Konstantin Posted October 13, 2016 Report Share Posted October 13, 2016 I have a strong feeling that it will be something like: "I will protect even if it costs me my life". What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marianmi Posted October 13, 2016 Report Share Posted October 13, 2016 37 minutes ago, Konstantin said: I have a strong feeling that it will be something like: "I will protect even if it costs me my life". What do you think? Don't think so, Kaladin was always protecting putting his life on the line... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoolofwhool Posted October 13, 2016 Report Share Posted October 13, 2016 Reasoning for this theory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konstantin Posted October 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2016 1 hour ago, Spoolofwhool said: Reasoning for this theory? It seems to me that every KR order represents a specific virtue. And the thing is to follow these virtues uncoditionally - no "ifs". Take windrunenrs for an instant - they must protect anyone even those who they might despise, hate or whatever. And the purest form of this virtue is giving your life to save another. Like, remember the movie "Constantine" with Keanu Reeves? When he slits his wrists to summon Satan and make a deal with him about saving the girl - it was clear to him, that he will die. It is not a battle, or another very risky decision. No. You have to die. And that is the only way to save someone. I think step by step every KR eventualy comes to some kind of absolute. When Szeth told Nale, that he is not worthy, Nale said: "I watched you destroy yourself in the name of order, watched you obey your personal code when others would have fled or crumbled. I doubt i have ever found a man more worthy of the Skybreakers than you". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marianmi Posted October 13, 2016 Report Share Posted October 13, 2016 (edited) Windrunner ideals are Protecting/Leading. The first 2 oaths were about protecting, maybe last 2 are about leading. Let's also not forget the first oath is "Life before death" Edited October 13, 2016 by marianmi 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savanorn Posted October 14, 2016 Report Share Posted October 14, 2016 Personally, I would think a 'even if it costs my life' would be more Skybreaker than Windrunner. Like, maybe, "I will obey the law, even should it cost me my life" Like, a Windrunner is naturally self sacrificing, pretty much by the nature of their order...presuming that Kal is an exemplar of a Windrunner. But, to be honest, a lot of the more 'honourspren' KR seem to have an element of self-sacrifice in-built as part of their ideals. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightblade Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 My guess would be "I will protect, even those who don't deserve it" Then proceed to save someone like moash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jondesu Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 11 minutes ago, Nightblade said: My guess would be "I will protect, even those who don't deserve it" Then proceed to save someone like moash. That seems too similar to the 3rd Ideal to me. I think it'll have to be something a bit more different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numuhukumakiaki'aialunamor Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 I was thinking about this and had the thought that it might deal with protecting someone bad/evil if in that situation they need help and it is the right thing to do. Something like protecting a murderer from the victim's family member who is trying to kill them so that the murderer can stand trial. I'm not sure how this would be worded but it seems like a possibility. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasarr Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 I don't know... I admit, I'm with marianmi on this one, I think the last two oaths are about leading. Maybe something like "I will not abandon those in need" and "I will be a good example to those under my command" (<- needs fancier phrasing). Regarding the first one, Kaladin might feel the need to simply lead the people of Hearthstone to the nearest safe-ish town and then rush to Urithiru or Kholinar. As for the latter... I don't know, it just sounds like a "leading" kind of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numuhukumakiaki'aialunamor Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 (edited) How was the third ideal about leading? I thought it was something like I will protect even those I do not like hate. Or is it that the first one, life before death, is not included in the four ideals and this one is counted as the second ideal? Edited October 21, 2016 by Numuhukumakiaki'aialunamor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoolofwhool Posted October 21, 2016 Report Share Posted October 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, Numuhukumakiaki'aialunamor said: How was the third ideal about leading? I thought it was something like I will protect even those I do not like. Or is it that the first one, life before death, is not included in the four ideals and this one is counted as the second ideal? Yes, I think he's counting the Windrunner-specific ideals. Life before Death, Strength before Weakness, Journey before Destination are ideals of all radiants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowwisp Posted October 22, 2016 Report Share Posted October 22, 2016 Betting on next one being about leadership. Unlike before, he has a whole set of squires now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoidvsVoid Posted October 23, 2016 Report Share Posted October 23, 2016 (edited) I think that guessing the fifth ideal is pointless and impossible without guessing the fourth. From my experience, after the first one, each ideal builds on the previous one, which makes logical sense for moral reasons. Do try figuring out the fourth before leaping to the final ideal. Edited October 23, 2016 by HoidvsVoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects Posted October 23, 2016 Report Share Posted October 23, 2016 (edited) On October 21, 2016 at 9:43 PM, shadowwisp said: Betting on next one being about leadership. Unlike before, he has a whole set of squires now Kaladin will have little trouble, but I don't recall the Squires being bound by any similar Code of how they have to act. That could be a plot point in and of itself. Edit: On second thought, they probably had to pass some certain "ideal-checkpoints" to become a squire and be able to gain the power. opinions? Edited October 23, 2016 by The One Who Connects Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jondesu Posted October 23, 2016 Report Share Posted October 23, 2016 5 hours ago, The One Who Connects said: Kaladin will have little trouble, but I don't recall the Squires being bound by any similar Code of how they have to act. That could be a plot point in and of itself. Edit: On second thought, they probably had to pass some certain "ideal-checkpoints" to become a squire and be able to gain the power. opinions? Unfortunately, we don't know enough about the squires yet, but we know Bridge 4 is becoming Kaladin's squires. While they were all different and uncooperative originally, they have all come around to mostly the same attitude as Kaladin when it comes to protecting people. They've taken very enthusiastically to their bodyguard roles, and we see that really clearly with the ones who protected Adolin. I have a feeling they do have to follow the ideals to a degree as well, even if not as strictly as the Knight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thegatorgirl00 Posted October 24, 2016 Report Share Posted October 24, 2016 On October 23, 2016 at 10:22 AM, HoidvsVoid said: I think that guessing the fifth ideal is pointless and impossible without guessing the fourth. From my experience, after the first one, each ideal builds on the previous one, which makes logical sense for moral reasons. Do try figuring out the fourth before leaping to the final ideal. I agree with this. I also think that every oath gets progressively more difficult for the night. Each oth we've seen so far has been pretty basic. Wanting to protect the innocent is basically a requirement for attracting an Honorspren. Same for the first oath of Bondsmiths and Edgedancers. The next oath, protecting those you hate, Kal has a lot more trouble with. This is also seen with Shallan's truths. Admitting she killed her father was not nearly as difficult as admitting she killed her mother. I think this pattern will hold for all the oaths of all the orders. Also, shouldn't this topic be in Stormlight Archives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonwarrior01 Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 I've been playing with the idea that the fourth oath could be something like, "I will protect those who need it most, even at the cost of who I love." I say "those who need it most" because it allows wiggle room on protecting a king or an entire village at the expense of losing one's wife or family. Something along those lines. I also like that wording because it follows a certain "from the viewpoint of the spren" pattern we've been seeing from WoK and WoR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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