Why are there Nobles?

[DeadFencer]

I was wondering why the Elendel Senate had a house made up entirely of nobles. That seemed out of place considering the history with nobles. It was especially bad since we know Kelsier was around Spook, and I can't see him letting Spook put his old enemies in charge.

[natc]

Well, one of those nobles was Breeze. Lying bastard.

And well, when most of the population is dead, and some people had some experience with leadership and administrative duties, you take what you can get until the situation stabilizes.

[DeadFencer]

I was thinking Spook was in charge, but when he died (or left) those around him took power. They happened to be nobles, since the powerful had married into the old noble families to get the names.

[Otto Didact he/him]

Note, too, that Spook was being mentored by Kelsier, whose hatred of the nobles had sort of given way to a grudging acceptance at the time of his death. Kell probably had the foresight to know that everyone, including the nobles, would have to band together after the Catascendre in order to survive.

[natc]

In all honesty you don't want peasant farmers or whatever to run government. That leaves nobles, and leaders of skaa organizations, which there aren't many of besides thieving crews.

Technically all of Kelsier's team is part-noble anyway.

[Oudeis he/him]

Technically all of Kelsier's team is part-noble anyway.

Except Dox.

 

Yeah. The Crew would prolly be against the Nobility, but not to Kelsier and Dox levels. Elend was a full Noble, as was Breeze, as has been pointed out almost everyone has Noble blood, Kel himself was even raised Noble.

 

And beyond their skills in bureaucracy, remember what the term Nobility means. It implies a literal divine right of rule. It's not just the Nobles who want to be in charge; skaa like Philen are very rare. Most of them that Sazed visited wanted someone to be in charge, even wanted the Lord Ruler back. Spook might have been able to force the skaa to accept the complete dissolution of the nobility... but he'd do so just as he was about to marry a full-blooded Noble, raised Noble, and make himself emperor of the known world. Going from "skaa have no rights" to "the Nobles are in charge of half the senate, but the philosophy is to protect the rights of those working for them" is already an almost impossible change. Considering how slowly cultures change on earth, even with the Catacendre, I'm not wholly surprised that this was the extent of the immediate change. And considering how static the culture has grown since, it's also not shocking that it's taken them another 300 years to acquire the mindset of, hey, it's a good thing our Governor isn't noble.

 

Well, less time, technically. If the Senate existed during Spook's reign, I have to imagine it was a relatively perfunctory affair. Who is going to argue with the Chosen of Harmony, Lord Mistborn, Survivor of Flames? He's not just the only Mistborn still around and curiously long-lived, he's a major figure in two or three of the most prominent religions, and one of the few remaining members of the team that literally saved the world. He once courted the Ascendant Warrior.

 

So really, the Senate as we know it can be, at most, 200 years old.

 

In conclusion, to answer the original question:

 

1. The Nobility wasn't actually as bad as the first book implied.

2. The Nobility had skills necessary to the survival of mankind.

3. Cultures as a whole are resistant to change. Gradual changes, from a sociological perspective, are more likely to "stick".

[natc]

Well, I kinda neglected Dox on account of being dead . . .

And right, he's married to a noble too. At least he's several generations down the line himself though, IIRC?

It's also somewhat probable that several houses are not of pure blood I suppose. Speaking of blood: due to the concentration of allomancy as opposed to skaa, nobility is technically a race to a certain extent yes? The classification would be difficult to eliminate early on; though allomancers seem prevalent in the commoner populace of Elendel as well if we're running courier jobs and soothing parlors. The bloodline has definitely thinned within a few generations.

Edited April 26, 2016 by natc

[Oudeis he/him]

Interesting you use "technically a race"; the definition of what makes people a race or not is actually somewhat fluid. In the Final Empire, the Nobles probably would be a distinct race, because "race" is simply a social construct. By Era 2, I don't think most people consider the Nobility to be physically different from commoners, though the case could be made because such a big deal is made of Aradel's lack of noble blood.

 

A simple difference doesn't seem to be enough; in America, deaf people are not considered a separate race. It has to be a difference that is believed by society to make you an entirely distinct group. Allomancy might travel by blood, but my impression from the books is that people in the Elendel Basin don't really consider allomantic bloodlines to be a wholly separate race.

 

I admit, however, that I have never read the books with an eye specifically towards that, so at least in part this is simply my impression. It's entirely possible there are passages from the book supporting the idea which have escaped me at the moment.

 

 

Well, I kinda neglected Dox on account of being dead . . .

 

Kell didn't let that stop him. Just kidding!

[Stormgate he/him]

Britain has a House of Lords. The concept is far from foreign.

W&W-era Scadrial seems to have either a bicameral or unicameral (I don't remember which) legislative branch, with a directly elected president. (They call him Governor. Same thing, different title.) The legislative branch seems to be a system with mixed ways of appointment, some being hereditary while others are elected.

The entire system is unitary, with centralized power, versus the federal system Americans have grown up with. The virtually powerless states now seem to be opposing the unitary system, likely planning on creating a weak confederation (like the EU or the Articles of Confederation) or perhaps a federal system.

I'm taking an AP Comparitive Government class. I've become very familiar with the terminology. I should stop spontaneously nerding out over government structures in a few months.

Edit: my post was brief, and could easily be interpreted as insulting the intelligence of everyone who read it. I hopefully made it un-condescending, as well as more detailed.

Edited April 28, 2016 by Stormgate

[The Ninja Yodeler he/him]

I can understand the Nobles being most of those in charge after the Catacendre. But there would be no reason for it to be passed down through the family. They could easily teach ALL of the children, throughout their education, how to properly run a stable government. The Nobles should have lead until the next "leaders" (made up of both skaa and Noble) can come into power.

Hell, if there is enough of them, you could even have an election. The noble houses having some right to a position on any political committee should have been discarded as soon as possible.