Aluminum, Silver, and the Metallic Arts rant

[lacrossedeamon]

I know silver was originally going to be in the place of tin but I think given how it interact with other forms of Investiture it should have had the place of aluminum in the Metallic Arts. I get that Sanderson wanted a secret/rare metal and Scadrial is our closest Earth analogue with Era mapping onto the late Age of Enlightenment which predates the discovery of the Wohler and Bayer processes. But Sanderson then immediately undercuts this by also have electrum (a silver alloy even) as a secret metal which doesn't have a similar corresponding IRL history. I also just don't think aluminum should be allomantically, feruchemically, or hemalurgically viable at all.

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

11 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

I know silver was originally going to be in the place of tin but I think given how it interact with other forms of Investiture it should have had the place of aluminum in the Metallic Arts. I get that Sanderson wanted a secret/rare metal and Scadrial is our closest Earth analogue with Era mapping onto the late Age of Enlightenment which predates the discovery of the Wohler and Bayer processes. But Sanderson then immediately undercuts this by also have electrum (a silver alloy even) as a secret metal which doesn't have a similar corresponding IRL history. I also just don't think aluminum should be allomantically, feruchemically, or hemalurgically viable at all.

First of all, Silver is far too anti-investiture of a metal to agree with the metalic arts at all. Like, look across the cosmere at what silver does. It is all about being against investiture. However, aluminum just blocks the flow. Therefore, it makes far more sense, because after burning aluminum, you can still ingest more metals. That probably wouldn't still be like that with silver. Their nature would cause silver to have a much more destructive presence than aluminum.

[lacrossedeamon]

1 hour ago, CoderDrag0n8 said:

First of all, Silver is far too anti-investiture of a metal to agree with the metalic arts at all. Like, look across the cosmere at what silver does. It is all about being against investiture. However, aluminum just blocks the flow. Therefore, it makes far more sense, because after burning aluminum, you can still ingest more metals. That probably wouldn't still be like that with silver. Their nature would cause silver to have a much more destructive presence than aluminum.

I have been looking at what silver does across the cosmere. I say in my post that is exactly why I think this. Additionally, Allomantic aluminum doesn't just block the flow. It actively wipes all the stored metals. To me that sounds like silver's dispersal of Investiture. It's obviously not super destructive otherwise the fused would have been using it against Spren more.

[Treamayne]

On 7/8/2025 at 1:31 PM, lacrossedeamon said:

Additionally, Allomantic aluminum doesn't just block the flow. It actively wipes all the stored metals.

In practice, yes. But technically not correct. Both Aluminum and Duralumin "metabolize" all metals nearly-instantaneously. Duralumin releases all the effect in the compressed rate of time. Aluminum blocks the investiture that would normally be released from the Spiritual Realm by burning metals - meaning you burn all of the metal and get none of the effect.

It does not actually destroy the metals themselves (or the released investiture)  - just prevents the effect from completing successfully. 

WoB:

Spoiler

Quote

Andrew The Great (paraphrased)

What would happen if a person were to burn a metal that was Feruchemically charged using Allomancy?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

The metal used in Allomancy is like a key or a doorway to the power that Allomancy actually uses. The metal acts as a filter, much as the Aons in Elantris do, to determine what the power actually does. However, if the metal is Feruchemically charged, then it will basically become a super-burst of Feruchemical power with no Allomantic effect. The Feruchemical charge acts as a filter as well as the metal, and changes what the power does. in this case, say you were burning steel, you would just be massively speedy for a second, and wouldn't actually have the ability to push on anything Allomantically. Hope that answered the question. I get the concept, so if you need me to explain it differently, let me know and I'll try. Oh, the other thing I forgot is that this concept only works if it's a metal that you charged yourself. If it's a metal someone else charged, it would just work like regular Allomancy, and the Feruchemical charge would just cease to exist.

Andrew The Great (paraphrased)

If someone aluminum or duralumin burned the Feruchemically charged metals, what would happen?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Basically the same thing as above, except with aluminum. Aluminum, they would just go away.

Idaho Falls Signing (June 20, 2009)

Quote

Questioner

Mistborn travels to Roshar, what does he or she use to get Invested?

Brandon Sanderson

*pause* So. *pause* I think I've talked about this before on the 17th Shard, but I'm not 100% sure and so I don't want to anything right now, not knowing what I've said. But you can look it up. You can ask Peter. Hey Peter, have I talked about someone using-- Have I ever in an interview before talked about using metals... A Mistborn travels to Roshar and uses the metals there?

Peter Ahlstrom

I think that you have said that they could do it.

Brandon Sanderson

I said it.  Okay, so the thing about the metals you have to understand is the metals are a key, the metals are not magical themselves, except for specific ones. If I've already said that I can tell you, go to Roshar and you could use the metals that are there to power your Allomancy because the difference is in your soul and you're actually drawing directly from Preservation. Remember that on the Spiritual Realm, this is the big tidbit--they're listening. On the Spiritual Realm time, distance, and space are irrelevant. It's a place where time and space are compounded in one. So anything that exists on the Spiritual Realm, space doesn't matter for it.

Shadows of Self release party (Oct. 5, 2015)

 

Hope that helps

Edited July 30, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

1 hour ago, lacrossedeamon said:

I have been looking at what silver does across the cosmere. I say in my post that is exactly why I think this. Additionally, Allomantic aluminum doesn't just block the flow. It actively wipes all the stored metals. To me that sounds like silver's dispersal of Investiture. It's obviously not super destructive otherwise the fused would have been using it against Spren more.

 

1 hour ago, Treamayne said:

In practice, yes. But technically not correct. Both Aluminum and Duralumin "metabolize" all metals nearly-instantaneously. Durlumin releases all the effect in the compressed rate of time. Aluminum blocks the investiture that would normally be released from the Spiritual Realm by burning metals - meaning you burn all of the metal and get none of the effect.

It does not actually destroy the metals themselves (or the released investiture)  - just prevents the effect from completing successfully. 

WoB:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Hope that helps

yeah what he said

[lacrossedeamon]

8 hours ago, Treamayne said:

Hope that helps

 

7 hours ago, CoderDrag0n8 said:

yeah what he said

Not really because that still means aluminum is doing more than just blocking investiture. It is also forcing your body to also burn the other metals. Otherwise the scene where Vin is captured doesn't work. (Sidenote: Brandon toyed with actually having it be silver in that scene before going with aluminum for the reference to its scarcity in the corresponding IRL historical period but then undercuts that reasoning by introducing electrum.) Similarly aluminum doesn't just block the flow of other types of investiture but actively flushes them. For example if I am holding Stormlight and burn aluminum the stormlight doesn't just leak from my body at the regular pace but is unusable, it is removed from my system.

This doesn't even get into aluminum is able to be feruchemically or hemalurgically charged. I don't think it should be able to be charged because I don't think it should be able to hold investiture like that. And can you even compound it then? You might say silver replacing it causes similar issues but to me silver interacting with investiture one way and then interacting with it another way is more logical than aluminum being investiture inert except in this specific case.

I could see aluminum having a use by blocking a person from burning any metals at all because it causes a shadow that makes the magic system not recognizing the person. But it should exist outside the 16 metals imo.

[Duxredux he/him]

You have to understand that the Metallic Arts and the chart with the 16 metals are the arcanists' interpretation of the observable state of the Invested Arts of Scadrial. If it breaks the rules, then that just means the existing chart is incomplete and flawed. Vin believed the pattern where a pure metal if properly alloyed with an additional element could exhibit a different effect - that's how Duralumin was invented/reintroduced in the first place. Presumably Seekers also confirmed that Aluminum and Duralumin followed the same format where one felt like a Pull, the other felt like a Push. The introduction of Aluminum confirms that it is detectable when the Inquisitor force-fed Vin and made her wipe her metals, waiting for the proper pulse pattern before letting her go.

Silver as a pure metal was tested as an Allomantic metal but it did apparently nothing, nor could it be detected by a Seeker. That is why it did not end up on the Allomantic table, even though it is a component of Electrum. It's as viable as the carbon added to Iron to make Allomantic Steel.

As for Aluminum belonging in the conversation with Feruchemy... it absolutely belongs on the table because whether or not it can hold a charge is separate from the fact that Feruchemists have the ability to siphon off their Identity into Aluminum at all. The rest of how that storage or withdrawal is as yet undefined, as many are quick to point out, but that a Full Feruchemist can direct one of their attributes into Aluminum? Storing Identity into Aluminim is a distinct Feruchemical ability that can be harvested by Hemalurgy. Presumably they have tried and learned they cannot do any attribute siphoning into Silver.

As for Aluminum and Hemalurgy... well it depends on how they did the testing. If just stabbing an Aluminum spike into a person is one thing, but doing the exact same thing with the proper Hemalurgic Intent removes all powers? Then yeah, it's Hemalurgically relevant because that utility requires the proper knowledge and Intent. Holding a metal spike and having it punch into not just the flesh but the Spiritweb targeting specific attributes? That's Hemalurgy regardless of if the charge sticks or not.

Edited July 19, 2025 by Duxredux
clarity

[lacrossedeamon]

On 7/18/2025 at 8:48 PM, Duxredux said:

You have to understand that the Metallic Arts and the chart with the 16 metals are the arcanists' interpretation of the observable state of the Invested Arts of Scadrial. If it breaks the rules, then that just means the existing chart is incomplete and flawed. Vin believed the pattern where a pure metal if properly alloyed with an additional element could exhibit a different effect - that's how Duralumin was invented/reintroduced in the first place. Presumably Seekers also confirmed that Aluminum and Duralumin followed the same format where one felt like a Pull, the other felt like a Push. The introduction of Aluminum confirms that it is detectable when the Inquisitor force-fed Vin and made her wipe her metals, waiting for the proper pulse pattern before letting her go.

Silver as a pure metal was tested as an Allomantic metal but it did apparently nothing, nor could it be detected by a Seeker. That is why it did not end up on the Allomantic table, even though it is a component of Electrum. It's as viable as the carbon added to Iron to make Allomantic Steel.

As for Aluminum belonging in the conversation with Feruchemy... it absolutely belongs on the table because whether or not it can hold a charge is separate from the fact that Feruchemists have the ability to siphon off their Identity into Aluminum at all. The rest of how that storage or withdrawal is as yet undefined, as many are quick to point out, but that a Full Feruchemist can direct one of their attributes into Aluminum? Storing Identity into Aluminim is a distinct Feruchemical ability that can be harvested by Hemalurgy. Presumably they have tried and learned they cannot do any attribute siphoning into Silver.

As for Aluminum and Hemalurgy... well it depends on how they did the testing. If just stabbing an Aluminum spike into a person is one thing, but doing the exact same thing with the proper Hemalurgic Intent removes all powers? Then yeah, it's Hemalurgically relevant because that utility requires the proper knowledge and Intent. Holding a metal spike and having it punch into not just the flesh but the Spiritweb targeting specific attributes? That's Hemalurgy regardless of if the charge sticks or not.

You are looking at this from a Watsonian perspective. There is some of that going on here but I also disagree with Brandon's justification from a Doylist one.

[Treamayne]

On 7/19/2025 at 5:00 PM, lacrossedeamon said:

You are looking at this from a Watsonian perspective. There is some of that going on here but I also disagree with Brandon's justification from a Doylist one.

I'm not sure if this is your "Doylist" reasoning, but you keep leaning hard on:

On 7/8/2025 at 10:34 PM, lacrossedeamon said:

(Sidenote: Brandon toyed with actually having it be silver in that scene before going with aluminum for the reference to its scarcity in the corresponding IRL historical period but then undercuts that reasoning by introducing electrum.)

1. Electrum is a naturally occuring alloy - Scadrians could have been using it for ages without realizing it was an alloy at all. 
   • Note: Metalurgic Sciences are advanced on Scadrial (compared to the rest of the Cosmere) so they likely figured it out during the Final Empire - but TLR was hiding Electrum's allomantic properties - so why would Nobles like Lord Shezler ever waste time working with it?
2. Having Silver content in Electrum does not matter at all
   • Alluminum's spiritual properties are inheritable by aluminum alloys
   • Silver's spiritual properties are not inheritable - an alloy of Silver will not affect investiture the way that Silver does. 
3. If that is not the basis of your "Doylist" reason, please clarify. 

Spoiler

Longshot_97

This question concerns Mistborn Era 2. Aluminum at this time is supremely rare and quite expensive, and Wax is seen lamenting his profound lack of aluminum guns and bullets fairly often. However, couldn't he fashion a "Poor Man's Aluminum" of sorts by coating his guns (and potentially bullets) in a thin veneer of iron, then Feruchemically charging it? You've noted that metalminds can still be pushed, but much less than un-Invested metal. This could help him, in the absence of aluminum. So, is there a reason he has not done that?

Brandon Sanderson

The layer you would get by just that little coat would be so small that it'd have very little effect. Now, there's a pretty good argument for putting it into bullets. The problem there is: are the alloys that make good bullets going to work very well? Now, granted, aluminum doesn’t make for great bullets either. But any aluminum alloy kind of gets the property of aluminum. Where any iron alloy does not necessarily get the property of being able to allomantically or feruchemically interact with it in the right way. Can you get there? It's an excellent question that I perhaps should explore. I like this idea. But it's harder than you make it out to be. It is a good idea, though; it's a pretty good idea.

r/books AMA 2022 (July 7, 2022)

 

[lacrossedeamon]

On 7/30/2025 at 12:41 PM, Treamayne said:

1. Electrum is a naturally occuring alloy - Scadrians could have been using it for ages without realizing it was an alloy at all. 
   • Note: Metalurgic Sciences are advanced on Scadrial (compared to the rest of the Cosmere) so they likely figured it out during the Final Empire - but TLR was hiding Electrum's allomantic properties - so why would Nobles like Lord Shezler ever waste time working with it?

The fact that TLR can hide the allomantic and feruchemical abilities of a common metal like electrum undermines the justification for using aluminum over silver since we don't need to say oh this is a rare metal we can just say TLR was also hiding silvers allomantic and feruchemical abilities as well.

On 7/30/2025 at 12:41 PM, Treamayne said:

1. Having Silver content in Electrum does not matter at all
   • Alluminum's spiritual properties are inheritable by aluminum alloys
   • Silver's spiritual properties are not inheritable - an alloy of Silver will not affect investiture the way that Silver does. 

I don't see why this matters. But aluminum (and it alloys to a degree) would keep its property of not being pull or pushable and shielding against emotional allomancy.

On 7/30/2025 at 12:41 PM, Treamayne said:

1. If that is not the basis of your "Doylist" reason, please clarify. 

Basically Sanderson justifies using aluminum over silver as being a secret metal due to real world scarcity in analogous time period but then later says TLR can suppress the knowledge of even non scarce metals. Given that, I think silver should have been kept as the wiping metal with that same excuse for why it was secret. With how silver and aluminum interact with investiture in other systems it fits better anyways in my opinion.

[Treamayne]

13 minutes ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Basically Sanderson justifies using aluminum over silver as being a secret metal due to real world scarcity in analogous time period but then later says TLR can suppress the knowledge of even non scarce metals.

It was not just that Aluminum is scarce before an Industrialized society - it was because Aluminum becomes ubiquitious during and after an Industrialized society. Silver's scarcity is not tied to the technology level of society in such a way (except tangentially, with new mining techniques). Rashek didn't hide the existence of metals, merely obfuscated which metals had Allomantic Properties. Feruchemists lost the understanding of which metals were Feruchemically viable storages because Rashek effectively killed all living Feruchemists when he turned them into Mistwraiths and created the Kandra. Modern Feruchemists didn't look beyond the known "10 Metals" (that we know of) because the generations born after TLR's Ascension had to relearn everything about Feruchemy. 

I'm sorry you don't like it.

Edited August 3, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[lacrossedeamon]

21 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

It was not just that Aluminum is scarce before an Industrialized society - it was because Aluminum becomes ubiquitious during and after an Industrialized society. Silver's scarcity is not tied to the technology level of society in such a way (except tangentially, with new mining techniques).

That's not the justification Sanderson gives.

Spoiler

Brandon Sanderson

Chapter Sixty - Part One

Silver, the Useless Metal

I've annotated about this before, but I figured I'd mention it again. As you probably know, in book one, tin was originally silver. I swapped it out for various reasons.

However, that left silver having no Allomantic powers. That feels strange to a lot of people because of how common and useful it is in our modern culture. Such an obvious metal doing nothing seems wrong to readers.

I toyed with using it in place of aluminum at the end of book one, but I realized that wouldn't work. It was too common, so if it had any Allomantic powers, people would know about them for certain. Only a metal that was very hard to find—like aluminum—would be believable as a new metal that most people hadn't heard of.

So silver is Allomantically inert. Just one of the quirks of the magic system.

The Hero of Ages Annotations (Feb. 11, 2010)

This is where I have issues. Silver having unknown allomantic abilities is unbelievable but electrum is fine? It just gets too contrived for my tastes. Too many hoops to jump through.

13 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

Rashek didn't hide the existence of metals, merely obfuscated which metals had Allomantic Properties. Feruchemists lost the understanding of which metals were Feruchemically viable storages because Rashek effectively killed all living Feruchemists when he turned them into Mistwraiths and created the Kandra. Modern Feruchemists didn't look beyond the known "10 Metals" (that we know of) because the generations born after TLR's Ascension had to relearn everything about Feruchemy. 

Yeah I get that. I didn't mean to imply Rashek was suppressing knowledge of the metals themselves with the quoted line, just their ability.

16 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

I'm sorry you don't like it.

It's less about not liking it and more that it actively doesn't make sense to me (even accounting for all the prior discussion in this thread) given what we know of aluminum.

[Treamayne]

3 minutes ago, lacrossedeamon said:

That's not the justification Sanderson gives.

There are more WoBs:

Spoiler

Quote

Questioner

What's the deal with silver? Why does it not fit cleanly into the Allomantic metals, why is aluminum a special one and not silver. Why is it silver powder and not aluminum powder on Threnody? These kinds of questions.

Brandon Sanderson

Do you want the in-world answer... or the writerly answer?

Questioner

Well really I want the in-world answer.

Brandon Sanderson

...The in-world answer is that people are not sure yet.

Questioner

Well, that's not the in-world answer. That's the in world answer from Khriss, right? What about the in-world answer from--

Brandon Sanderson

That's the in-world answer--they're not sure yet...

The writerly answer is that we started with silver in place of tin. And by the time I swapped it out, aluminum was already its thing. If I had to do it over again, I might make silver aluminum, but I wanted what aluminum does to be rare, and silver isn't. So I might not have. I love what aluminum does because it's super-rare pre-industrial, but you hit industrial and it's everywhere.

So it allowed me to do, when we get to modern era, to have real checks on Allomancy as Allomancy gets more powerful.

Emerald City Comic Con 2018 (March 1, 2018)

 

 

7 minutes ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Silver having unknown allomantic abilities is unbelievable but electrum is fine?

Silver does not have unknown allomantic abilities - it has none. It is Allomantically inert (as is Carbon, but that happens to be part of Steel, for example).

10 minutes ago, lacrossedeamon said:

It's less about not liking it and more that it actively doesn't make sense to me (even accounting for all the prior discussion in this thread) given what we know of aluminum.

Aluminum is meant to block investiture, be rare pre-industrial, and become uniquitous post-industrial offering checks and balances on all MoIs (especially the Metallic Arts). It is also meant to open up technological solutions to Fabrial (MagiTech) applications as the worlds grow in understanting of Scientific Method and begin to really break down and process the deeper applications of MoIs.

Stormlight Archive Spoilers:

Spoiler

For example, the use of blocking planes of force in the spanreeds and other conjoined fabrials. Allowing deeper applications of known processes. 

Note: Fabrial is one of the terms that will eventually apply to any technologic application of Investiture. WoB:

Spoiler

FirstSelector

So, do you have a name, like an in-world name for a large magical construction, like the things that picks Elantrians?

Brandon Sanderson

That was why I invented the term "fabrial." It will become widespread eventually, as the term for meaning, kind of, magic-type devices in the cosmere. That's not what you call it right now, but you can start calling them all fabrials.

FirstSelector

But what about something that isn't, like-- I always imagined that Aona left, like, a device, a magical device running--

Brandon Sanderson

I will have to RAFO that.

Oathbringer San Francisco signing (Nov. 15, 2017)

Hope that helps

[lacrossedeamon]

21 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

There are more WoBs:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Right sanderson wanted a scarce metal that became less scarce over time so its allomantic abilities were more common as society progressed. But this is still undercut by electrum since as a metal it doesn't necessarily change in availability but its powers become more common over time as the knowledge disseminates.  The reasoning is different, material scarcity vs information scarcity, but the practical outcome, gnats and oracles becoming more common, is similar. And the same could be done with silver and it would still keep the checks on allomancy in the modern era unchanged.

6 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

Silver does not have unknown allomantic abilities - it has none. It is Allomantically inert (as is Carbon, but that happens to be part of Steel, for example).

You misunderstood my statement here. I know it doesn't. Sanderson is saying if it did it would be unbelievable but I am contrasting it with electrum which should be almost as unbelievable given his reasoning.

18 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

Aluminum is meant to block investiture, be rare pre-industrial, and become uniquitous post-industrial offering checks and balances on all MoIs (especially the Metallic Arts). It is also meant to open up technological solutions to Fabrial (MagiTech) applications as the worlds grow in understanting of Scientific Method and begin to really break down and process the deeper applications of MoIs.

Stormlight Archive Spoilers:

  Reveal hidden contents

For example, the use of blocking planes of force in the spanreeds and other conjoined fabrials. Allowing deeper applications of known processes. 

Note: Fabrial is one of the terms that will eventually apply to any technologic application of Investiture. WoB:

  Reveal hidden contents

FirstSelector

So, do you have a name, like an in-world name for a large magical construction, like the things that picks Elantrians?

Brandon Sanderson

That was why I invented the term "fabrial." It will become widespread eventually, as the term for meaning, kind of, magic-type devices in the cosmere. That's not what you call it right now, but you can start calling them all fabrials.

FirstSelector

But what about something that isn't, like-- I always imagined that Aona left, like, a device, a magical device running--

Brandon Sanderson

I will have to RAFO that.

Oathbringer San Francisco signing (Nov. 15, 2017)

Hope that helps

Not really because I know all this already. As I said previously I would not be removing aluminum's investiture blocking ability. You still wouldn't be able to push or pull it; you still could use it to block soothing or rioting; you still could use it in fabrials the same way; you still couldn't soulcast it into something else. In almost every instance investiture basically doesn't even seem to recognize aluminum (or things covered in it) as existing but then can still be burned and stored/tapped which is weird for me. Given how silver interacts with spores and shades it being the allomantic wiping metal instead (and Identity metalmind by extension) is logical to me.

But I think at this point we are just talking in circles around each other.

[Treamayne]

8 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

the practical outcome, gnats and oracles becoming more common, is similar.

Not even close to similar - Aluminum is currently $0.08 per troy ounce (as of 20250803). The Powers of the other metals may be more widely understood, but that does not mean that the metals themselves are cheap and ubiquitous. Silver could never match that kind of shear availability. 

8 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

Given how silver interacts with spores and shades it being the allomantic wiping metal instead (and Identity metalmind by extension) is logical to me.

And I am the exact opposite. Given how Silver interacts with spores and shades (and other MoIs) it makes zero sense as the Gnat metal to me. I doubt an allomancer could even survive that kind of caustic reaction happening inside their bodies with a open conduit directly to the Spiritual Realm. But, more importantly. . . Aluminum does not "wipe" metals - it is not an act of destruction and you can't divorce the realmatic principal at work from the other properties of Aluminum that you see as being "fine." Think of it like Halon (Halon 1211 - aka Bromochlorodifluoromethane (BCF)) - Halon does not destroy Fire - it blocks the chemical reactions of Oxygen starving a fire (without residue or conductivity since it is liquified gas). Aluminum burning in Allomancy does the same, it blocks the reaction that allows metals to release Investiture from the Spiritual Realm. Additionally, no Silver Primary alloy would produce the effects of Duralumin. 

8 hours ago, lacrossedeamon said:

But I think at this point we are just talking in circles around each other.

Concur. We'll have to agree to disagree. 

[lacrossedeamon]

On 8/3/2025 at 8:58 AM, Treamayne said:

Not even close to similar - Aluminum is currently $0.08 per troy ounce (as of 20250803). The Powers of the other metals may be more widely understood, but that does not mean that the metals themselves are cheap and ubiquitous. Silver could never match that kind of shear availability. 

Doesn't really have to. The number of gnats isn't enough for this to be a real issue. And when Sazed can artificially create fossil fuel reserves he can do the same for whatever metal he wants. Plus the economy of metals on Scadrial won't be that reflective of Earth's in the same way that the economy of gemstones on Roshar is different from on Earth.

On 8/3/2025 at 8:58 AM, Treamayne said:

And I am the exact opposite. Given how Silver interacts with spores and shades (and other MoIs) it makes zero sense as the Gnat metal to me. I doubt an allomancer could even survive that kind of caustic reaction happening inside their bodies with a open conduit directly to the Spiritual Realm.

That is an interesting take that I hadn't considered and could see the validity of it. But given silver's interaction with stopping shade withering and lack of adverse effect on the person I don't think it would be as bad as you think.

On 8/3/2025 at 8:58 AM, Treamayne said:

But, more importantly. . . Aluminum does not "wipe" metals - it is not an act of destruction and you can't divorce the realmatic principal at work from the other properties of Aluminum that you see as being "fine." Think of it like Halon (Halon 1211 - aka Bromochlorodifluoromethane (BCF)) - Halon does not destroy Fire - it blocks the chemical reactions of Oxygen starving a fire (without residue or conductivity since it is liquified gas). Aluminum burning in Allomancy does the same, it blocks the reaction that allows metals to release Investiture from the Spiritual Realm.

I looked into this more and I think you are wrong here. Khriss inconsistently states both "aluminum destroys reserves" and "aluminum causes metabolization of other metals but to no effect" but reading the Vin capture scene implies the former. Even if it is the latter that means aluminum isn't just blocking but also forcing another effect which I would have a problem with. And if that is the case then it doesn't pair well with duralumin because with it you still have to consciously burn the other metals; it's not automatic.

Honestly with my system (silver being the gnat metal) I could see aluminum still acting similar but you just don't burn it. If it is in your body it would prevent you from consciously burning other metals or at least block the effect without the aluminum itself depleting. Similar to how aluminum blocks invested healing when in the body but that doesn't deplete the aluminum.

On 8/3/2025 at 8:58 AM, Treamayne said:

Additionally, no Silver Primary alloy would produce the effects of Duralumin. 

Why not? It would just have the pushing effect like all the other alloys. Unless you are saying boosting the allomantic effect is not the same correct pushing foil to wiping reserves. That I could agree with but feel that also applies somewhat to aluminum and duralumin as pointed out above.

On 8/3/2025 at 8:58 AM, Treamayne said:

Concur. We'll have to agree to disagree. 

I know I said it's basically futile to continue but I can't just help responding.