Djarskublar Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 I realized while at work that there is an issue with my current understanding of the timeline of the spren's betrayal. I had assumed, like many, that this betrayal was them making surgebinders out of humans. But then, why would they let Odium corrupt them and attack humans as the voidbringers before that? They did so, presumably with a reason, so the bonding can't be the betrayal. My new idea of what the betrayal was is something that probably happened over time in the first 1000ish years humans were on Roshar. Before humans came, the Listeners (and maybe Aimians?) were the sapients on Roshar that could help define spren. Once humans came, they took over (not necessarily conquered, but you know...) large swathes of the continent. Their population probably far exceeded that of the other sapients, so their cognition was more important to the shaping of spren. Beyond that, the thoughts of humans may actually be better at shaping spren because of how set the Listeners are in their emotions. They don't appear to change much. As Pattern seems to indicate, the spren like being able to truly change, so the spren liked the humans more than the Listeners. The Listeners then felt betrayed by the spren for picking the new guys over them. This then allowed Odium to get a hold on them and start the desolations. Eventually, the spren started bonding with humans to make surgebinders to fight better against the Listeners. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZenBossanova Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 But where do the Aimians fit into all of this, and how do they, (besides just Axies the Collector) interact with or care about spren? What can they offer spren? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oversleep Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) On 19.11.2016 at 11:14 PM, ZenBossanova said: But where do the Aimians fit into all of this, and how do they, (besides just Axies the Collector) interact with or care about spren? What can they offer spren? They do not fit. These two WoBs: Quote JamesW Are all of the orders of Knights Radiant human? Brandon Sanderson Yes. source Quote JamesW Are there non-human races on Roshar, or non-humanoid races that are sentient? Brandon Sanderson The Parshendi are not human, but you probably already knew that. The two races of Aimians are not human either. There are many races of sentient spren. From there, it depends if you call something like Ryshadium sentient or not. source suggest Aimians did not bond spren. Edited November 27, 2016 by Ookla the Sunrise Watcher k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZenBossanova Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 Oversleep - that tells us nothing. We know that Parshendi were not Radiants in the past, but we know they have a lot to do with spren. But we don't know anything about the Aimians one way or the other yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oversleep Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 29 minutes ago, ZenBossanova said: Oversleep - that tells us nothing. We know that Parshendi were not Radiants in the past, but we know they have a lot to do with spren. But we don't know anything about the Aimians one way or the other yet. It seems as I misunderstood the premise as lumping Aimians together with humans as the newcomers. So I went to prove that Aimians had not been Surgebinders. Sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djarskublar Posted November 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Oversleep said: It seems as I misunderstood the premise as lumping Aimians together with humans as the newcomers. So I went to prove that Aimians had not been Surgebinders. Sorry That's fine. Make it up to the thread with your thoughts on the real topic ; ) Edited November 19, 2016 by Djarskublar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeakoftheDeval Posted November 20, 2016 Report Share Posted November 20, 2016 Could axies want to research all spren to find a sort of proto spren that still wants to bond with aimians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djarskublar Posted November 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2016 Nah I think what we see is what we get with him. He just wants to catalogue all spren. I basically ignored Aimians in the OP because I think they never had a large population even before the scouring of Aimia. Seriously though, if this theory is the case, that could be super important. Think of the ramifications of changing the Cognitive landscape of a continent that much! What could that mean for Sel? Both past and future. If humanity can seriously change things by collectively changing some basic outlooks and emotions, then that makes me hopeful for the state of the Dor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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