Full Cosmere Restarted RP: Astronomy (and maybe Realmatics too)

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

Yet another thread. There's going to be at least one more, so yeah. 

This one is to decide where all the current star systems are in relation to each other. We're going to be going off this:

Vapours points to Scadrial

Densities is Sel

Broken Skies: ??? (if it's Taldain we're going to ignore it)

We also know that Threnody is close enough to the Scadrian Subastral that Shades were a worry. We can also use the star map provided in the Arcanum Unbounded inside cover, but right now I don't have the energy.

I'll tell you all my thoughts tomorrow as it's 9:10PM. Expect more in ~19 to 20 hours.

[Through The Living Ash he/him]

Based on the star chart, it's likely Taldain or Nalthis, kinda tricky to tell from a 2d map. Threnody looks to be the farthest away from Roshar. 

[Argenti he/him]

Just now, Ashkaloda said:

Based on the star chart, it's likely Taldain or Nalthis, kinda tricky to tell from a 2d map. Threnody looks to be the farthest away from Roshar. 

Nalthis is probably the Expanse of Vibrance, not pictured on this map, but it's "southwest" from roshar. Broken sky is either  Taldain or Threnody. I'm partial to the latter, and the broken sky is a reference to the shattered spiritual realm of threnody.

[Through The Living Ash he/him]

4 minutes ago, Argenti said:

Nalthis is probably the Expanse of Vibrance, not pictured on this map, but it's "southwest" from roshar. Broken sky is either  Taldain or Threnody. I'm partial to the latter, and the broken sky is a reference to the shattered spiritual realm of threnody.

Ah, that would make sense. I agree. 

[Argenti he/him]

1 minute ago, Ashkaloda said:

Ah, that would make sense. I agree. 

It could also be Taldain, because the sky there is "broken" in half- nightside and dayside. But autonomy having it locked down makes me think it's not.

[ChickenBonanza]

40 minutes ago, Argenti said:

Broken sky is either  Taldain or Threnody. I'm partial to the latter, and the broken sky is a reference to the shattered spiritual realm of threnody.

Personally, I would consider Ashyn to be the more likely candidate for Broken Sky. Most of its a flaming hellscape, yeah? And it’s would be way closer to Roshar in the Cognitive Realm than other planets, and therefore’d be more likely to have an Expanse named for it than others, I’d think.

Even if Ashyn’s Physical ‘sky’ isn’t broken, we gotta consider how it’s Subastral will appear in the Cognitive.

In noncanon Silence Divine snippets, their floating islands are two-sided, with farms facing the sun and people living on the side facing Ashyn’s burning ground. To those people, their ‘sky’ is broken.

[Argenti he/him]

Just now, ChickenBonanza said:

Personally, I would consider Ashyn to be the more likely candidate for Broken Sky. Most of its a flaming hellscape, yeah? And it’s would be way closer to Roshar in the Cognitive Realm than other planets, and therefore’d be more likely to have an Expanse named for it than others, I’d think.

Even if Ashyn’s Physical ‘sky’ isn’t broken, we gotta consider how it’s Subastral will appear in the Cognitive.

In noncanon Silence Divine snippets, their floating islands are two-sided, with farms facing the sun and people living on the side facing Ashyn’s burning ground. To those people, their ‘sky’ is broken.

Meh. Braize's subastral isn't shown on the map, unless it's the Expanse of Vibrance (Very unlikely), so why would Ashyn's be? You can't even say Ashyn is more relevant to the common traveler: as far as we know, you can't get to the physical from Ashyn's cognitive. Wouldn't Braize, the holdup of the god of hatred, be more relevant? Everything else is in a different system, not just a different planet.

[ChickenBonanza]

54 minutes ago, Argenti said:

Meh. Braize's subastral isn't shown on the map, unless it's the Expanse of Vibrance (Very unlikely), so why would Ashyn's be? You can't even say Ashyn is more relevant to the common traveler: as far as we know, you can't get to the physical from Ashyn's cognitive. Wouldn't Braize, the holdup of the god of hatred, be more relevant? Everything else is in a different system, not just a different planet.

Here be my reasoning: In regards the naming, I feel the descriptor ‘Broken Sky’ fits Threnody and Taldain less completely than it does Ashyn.

If we consider relevance and ease of access, I would place Ashyn to be roughly equal to Threnody. While there is no known method of in-world access, like Threnody’s intermittent perpendicularities, I would say it is reasonable that Ashyn may have something similar. It, too, has been steeped in Investiture, arguably just as much as Threnody.

Given their Physical proximity to each other, surely Ashyn and Braize would be the shortest distance from Roshar, when traveling through the Cognitive Realm. Surely that proximity would be especially relevant to nearby Cognitive regions

It is curious, then, that Braize is absent from the Shadesmar map. It is a good point, that no Expanse is named for it, for surely the presence of Odium and the locked away Fused and Voidspren would be of more significance than a planet farther away. I don’t really know why that would be the case, other than ‘they just didn’t name an Expande after it,’ or that Expanses are only named for the paths to different solar systems.

I don’t really think it particularly matters what the Expanses actually refer to, the subastrals will be around anyway, but ‘Broken Sky’ just feels ‘Ashyn’ to me.

Edited June 10, 2025 by ChickenBonanza

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

A problem with the Star Map is that I feel Threnody is too far from Scadrial. However, in Shadesmar these may be distorted. We must remember that these stars are in 3D space and it may just be that Scadrial and Threnody are far in one dimension but close the depth dimension we're not seeing. Of course, the actual distance is quite far, but Shadesmar flattening may allow these two to be adjacent.

[ChickenBonanza]

What, even, is the shape of the Cosmere galaxy? The Milky Way, when viewed from a certain angle, could be considered (very roughly) flat. (Even though the ‘flat’ part is still unfathomably large.) Though, given the small nature of the Cosmere, there may not be enough star systems to form any cohesive shape asides from ‘amorphous blob’, which would make the Cognitive Realm’s flatness translate weird when considering the multiple dimensions of the physical, as noted.

Edited June 10, 2025 by ChickenBonanza

[Argenti he/him]

9 minutes ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

A problem with the Star Map is that I feel Threnody is too far from Scadrial. However, in Shadesmar these may be distorted. We must remember that these stars are in 3D space and it may just be that Scadrial and Threnody are far in one dimension but close the depth dimension we're not seeing. Of course, the actual distance is quite far, but Shadesmar flattening may allow these two to be adjacent.

I think it's also possible that the broken sky is an entirely different system we're not familiar with at all. None of the other expenses have many systems between them and roshar, which would make them "close" as far as the Shademar goes. Sel has two, I suppose, but they seem very small. To get to Taldain from roshar, you'd need to get through this blob of 5 or so systems, which would make it "far" away. Scadial is a clear shot, on the other hand.
There's a theory that this star map is from the point of view of Yollen.
 

3 minutes ago, ChickenBonanza said:

What, even, is the shape of the Cosmere galaxy? The Milky Way, when viewed from a certain angle, could be considered (very roughly) flat. Though, given the small nature of the Cosmere, there may not be enough star systems to form any cohesive shape asides from ‘amorphous blob’, which would make the Cognitive Realm’s flatness translate weird when considering the multiple dimensions of the physical, as noted.

It's not even a galaxy, if I remember right. It's just a cluster of stars. How does that go onto a 2d plane? Distortions, I assume. A lot of distortions.

The cognitive realm is just this map

[ChickenBonanza]

28 minutes ago, Argenti said:

I think it's also possible that the broken sky is an entirely different system we're not familiar with at all. None of the other expenses have many systems between them and roshar, which would make them "close" as far as the Shademar goes.

Author man’s willingness to identify Densities as Sel and Vapours as Scadrial, but unwillingness to identify Broken Sky could be indicative that Broken Sky is something that is not yet known, indeed.

6 minutes ago, Argenti said:

Vax?

It would have to be a place suitable enough to have its Cognitive Realm be dubbed ‘Broken Sky.’ Maybe Vax’s theoretical resemblance to the Cognitive could fill that? If Ati mistook the Scadrial subastral for Vax in the physical, perhaps ‘Broken Sky’ could be a signifier of Vax’s dreary, permanently dark sky, but iunno.

Edited June 10, 2025 by ChickenBonanza
reply

[Argenti he/him]

Just now, ChickenBonanza said:

Author man’s willingness to identify Densities as Sel and Vapours as Scadrial, but unwillingness to identify Broken Sky could be indicative that Broken Sky is something that yet known, indeed.

I agree. He's been asked several times and always refuses. If it were Taldain, he would have just said it. It's unlikely to be threnody, to far away, really, and I don't think it's Ashyn. Must be something yet unknown. Vax?

[Argenti he/him]

We might honestly be better off just assigning planets. We just don't know where half the stuff is.

I'd be very surprised if the scar was around pre-shattering.

[Through The Living Ash he/him]

1 hour ago, Argenti said:

We might honestly be better off just assigning planets. We just don't know where half the stuff is.

I'd be very surprised if the scar was around pre-shattering.

I disagree. I don't think a Shard is going around saying, "Hey, let me make a bunch of stars in a squiggly line here! That sounds fun!" 

Except maybe Whimsy, on second thought. 

[Argenti he/him]

14 minutes ago, Ashkaloda said:

I disagree. I don't think a Shard is going around saying, "Hey, let me make a bunch of stars in a squiggly line here! That sounds fun!" 

 

What do you mean? This is the star map without any details.

[Through The Living Ash he/him]

1 minute ago, Argenti said:

What do you mean? This is the star map without any details.

Exactly my point. The majority of Shards settled on planets that already existed. I think the Scar was created by Ado, not a Shard. 

[Argenti he/him]

Just now, Ashkaloda said:

Exactly my point. The majority of Shards settled on planets that already existed. I think the Scar was created by Ado, not a Shard. 

Oh, that's what you're referring to. I thought you meant the first part. My theory of the scar is that it's where Ambition was murdered. If you look closely at the sky map, you can see a red outline around Threnody, much like the stars in the scar. Plus, it being a "wound in the world" would make sense. Harmony says the combat left disturbing effects on the world.

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

5 hours ago, Argenti said:

Oh, that's what you're referring to. I thought you meant the first part. My theory of the scar is that it's where Ambition was murdered. If you look closely at the sky map, you can see a red outline around Threnody, much like the stars in the scar. Plus, it being a "wound in the world" would make sense. Harmony says the combat left disturbing effects on the world.

If this is the case, then the Scar (I typed Skar like 3 times) should point to Threnody in the depth-axis.

If you've read my message in the main thread, you'll know it's time to start cobbling things together.

First, we need to establish some axes. Positive Y axis is above the Galactic Plane, negative is below. Positive X-axis is towards the galaxy's centre, negative away. The Z-axis is going clockwise along the spiral arm when looking from above.

Let's make Roshar the origin, so (0,0,0). Scadrial, Sel and Nalthis should be within 10 light years. I'll leave the rest to you guys.

All units are by default in light years, by the way.

Edited June 11, 2025 by KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren

[al_lan_mandragoran]

So, what planets will be part of this RP, and why do we need to know how far away from each other they are?

Will any of the shards be creating their own planet?

And also, isn't magic systems more important than astronomy?

 

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

7 hours ago, al_lan_mandragoran said:

So, what planets will be part of this RP, and why do we need to know how far away from each other they are?

Will any of the shards be creating their own planet?

And also, isn't magic systems more important than astronomy?

 

Magic systems will arise based on the actions of the Shards. Astronomy is already a thing regardless of Shards and Adonalsium.

[al_lan_mandragoran]

So what planets will we have? And will any shards be creating any?

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

There's a list of planets at the first post in the main thread. And Shards don't create magic systems, magic systems are a by-product of their Investiture permeating the Spiritual Realm of the planet. And at least some Shards are guaranteed to settle on planets eventually, if not immediately.

[al_lan_mandragoran]

7 hours ago, al_lan_mandragoran said:

So what planets will we have? And will any shards be creating any?

6 hours ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

There's a list of planets at the first post in the main thread. And Shards don't create magic systems, magic systems are a by-product of their Investiture permeating the Spiritual Realm of the planet. And at least some Shards are guaranteed to settle on planets eventually, if not immediately.

Thanks for the reply, but I asked if any Shards were going to create planets. Like Ruin and Preservation creating Scadrial.

[Argenti he/him]

2 hours ago, al_lan_mandragoran said:

Thanks for the reply, but I asked if any Shards were going to create planets. Like Ruin and Preservation creating Scadrial.

Oh we'll figure that out as we go.