Is Harmony a new shard?

[Gamma Fiend he/him]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, but when browsing the Coppermind, I dont think Harmony was listed, because it wasn't an original shard. But when Sazed takes both Ruin and Preservation, he becomes an entirely new entity, right?

and since he has two shards, would that make him stronger than any other Shardholder? (or weaker, because of the nature of the two shards he holds?)

Discuss?

[Windrunner he/him]

The answer to your question is yes and no.

QUESTION
Were Ruin and Preservation two shards or one?
BRANDON SANDERSON
They were two shards. Harmony is considered a shard, although it’s really two, in the same way that a king of two countries would still be considered a king.
Source

 

THANATOS17901 ()
Thanks so much for all your writing, Way of Kings is the best book I've read in the last decade.

If Sazed were to die, would he drop the shards Ruin and Preservation, or would he drop the shard Harmony?

BRANDON SANDERSON
Excellent question. The shards are now intermingled, and would take effort to split apart. He would drop Harmony. (This is what Odium feared would happen, by the way.)
Source

So, as I see it, both Shards are still in there, but they've now become somewhat attached.

[Gamma Fiend he/him]

Oooh, cool thanks!

Does this mean that he could also potentially collect MORE shards? Or would only opposite shards like Ruin and Preservation combine together like that?

[Cheese Ninja he/him]

He could definitely collect more Shards, and I imagine they would start to intermingle eventually as well.  Also, picking up a Shard influences the holder's psyche, which is part of the reason Odium doesn't pick up Shards after he kills the holder, he likes being pure Hatred.  Sazed isn't as heavily affected by this, since Ruin and Preservation mostly counter each other out, but I believe Sazed has gained a tendency to do things in balance.

 

Try reading through most of these from the site Windrunner linked to, they should answer most of your questions.

 

Adam

Does Hoid believe that Shards are the most powerful thing?

Brandon Sanderson

You'll have to ask him sometime. [gives troll grin]. Or see him get asked something like that sometime. There's argument to be made that right now Harmony is the most powerful thing in the Cosmere.

 

[Kurkistan he/him]

I would hesitate to say "in balance" is Sazed's new thing, or at least that it's any consequence of the Shards. You'll forgive me, but I've been waiting to rant on this particular misconception (in my opinion, at least) for awhile, and now I have an opportunity :

I've noticed a trend of people taking the "balance" of Harmony a bit too literally, so I'd like to get my own interpretation of "harmony" as a positive.

First of all, Sazed is still Sazed, he isn't being warped by Intents and won't be any time soon. I'd like to think that Sazed is a decent guy, if a bit non-interventionist. Therefore, he's not going to go all crazy obsessing about "balances." (Sources: It'll be awhile, likened to gravitation).

 

I have a post or two about this in the past.

 

Here's a quote from the horse's mouth:

 

AoL

Sazed: "I have to be carfeul in playing favorites,...It upsets the balance." ... "The point is Harmony, creating a way for as many as possible to make their own choices."

 

"Creating a way" for others to make their own choices is a fairly positive action geared toward freedom and/or self-actualization, I would think, rather than brute "balance."

Edited August 25, 2013 by Kurkistan

[jag519 he/him]

But it also is giving them the power to destroy. That is the balance of it. He mainly wants to let the most people create or destroy as they want. 

 

Pretty much, though, I agree with you. Sazed is so much like what I would expect someone effected by Harmony to be like with out being effected by Harmony that I can't really tell if it is effecting him at all, haha.

[Kurkistan he/him]

I don't really read that passage as "let people do what they want," since he's actively trying to make a world where the most people can make their own choices. That implies a bias against those who would force choices on others or otherwise prevent others from making their own choices--aka, those who want to destroy others in various senses of the word.

Edited August 25, 2013 by Kurkistan

[Gaelan he/him]

Adam

Does Hoid believe that Shards are the most powerful thing?

Brandon Sanderson

You'll have to ask him sometime. [gives troll grin]. Or see him get asked something like that sometime. There's argument to be made that right now Harmony is the most powerful thing in the Cosmere.

Hmm, while this isn't a confirmation of anything, as we are all crazy theorist of that kind of stuff, this can be interpreted (and just interpreted, it's impossible to base something from this quote) as Sazed beeing stronger than Adonalsium's opposite force.

 

By the way, I'm one of those who thinks that Harmony, as all the shards, has it's own intent, but that is weaken enough as to affect its holder in a extremely slow way, since Preservation and Ruin are opposites. Or it doesn't take efect at all, but I don't think so. If the intent wasn't there, why didn't Hoid just take two opposite shards and use them as he's using all that cosmere stuff? It has to be an intent.

[Kurkistan he/him]

Shard's aren't just lying around for the picking, and for all we know Ruin and Preservation may actually be the only two shards so well balanced.

 

As to there having to be a significant (read: mind-warping) Intent for all Shards, I don't necessarily think so. I doubt that the complete version of Adonalsium was swayed one way or another, when all 16 Shards were as one.

[Shardlet he/him]

I agree with Kurk.  I think it is likely that the more shards one holds the less demanding the driving intent of each shard is. 

 

As to Adonalsium's opposing force, it really depends on the nature of that force.  Was it a backwash of energy from an unwise use of the power of creation, is it a distinct entity, is it the result of a collective conciousness effort or idea?  The last one is a bit of a head tilter, I know.  I will give you an example (though only Whovians will likely get it).  At the end of the third season (series) of Doctor Who (the Martha Jones season),

the doctor has been changed into a version of himself which reflects his nearly 1000 year age.  He is incredibly weakened and has been in this state for about a year.  During that year, Martha has been travelling throughout the world telling people how much they owe their continued existence to the Doctor.  This leads up to a point where, when signalled, essentially the entire world focuses their thoughts on the Doctor and the combined energy of those positive thoughts results in an override to what the Master has done to the Doctor and he is restored.

  Such a thing would not be properly termed to be a thing and is transient in nature, but was very powerful in its instance. 

Edited August 29, 2013 by Shardlet

[Gaelan he/him]

Without reading Dragonsteel, what we all know was that Hoid was there when Adonalsium shattered. He refers to the shardholders, in the letter, as if he knew some of them. He is the only person from Yolen (letting shardholders apart, and maybe the third person of the 17thshard in the Purelake) that we have seen around. If he was an ordinary person from Yolen (Yolish?), why aren't there more as him around? Probably there are, but not in a meaningful number or people would start to have constance of them. Of course, all what I'm saying is pure speculation, most of it baseless. But we are off-toping the off-topic, so I won't say more about it, as for the Adonalsium's opposite force. If we don't know much of the first one, let out the second one.

 

As for the intents, I agree that whatever Adonalsium was, it's holder or Adonalsium itself was free of intent (if not, that would be perfect balance, and I don't think so), But 2 of 16 Shards, even beeing opposites and countering each other, is not a meaningful number (yes a meaningful power in the actual Cosmere), Pretty sure that the time and BS will show who of all of us is right, but I still thinking that Harmony has an intent, but a less imperative one. It cannot change Sazed as hard as a single shard, but it still does something. If not, we would have a smaller version of Adonalsium (which it actually is, but not in the way I mean).

 

Before letting the text out, I want to insist on everyone that I'm not confirming anything, just speculating