Confused Posted August 17, 2015 Report Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) I’m intrigued by Jasnah’s description of Shadesmar as a place where the unconscious is given expression and spren “leak out” into the Physical Realm. How does something called the Cognitive Realm (which definitionally means “Conscious” Realm) deal with the Unconscious? “Shadesmar is the way that your cognitive self – your unconscious self – experiences the world. Through your hidden senses, touching that realm, you make intuitive leaps of logic and you form hopes. It is likely through those extra senses that you, Shallan, create art.” - WoR, Kindle p. 40. This is a definitionally false statement. To be a true statement would mean Brandon simply picked a word (“cognitive”) he uses as jargon rather than its actual meaning. And that’s okay (provided we, therefore, take everything Brandon says, even textually, with suspicion…which I guess we already do.) For my personal theories, it works much better for Shadesmar to have both conscious and unconscious features, to be like a “human mind” in Cosmere truth. I received a lot of flak for my “Shattering” theory, specifically the notion that the power chose each Shard because of its “cognitive like-mindedness.” I claimed that the impulses/emotions each Shard’s mandate represents mirrored the unconscious drives of the persons who became Shards. This theory hasn’t mattered much so far, but I still think it valid. Aside [i referenced in that post the 1956 classic Sci-Fi movie The Forbidden Planet. In that movie, longtime actor Walter Pidgeon plays a scientist who discovers a massive machine built by an ancient alien civilization. He has a daughter, played by Anne Francis (later of 1960’s TV fame starring as female detective “Honey West”). They have been stranded alone for awhile, after Mommy died. A space ship arrives seeking to rescue Daddy and Daughter. Space ship captain Leslie Nielsen (yes, that Leslie Nielsen) and Daughter fall for each other. Daddy gets upset. It turns out massive alien machine has “bonded” with Daddy, turning his unconscious thoughts into “Physical Realm” power. That power kills many of the crew before Daddy realizes what he’s done and sacrifices himself to allow Daughter and Captain to escape. Does the “magic” sound familiar? BTW, this movie was the first appearance of “Robby the Robot” who went on to star in the Lost in Space TV series.] I’ve also been making a case to Kurkistan about unconscious healing. He says such healing begins as “Spiritual Realm impulses” flowing down to the Cognitive Realm. These impulses take a snapshot of a person’s self-perception (their cognitive self-image), and make the necessary adjustments to the body to effect any changes – “healing.” I posit the opposite mechanism. The body’s self-perception arises mostly in one’s unconscious – we think about it only a few times a day if that much. Changes in self-perception are themselves a series of Cognitive Realm ideas that regularly reify into new Spiritual Realm ideals/connections. Those new ideals/connections effect Physical Realm changes to one’s body – “healing.” In the Spiritual Realm, each new cognitive “idea” of a changed self-perception gets compared with the Spiritual Realm template. The Spiritual Realm only makes those changes “requested” by the Cognitive Realm idea. If the new self-perception idea doesn’t "request" a slave brand’s removal, it doesn’t happen. That’s how the Spiritual Realm deals with the self-perception issue. The significance? The unconscious mind can generate magic, just like the conscious mind can. “ALL MAGIC BEGINS IN THE COGNITIVE REALM.” (Repetition makes it true…) Edited August 17, 2015 by Confused 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurkistan he/him Posted August 17, 2015 Report Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) I’m intrigued by Jasnah’s description of Shadesmar as a place where the unconscious is given expression and spren “leak out” into the Physical Realm. How does something called the Cognitive Realm (which definitionally means “Conscious” Realm) deal with the Unconscious? You may be using too narrow a definition of "Cognitive." A cursory search shows us that Wikipedia, at the least, would have us believe that cognition encompasses both the conscious and unconscious mind. So huzzah for models that want the Cognitive realm to be both conscious and unconscious. I’ve also been making a case to Kurkistan about unconscious healing. He says such healing begins as “Spiritual Realm impulses” flowing down to the Cognitive Realm. These impulses take a snapshot of a person’s self-perception (their cognitive self-image), and make the necessary adjustments to the body to effect any changes – “healing.” I posit the opposite mechanism. The body’s self-perception arises mostly in one’s unconscious – we think about it only a few times a day if that much. Changes in self-perception are themselves a series of Cognitive Realm ideas that regularly reify into new Spiritual Realm ideals/connections. Those new ideals/connections effect Physical Realm changes to one’s body – “healing.” In the Spiritual Realm, each new cognitive “idea” of a changed self-perception gets compared with the Spiritual Realm template. The Spiritual Realm only makes those changes “requested” by the Cognitive Realm idea. If the new self-perception idea doesn’t "request" a slave brand’s removal, it doesn’t happen. That’s how the Spiritual Realm deals with the self-perception issue. I don't believe I've talked much of snapshots; it's more a matter of filtering. A question about this request-to-change model of healing: how does it work in the extreme short term? So Miles gets his hand blown off while tapping a lot of Feruchemical gold: does either his Cognitive or his Spiritual aspect actually change into a handless version of Miles in the instant before the hand grows back? If not, what "new" changes to the Spiritual aspect are there to affect healing in your model? Edited August 17, 2015 by Kurkistan Clarifying first response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confused Posted August 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) I speculate through his compounding that Miles could access his investiture faster than any known KR. (It's hard for me to compare with a Returned.) His healing would occur extremely quickly, as it always does, until it runs out. (Internal versus external source.) Realmatic theory (I think) dictates that great power requires great consciousness to wield it - as the power fills a person, the mind also expands. I'll quote myself to save me the trouble of rephrasing everything: "There is a direct relationship between the amount of investiture and the level of consciousness of the holder. This rule applies to spren, to humans and even Shards – both Vin and Sazed experience a much broader consciousness when they acquire the mists and the Shards, respectively. Sazed’s expanded consciousness exceeds Vin’s, commensurate with their respective power levels. The reason is that 'consciousness' to power is simply the ability to direct its exercise. It is not 'thoughts and personalities.' Power just wants someone to wield it. Realmatic theory also helps explain this – if all things exist in three realms, then greater power theoretically comes with expanded 'consciousness,' all other things being equal." In your example, Miles would have enormous power available to him for a short time. That power would necessarily expand his mind's capacity to process (direct) the power. Either through (i) the unconscious shock of losing his hand and wanting its immediate replacement, or (ii) Miles' conscious decision to regrow his hand, Miles' mind would try as hard as it could to retain his appendage. And the Spiritual Realm would work just as hard, in response, right along with it. There would never be a moment when Miles' self-perception lacks a hand. With Miles, because of the amount of short term investiture available to him, healing is almost instantaneous. Miles' self-perception never wavers because he knows in his soul (metaphorically) that he will immediately heal. Implicit in your question (given the WoB) is the nature of the "Platonic form" for healing. Does the "form" for Miles' hand come from his own "soul" or elsewhere? I think of the soul as the blueprint for the "person" - that concatenation of connections that make you YOU. The blueprint includes both physical and "cognitive" aspects. As to the physical, each body consists of identical components. We all (mostly) have the same bones, the same muscles, the same brain tissue, etc. These components have their own "forms." The soul, the blueprint, integrates those components, those forms, into itself, conforming them to who YOU are. The conversation between Hesina and her sons on their rooftop during the Weeping provides evidence. Tien asks if he has a spren. Hesina answers: "You have a soul, dear. You're a person. But the pieces of your body may very well have spren living in them. Very small ones." - WoK, Kindle p. 539-40. This statement highlights the difference between WHO YOU ARE and WHAT YOU ARE MADE OF. The "form" of Miles' hand is the Platonic form of "hand" integrated into Miles' soul, his blueprint. Self-perception is part of that blueprint, because it is an idea that becomes reified into an ideal, into that person's soul. I know streams run low this late in summer, but my goodness, there's little life in these waters...It's you and me, my friend! Edited August 26, 2015 by Confused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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