Making a Magic System

[Elementalist]

So, I'm in the process of outlining a book I want to write, and I want to get to making its magic system. The book has a large focus on the conflict between living a life that is free, but hard or that is easy, but controlled by the government. It also has a focus on the philosophy of "the ends justify the means." I'd like the magic system to reflect this in some way. I've played around with several ideas, but I could never come up with a system I thought would work. Do you guys have any suggestions I could build on?

Edited January 30, 2014 by Power

[Argent]

I think this will work better if we do it the other way around - you give us a few (basic) ideas you like (e.g. one of Brandon's is/was "getting sick gives you superpowers"), and we try to build on them so they fit the theme of your book. This way the core of the magic system will be your own (and therefore something you probably find interesting), while the details (which are, in many cases, legwork) will be ours. 

[Darkarma]

Hrm...

 

This may sound odd but maybe something along the lines of Retroactive Karma or Luck. Might give some of yours readers headache but to create a magical effect a person suffers ahead of time. Along this line of thought for ends justifying the means, a person can inflict this on someone else to draw in more power to energize whatever they are doing (Or worse, they get to live the good life and use someone else's suffering to completely power up themselves). It also gives you a fun tool to play with your readers.

 

"Are things getting bad because something awesome is going to happen... or is it the situation I threw myself up to." MAgic side of things you have philosphers arguing that that the more you allow yourself to suffer the better pool of power you get rather than you have a bad life as a result of working magic.

 

Random musings, take what you will or maybe inspire yourself from the idea.

 

Argent though does have a point, you need a better basis to go on. Are you going for a wide open technology type magic which can be built upon or more of a limited (if only in in appearance) kind of one pony trick magic system

Edited January 30, 2014 by Darkarma

[Elementalist]

I posted my notes on google docs, here's the link:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/13E-ASgpCCvcqQblgFM-YJOkxdT81n1wgEhHbI7Wzv-0/edit?usp=docslist_api

Keep in mind that this is in the very early stages; the book doesn't even have a name yet. The notes are also terribly done, so I apologize in advance for that.

What I'm really trying to create is a very specific, Allomancy-esque magic system. There are specific different powers, but they are all part of the same magic system. I'm thinking along the lines of 4-6 different powers. These powers should be along the lines of freedom/chaos. These powers typically manifest in a forested region, so perhaps that can come into it somehow.

I'm also toying with the idea of a second, magitek type system that comes into play in the desert nation of Dolor. The magical technology would be associated with Order/Oppression, and would allow access to quick communication and transport (among other things).

EDIT: A basic idea for the Chaos/Freedom system could be, "power requires personal sacrifice." An example of this from my early attempts at making the system is the idea of temporarily giving one's self the ability to sense life around you in exchange for temporarily losing the acuity of your normal sight. The more blind you go, the more life sense you gain. You are exchanging one type of sight for another.

Edited January 30, 2014 by Power

[Leonardus]

Perhaps for oppression you could utilize some sort of draining system ? What I mean by this is that you somehow power up a device or a construct that enables you to do something, you have to feed it with human emotions or energy of some sort, now I don't think people will like it when you drain their joy, anger etc so they will naturally try to avoid getting zapped by your machine, that's where you grab all the peasants and slaves and you hook em up for juice. Bonus points if you require a large amount of subjects.

 

As for order I've no clue to be honest I will have to think about it some more.

[Elementalist]

Perhaps for oppression you could utilize some sort of draining system ? What I mean by this is that you somehow power up a device or a construct that enables you to do something, you have to feed it with human emotions or energy of some sort, now I don't think people will like it when you drain their joy, anger etc so they will naturally try to avoid getting zapped by your machine, that's where you grab all the peasants and slaves and you hook em up for juice. Bonus points if you require a large amount of subjects.

 

As for order I've no clue to be honest I will have to think about it some more.

I don't want this to be too scifi. For magitek I was thinking more like a fabrial-esque device. I love the idea of feeding on emotions, though.

Also, the society I make shouldn't come off as oppressive at first glance. Sort of like if you watch Fullmetal Alchemist, the nation of Amestris looks like a great place in the first few episodes. Only later do you realize that it is flawed in several ways and is capable of doing horrible things to its subjects. I want it to be sort of surprising when the reader finds out that Dolor (which is latin for pain) isn't as great as it's been made out to be.

[Leonardus]

Hmm then why don't you make it so that they look prosperous and then the characters/readers find out what the cost of that prosperity is, also I was totally thinking of some emotion draining fabrial. 

[Shivertongue]

First question is "What do you want the magic to do?" I don't mean like "I want them to be able to throw fireballs and teleport" - I mean, what do you want it to do for them. Is it a physical magic? Is it a combative magic? Mental magic? Do you want them to be able to boost their strength so they can throw a stronger punch, or do you want them to be able to boost their strength because they work in construction and need to lift a steel girder?

 

Second, "Why do you want the magic to do this? What purpose is this magic serving in the plot or to the characters?"

 

These are the two questions I ask myself whenever I start working on a system. And, for me personally, the magic has to follow "Shiv's Law," which basically states "Magic should have multiple purposes within a society." Magic that is just for fighting is boring to me. It should have multiple uses, one of which can be combat. There are, of course, exceptions to this depending on the story.

[Pinpoint]

I'd say follow Shivs advice. I do much the same when working on Magic systems and it has worked well for me. I build the society around the Magic system. Since the magic usually is a natural element of the world, it usually comes before society does. This always made a lot of sense to me since in the world this is how it would actually happen

....

Unless you had a magic system caused by society

Since you don't seem to need/want the Idea I posted earlier, and since you already have a brilliant Idea, I'm going to steal my idea back.

Edited February 4, 2014 by Pinpoint

[Shivertongue]

I should saw, Shiv's Law works best if you have a fairly widespread magic. If it's something you have to learn, or that is held by a small cabal of people, then it's not as necessary for it to have other uses in society. I personally prefer more widespread magic, magic that anyone COULD use, but not everyone DOES.

[Swimmingly]

I posted my notes on google docs, here's the link:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/13E-ASgpCCvcqQblgFM-YJOkxdT81n1wgEhHbI7Wzv-0/edit?usp=docslist_api

Keep in mind that this is in the very early stages; the book doesn't even have a name yet. The notes are also terribly done, so I apologize in advance for that.

What I'm really trying to create is a very specific, Allomancy-esque magic system. There are specific different powers, but they are all part of the same magic system. I'm thinking along the lines of 4-6 different powers. These powers should be along the lines of freedom/chaos. These powers typically manifest in a forested region, so perhaps that can come into it somehow.

I'm also toying with the idea of a second, magitek type system that comes into play in the desert nation of Dolor. The magical technology would be associated with Order/Oppression, and would allow access to quick communication and transport (among other things).

EDIT: A basic idea for the Chaos/Freedom system could be, "power requires personal sacrifice." An example of this from my early attempts at making the system is the idea of temporarily giving one's self the ability to sense life around you in exchange for temporarily losing the acuity of your normal sight. The more blind you go, the more life sense you gain. You are exchanging one type of sight for another.

This sounds like displacing your awareness to another dimension kinda thing? What about having a system where each school is a different focus - so maybe Sight with subschools for seeing life, emotions, water, air currents etc., a Body school that lets you slow-teleport at the cost of being blind and deaf while moving, a Hand school that has to do with shifting the laws of physics you obey as you strike things etc.