KevThinker Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 You know that rule for Feruchemy where a Feruchemist can only store and use energies that he himself produces? Do you think that same rule would apply to twins? Imagine two identical twin Feruchemists, I wonder if they could share metalminds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeiryWriter Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I sincerely doubt it. They might share their physical DNA but their spiritweb. Not to mention they would have different "Identities". Their metalminds would treat them as two separate people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) I seriously doubt it. First of all, nearly all, if not just all, prevailing theories have the Feruchemist's Spiritual Aspect influencing what metalminds they can use, and two people would have different souls, as turns out. Beyond even that, identical twins aren't even guaranteed to both be Ferrings, let alone of the same type. Source: Q: If two people are identical twins, and one is a Mistborn, will the second be Mistborn? Brandon: No. They could have different Spiritual DNA. Edited January 13, 2014 by Kurkistan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claincy Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Being a twin, I am always in favour of twin-favouring magic to a degree But no, I think Kurk and Weiry are almost certainly right on this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yados Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Sounds like the real question is whether two individuals could have the same sDNA, either by birth or by burning a hermalurgic spike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pechvarry Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I find it fascinating that in Kurk's quote above, Brandon said twins COULD have different sDNA. Not always... In other news the magic of The Emperor's Soul would work really well with twins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 "Genetics" for sDNA is weird. Source: [Chaos] tweeted Brandon vaguely about the genetics of it. This is what he said: In the Cosmere, a person has three sets of genetic material. Biological DNA, Personality/Cognative self, Spiritual Soul. All are influenced by heritage and parents. All all are also influenced by the land you are born in. A Punnett square wouldn't cover it. Think of a 4-dimensional Punnett square. -8/2/2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Being a twin, I am always in favour of twin-favouring magic to a degree But no, I think Kurk and Weiry are almost certainly right on this one Fraternal or identical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claincy Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Fraternal or identical? Fraternal, I have a twin sister. (It's kind of sad/amusing how many people ask if we are identical after we have noted that the other twin is a sister/brother ) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 head!desk. My sister told us she was having fraternal twin girls and my mom and I freaked out that we would spend their lives confusing them. These two little girls look NOTHING alike, it's hilarious. If you're told that they're related you can see a bit of resemblance, that's seriously it. I met triplets once, identical girls with a fraternal brother. I was with a genetics counselor at the time and she basically did a spit-take when she heard about it. They've apparently never before just run into someone at a bar knowledgeable enough to ask about the division of the placenta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claincy Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 head!desk. My sister told us she was having fraternal twin girls and my mom and I freaked out that we would spend their lives confusing them. These two little girls look NOTHING alike, it's hilarious. If you're told that they're related you can see a bit of resemblance, that's seriously it. I met triplets once, identical girls with a fraternal brother. I was with a genetics counselor at the time and she basically did a spit-take when she heard about it. They've apparently never before just run into someone at a bar knowledgeable enough to ask about the division of the placenta. It is always funny when someone has known both of us for a bit but had no idea we were twins. Triplets like that would be very rare. I don't think I've heard of a specific case where it did before though I was aware it was possible. I tend to forget at times that some people may not know the difference between fraternal and identical twins, or at least not know why they are different. Its a case of things that you have known for so long that you forget that not everyone does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecatinthehat Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 "Genetics" for sDNA is weird. Source: A Punnett square wouldn't cover it. Think of a 4-dimensional Punnett square.But then wouldn't a 4-dimentional Punnett square equivalent to a normal Punnett square with the number of rows and columns squared? I.e. 2×2×2×2 → 4×4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 But then wouldn't a 4-dimentional Punnett square equivalent to a normal Punnett square with the number of rows and columns squared? I.e. 2×2×2×2 → 4×4? That... no... huh... what? The point of it being fourth-dimensional isn't that there are simply more options, it's that it's now a hypercube. It's got the x axis and y axis of a punnet square, the z-axis we know of/can imagine, and a fourth axis we cannot imagine. One of the things that makes genetics so easy is that you've only got two parents. But let's say that the Z-axis is "where you were born". That means there's sections for each Shardworld, of which there are 10 major ones, and who knows how many minor ones, further sub-divided into actual regions (at least on Sel). So... more than 16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecatinthehat Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 One of the things that makes genetics so easy is that you've only got two parents. But let's say that the Z-axis is "where you were born". That means there's sections for each Shardworld, of which there are 10 major ones, and who knows how many minor ones, further sub-divided into actual regions (at least on Sel). So... more than 16.I mean that the problem itself is not the number of dimensions you want to present it in, just the number of possibilities. Just like a 4-dimensional Punnett "square" of 2×2×1,000,000×1,000,000 would be equally unpredictable to a regular 2-dimensional 4,000,000×1,000,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Possible... except we by definition don't truly understand the geometry of a hypercube. It could be a lot more complicated than that. For example, if I were to try walking a hundred feet along a flat, horizontal surface, that would be simple, yeah? Climbing 100 feet up a flat, vertical surface would take skill and equipment I might not have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsuoni Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 It is always funny when someone has known both of us for a bit but had no idea we were twins. Triplets like that would be very rare. I don't think I've heard of a specific case where it did before though I was aware it was possible. I tend to forget at times that some people may not know the difference between fraternal and identical twins, or at least not know why they are different. Its a case of things that you have known for so long that you forget that not everyone does I wonder, what would you call the twins in the following (purely theoretical) scenario: zygote starts from XXY, but on the first division separates into XX and XY, with one X shared, which cells then each grow into a separate person, a girl and a boy, respectively? Possible... except we by definition don't truly understand the geometry of a hypercube. It could be a lot more complicated than that. For example, if I were to try walking a hundred feet along a flat, horizontal surface, that would be simple, yeah? Climbing 100 feet up a flat, vertical surface would take skill and equipment I might not have. Your setup implies external force, Darnam In closed system, there is no difference between directions (in relation to the outside), and a discrete multi-dimensional system can always be embedded in less-dimensional one, up to zero dimensions (a single data point). The complexity of even simple genetics would grow with generations, though - what would happen if one of your grandparents was from Roshar, another an Elantrian with MaiPon soulstamp on him at the moment of conception, third a Returned and fourth a Pewterarm Koloss half-blood? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swimmingly Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 I wonder, what would you call the twins in the following (purely theoretical) scenario: zygote starts from XXY, but on the first division separates into XX and XY, with one X shared, which cells then each grow into a separate person, a girl and a boy, respectively? Your setup implies external force, Darnam In closed system, there is no difference between directions (in relation to the outside), and a discrete multi-dimensional system can always be embedded in less-dimensional one, up to zero dimensions (a single data point). The complexity of even simple genetics would grow with generations, though - what would happen if one of your grandparents was from Roshar, another an Elantrian with MaiPon soulstamp on him at the moment of conception, third a Returned and fourth a Pewterarm Koloss half-blood? Your spouse would have some REALLY weird in-laws. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts