6/23/25-ginger_reckoning-a song for silence, sub 25-4326 words (L, S)

[ginger_reckoning]

Hey all! Thanks again for reading. This is preparing for the next big action section, which will be  the end of act 2 and then going into the climax. Mostly just interested in hearing general notes, I don't have much specific for this section. There is an implied fade to black sex scene at the end of the second chapter of this submission, which was literally written just because I didn't know how to end the scene, so if you have suggestions on something else or if you think it's fine, please let me know. 

[Paul SB]

I was in surgery all day yesterday, so I've only had time to read over Ch.33. I'll get to the next chapter soon, I hope (though Space Wizard just released "Lesbians in Space" which one of my old writing buddied has a story in, so I'm going to have to convince Autistic Son #2 to leave me alone long enough to read it).

 

A Song for Silence, submission 25

by Spencer Wilkinson

 

Chapter 33

 

“ …(definitely not hoped. What are you saying?)” - This is called an Author Intrusion, and is usually advised to not do. However, some of the funniest books out there use author intrusions all the time to great effect. If this book is intended to be comedy, keep it. If not, a lot of editors will tell you to dump it.

 

 

“… weirdly revealing and impractical looking outfits.” Hilarious, though I hope you’ll elaborate on the kind of people who wear those outfits. BTW: impractical-looking (it’s a compound adjective)

 

 

“Same to you,” does not sound like a friendly or even polite response here. Glad to be back? Glad to see you, too?

 

“… you will not find umbrage …” - now this is a vocabulary choice that fits with the genre.

 

“I bet the Chorus could get it glowing again with their magic…” Last 3 words are redundant.

 

“ … me and my big mouth” - … me and my big mouth,”

 

“Celedrand’s lights were powered by a suffering orphan.” - Ursula LeGuin fan? “The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas”

 

“ er, “no sounds time” - another author intrusion

 

“We agreed to a truce, remember?” - Wow, Amara just lost a couple tons of empathetic character points!

 

“Magic is arguably based on aesthetics.” - Partially. Magic is wishful thinking, and most human thought is analogical. That is, we tend to think that if something looks like something, it must be like it in other ways. Logic begins where analogical stops. Logic checks to see if those similarities are real and not just aesthetic illusions.

 

“Silence, Jean, stop flirting …” - At this point I don’t remember what sort of body Silence is wearing. This might be a good spot to remind the reader by having Amara reflect on their aesthetics for a second.

 

 

[ginger_reckoning]

5 hours ago, Paul SB said:

“ …(definitely not hoped. What are you saying?)” - This is called an Author Intrusion, and is usually advised to not do. However, some of the funniest books out there use author intrusions all the time to great effect. If this book is intended to be comedy, keep it. If not, a lot of editors will tell you to dump it.

Thanks for the reply! I'm hoping to get my critique of your work done this evening. As for this quote, yeah, I had a lot more auhtor intrusions at the beginning of the story and they have kind of tapered off. I want to keep them, so I might add more honestly, when I do a line-edit pass on the second draft. Still not sure though. 

5 hours ago, Paul SB said:

“Celedrand’s lights were powered by a suffering orphan.” - Ursula LeGuin fan? “The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas”

Yessir, huge LeGuin fan actually haha. I am also an anarchist so she is one of my top favorite authors of all time. Anyway, I didn't draw up a map for this book because I didn't find it necessary for this story, but there are no continents, only islands as a reference to Earthsea as well. There is a last reference to Left Hand of Darkness I plan to include in the epilogue too. I am a little worried since the Omelas reference ended up being a pretty significant part of the story, and I definitely don't want to plagiarize, but I feel like it's fair use, though I don't know for sure

5 hours ago, Paul SB said:

We agreed to a truce, remember?” - Wow, Amara just lost a couple tons of empathetic character points!

Well that's not good! While I do want her to not necessarily be super sweet, I definitely don't want people to not empathize. I mean, for context, she still views S as mostly a villain here, but do you have any suggestions to not make her seem to vindictive?

 

[Paul SB]

I think, given the circumstances, Amara should show a little more regret that she asked that question in the first place. It's easy to burst out something you regret saying later. A decent person admits they were wrong, an egotist won't. She should probably want to see the orphan, and see that the kid is safe and has a future. That's concern she should be expressing, I think, to return some sense of decency.

[Paul SB]

Okay, I just read Ch. 34, and I honestly don't have a whole lot of feedback to give you. Partly it's that I don't have a clue what's going on, but also I was having too much fun snickering at the jokes. The chapter went way off the semi-serious track. If you've done this before, maybe a couple times, it would work. Otherwise it seems a little off.

 

Chapter 34

 

Floating City? Are you a Miyazaki fan, too? Or do you go back to Jonathon Swift?

 

Turned a pine tree into frogs? And now it’s a Christmas tree. Fun stuff!

 

Only one X for Muncho Flux?

 

I’m not sure where the image of the newscaster is being displayed. Is it in a magic mirror, or a window, or in the air overhead?

 

“If you find one of our tickets …” says Willy Wonka.

 

Sunglasses? Are we going Wizard of Oz, too?

 

Okay, the images are in the crystal. My brain …

 

“ … like a kid’s finger in the proverbial crack in the dam.” Wasn’t it a crack in a dike? A little Dutch boy?

 

“ … turn them into a newt …” But would they get better?

 

I think you missed an opportunity to make some very funny dialogue with the contract demon, á la Terry Pratchett.

 

Boned on the Throne seems a touch tasteless, don’t you think?

[Appol PhD they/he]

Overall: I think the sex at the end is fine, though it’s a bit nonspecific. I feel like a dark witch could come up with something a bit more unique even if it still involves sex (I read a lot of sex scenes in romance novels and as an ace person I find most of them horribly basic and uninteresting).

I think the general beats here work, though I’m not getting a big sense of the building tension like I think the story wants me to. I think we could use more specifics on the plan here and how it connects to the specific situations and characters at play, or maybe just increase the pace by trimming some of this down and moving into the next phase more quickly. I think part of the issue too is that the Omelas thing doesn't feel super integrated into the tone of the world so it feels a bit like a moral gotcha to explain why PU is actually bad. The one part I like is how B uses it to poke at centrist "wisdom" so that's an option for making it feel more connected to the satirical tone the story takes at points.

As I go:

Pg 1-3. There are a lot of technical details here that I feel like could be cut down a bit, since for the most part the story isn’t really about this practical problem solving

Pg 4. I believe you’ve mentioned Omelas before (in author’s notes, not directly in the story), but this does feel a little on the nose especially as a revelation so late in that’s revealed without the characters working for it

Pg 5-6. I’m not super engaged by the grappling with Omelas conflict here because it feel a bit disconnected from the story. The idea of the collective benefiting from individual suffering isn’t really something that has been used to make important plot/character decisions.

Pg 8. I like the idea of the aesthetics tying into magic for plot reveals, but this also feels a bit disconnected from the story right now.

Pg 9-11. I think we need more specifics on what L is doing and the progress she’s making. Right now this reads as mostly exposition.

Pg 13-14. It’s good that they have an actual plan, since it felt like they lacked that before. I’d like to see more specifics though since the conversation still meanders more than probably necessary.

[ginger_reckoning]

3 hours ago, Ace of Hearts said:

Overall: I think the sex at the end is fine, though it’s a bit nonspecific. I feel like a dark witch could come up with something a bit more unique even if it still involves sex (I read a lot of sex scenes in romance novels and as an ace person I find most of them horribly basic and uninteresting).

Okay, good to know. May remove the boned line still, as suggested, haha, though I'm still divided as to if I should keep or jsut apologize in the text afterwards, though I think that may be even more tacky

3 hours ago, Ace of Hearts said:

I think part of the issue too is that the Omelas thing doesn't feel super integrated into the tone of the world so it feels a bit like a moral gotcha to explain why PU is actually bad.

3 hours ago, Ace of Hearts said:

Pg 4. I believe you’ve mentioned Omelas before (in author’s notes, not directly in the story), but this does feel a little on the nose especially as a revelation so late in that’s revealed without the characters working for it

 

Pg 5-6. I’m not super engaged by the grappling with Omelas conflict here because it feel a bit disconnected from the story. The idea of the collective benefiting from individual suffering isn’t really something that has been used to make important plot/character decisions.

So, S did actually see the Omelas child back at the beginning, which was then never mentioned that much until now (may have mentioned it in the now-cut 'reasons why C sucks' part of the bet part). I'm definitely using it as a gotcha here, but I consider C and its fate very important to the story, as part of S's arc. That is kind of why I wanted to keep the part with C in the middle, so it stays relevant at least a little. I think the Omelas thing works as a perfect capstone to the metaphor for capitalism with the sunglasses and such, so I'd like to keep it, though I do worry it's too tropey/unoriginal sometimes. I'd like it to come more across as an intentional loving reference, so if there are any suggestions now or in the future, I'd love to hear it.

 

Also, although though the bet part is cut, I think I may still find some way for them to stay in C more in the next draft. Anyway, I'm curious to come back to this point after the end, which partly includes what happens to C. Thanks, that ended up wordy haha

Thanks again for all the other notes too!

[Paul SB]

"... a perfect capstone to the metaphor for capitalism with the sunglasses and such..." 

This just made me think of an old Peter Gabriel song called "Big Time" which starts with a voice saying "Hi there!" Hi there is almost a dead giveaway that you're talking to a sleazy person trying to sell you something. Maybe you can add that in with the sunglasses?

[Appol PhD they/he]

14 hours ago, ginger_reckoning said:

So, S did actually see the Omelas child back at the beginning, which was then never mentioned that much until now (may have mentioned it in the now-cut 'reasons why C sucks' part of the bet part). I'm definitely using it as a gotcha here, but I consider C and its fate very important to the story, as part of S's arc. That is kind of why I wanted to keep the part with C in the middle, so it stays relevant at least a little. I think the Omelas thing works as a perfect capstone to the metaphor for capitalism with the sunglasses and such, so I'd like to keep it, though I do worry it's too tropey/unoriginal sometimes. I'd like it to come more across as an intentional loving reference, so if there are any suggestions now or in the future, I'd love to hear it.

 

It coming up early on about C sounds vaguely familiar, actually. I think for it to avoid being unoriginal the story needs to find something new to say about the situation, though like I mentioned my bigger issue is that right now I don't feel like it slots in thematically to expand our understanding of the story. To me the main thematic throughline I get is that extreme pessimism and extreme optimism are two sides of the same coin that are used to brush aside the reality of suffering. I think there's a potential connection the Omelas thing can make to that, but so far the story hasn't done the groundwork (or maybe it's supposed to slot in a different way that I'm not seeing).