there inexplicable plants growing) then it is a side effect of the Truthwatcher Resonance (through process of elimination).  Which casts more than a few aspersions onto Renarin's visions of the future.  

[ZenBossanova]

OR, he knew he would be safe if he did that, and that that was honestly the best way to survive. 

[Zennix]

1 hour ago, Landis963 said:

Yes, thi. s is,  in.  all likelihood Lightweaving.  However, where's the end result?  Where is the illusion that Renarin showed Relis?  Unless he was able to do it with enough precision as to lightweave a scene directly in front of Relis' corneas (or 'weave a phrase directly into his ear).  

However, if this is not, in fact, Lightweaving (and it's definitely not Regrowth because no one is actually wounded in this scene, nor are there inexplicable plants growing) then it is a side effect of the Truthwatcher Resonance (through process of elimination).  Which casts more than a few aspersions onto Renarin's visions of the future.  

I don't believe that he used he used Lightweaving to make Relis hesitate. In all the other times that we have seen Lightweaving been used, it wasn't keyed to only the target. Unless, we want to assume that Renarin is way better than Shallan at  Lightweaving which is hard to believe because it seems like it seems like he's new to the whole spren bonding business. 

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“And the Shardblade,” Dalinar said, stepping over and taking his son by the shoulder. “You hear screams. That’s what happened to you in the arena. You couldn’t fight because of those shouts in your head from summoning the Blade. Why? Why didn’t you say anything?”

“I thought it was me,” Renarin whispered. “My mind. But Glys, he says . . .” Renarin blinked. “Truthwatcher.”

He also seems to have stopped wearing glasses not a long time ago (Stormlight healing). 

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“No spectacles . . .” Dalinar whispered. “You stopped wearing them. I thought you were trying to look like a warrior, but no. Stormlight healed your eyes.”

These all point to the fact that he probably didn't have enough time to learn Lightweaving up to the level required to perform such a feat. 

On the other hand, I think he received a vision during the duel. Everybody assumed that he was having a fit but we know that Kaladin found Renarin's explanation of his health condition suspicious. 

[Spoolofwhool]

I've always read that as Renarin being ready to take the attack, and Relis hesitating because he was a good enough person that he didn't want to kill someone who wasn't fighting back or even a political threat. My opinion is that it wasn't anything magical stopping him.

4 hours ago, Stormingstormblessed said:

Earlier it was noted that syl saw something close to renarin, I still don't know if she was referring to pattern or glyss.(or both)

She says later that she saw a Cryptic at the fight, so she noticed Pattern. Since she never mentioned seeing another spren, I'm assuming she's didn't notice Glys. 

4 hours ago, Stormingstormblessed said:

In another chapter renarin had told his father that it wasn't a sin to look into the past when conversing about dalinars visions so I believe being a truthwatcher has something to do with the past (given that renarin was the one who told that)

This is true, but I'm doubtful of this as it's said by other people, including ardents, that visions in general are considered to be related to voidbinding by vorinism. 

1 minute ago, Zennix said:

On the other hand, I think he received a vision during the duel. Everybody assumed that he was having a fit but we know that Kaladin found Renarin's explanation of his health condition suspicious. 

I believe it's later stated that he froze up in the fight because of his shardblade screaming in his mind. He wasn't actually having a fit, just terrified at the sound of unparalleled agony in his head. 

[Stormingstormblessed]

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Haha, your right..!! i just guess it was wishful thinking on my part 

[Argent]

I don't think I agree with this idea. To me, it looks pretty clear that Renarin was giving up there, and any alternative explanation - especially one as convoluted as the one you propose - would need some solid evidence. 

Syl also outright says she saw a Cryptic in the arena, so we know that too.

[King Cole]

22 hours ago, Spoolofwhool said:

This is true, but I'm doubtful of this as it's said by other people, including ardents, that visions in general are considered to be related to voidbinding by vorinism. 

Isn't it specifically seeing the future the vorinism religion frowns on?

[Spoolofwhool]

3 hours ago, King Cole said:

Isn't it specifically seeing the future the vorinism religion frowns on?

No, it's visions from the Almighty and the future. Basically, from the sounds of it, anything that approaches supernatural inspiration is bad because it reminds them of the Hierocracy.

[Paliah]

One thing I noticed about that scene is that Renarin offers Adolin some spheres to repair his Shardplate after the fight, which could imply that Renarin didn't use Stormlight during the duel. (I could be mis-remembering, since I don't have the book with me.)

I wonder if anyone in the audience was using emotional allomancy during and after the duel, since a lot of characters demonstrated extreme versions of their usual emotions and personalities at that time.