Speculations

[maxal she/her]

Do you like to speculate on future events in SA or are you annoyed by those who do?

 

I love to speculate. I have a list of a thousands potential events that could or could not happen in SA. Some are contradictory, some are complementary, some I believe there are enough clues to conclude they have a strong chance of happening, others are wild guesses, but in the end, they remain, speculations. I also happen to often change my mind about those. I do believe half the fun in waiting for a book is trying to figure out what will be in it, even if I turn out being wrong.

 

I take clues to support my wild guesses wherever I can find them. I do not dwindle overly over the wording and I run interpretation of what I believe certain passages mean.

 

I know we often do not have enough clues to draw conclusions, but I still like to do so, based on what we do have and what I believe is. I know this is not my story it is Brandon's, but isn't part of liking book getting involved with it? I also know I am just a reader, but as a reader, I do have preferences and I would rather Brandon employ certain plot twists as opposed to others. I also do not think I have to like everything in those books either to enjoy them.

 

So what is your take? Do you believe we need to have everything spelled out with the exact wording used in their literal meaning to support any speculation about future events? Or do you believe it is nice to make guesses here and there and come up with ideas even to the risk of being either completely wrong or deceived if things turn out differently?

 

[Edgedancer he/him]

For me it depends. Naturally, I love putting together clues and theories myself, otherwise I never would have made my way over here, and some of the connections I have seen made by people are down right impressive. One of the most enjoyble moments are, when you read a theory that´s just mindblowingly awesome or if one of your own gets confirmed.

 

Storms, where would all the fun be if we do not try to guess at things. Speculating about for example the way for Szeth or Adolin will develop are some of my favourite past times. Not to speak of potential plot points. (Still waiting for the Godzilla-Spren to posses the Reshi-Illes. )

 

In the times we are wrong, meh, that just means whatever awesomeness Brandon has come up with suprises us even more, which I would say is still worth it.

 

Other rare times I see theories where I think people are trying to hard to come up with something (not that I can point to a specific example right now) and in the process either twist the facts to much, have so many assumptions that it is almost fan-fiction or are just very very... odd. Not that these are inherently bad, especially fan-fiction has produced some beatiful fan-works (Shamless promotion of the "What happened in Oregon" RP), it´s just not my taste.

 

In short, I have nothing against going off-road with idea, personally I´m just not interested in some of the more exotic train of thoughts.

[Kal973]

I don't speculate while reading a book, I just enjoy what I'm reading. But I'm a fantasy reader. That means several books. And you have to wait a lot between two books. I love to speculate during this time because it helps to keep the story alive. I believe that, once a writer publishes his story, it's not exclusively his anymore, as he has chosen to share it with his readers. I consider it a great success when unknown readers love the characters you have created as if they were truly alive, when they talk about their future développements and the things they would like them to do / become/ experience in future books. It means that you have touched people, that you have excited their curiosity, that you have talent !

Writers should be honored and not offensed when such things happen.

I enjoy to read every kind of spéculations. I don't mind if it turns out to be wrong as long as the writing of the next book is amazing. I don't think you need litteral element or proofs to speculate about something (even if it's interesting to rely on proofs especially when the writer plays with the bigger picture the way Sanderson does).

 Wishes and imagination are okay, as long as it does not turn to fanfiction (well-written fanfiction is great but I prefer to read it once the whole serie is finished if I'm really frustrated about something in the plot).

What I like the most about speculation is the amazing imagination of the readers who often write another story, that will only exist in their minds.

It's the proof that creativity is something incredibly powerful that grows once it's shared !  

(Sorry for my English again, I do my best ^^)

[maxal she/her]

I don't speculate while reading a book, I just enjoy what I'm reading. But I'm a fantasy reader. That means several books. And you have to wait a lot between two books. I love to speculate during this time because it helps to keep the story alive. I believe that, once a writer publishes his story, it's not exclusively his anymore, as he has chosen to share it with his readers. I consider it a great success when unknown readers love the characters you have created as if they were truly alive, when they talk about their future développements and the things they would like them to do / become/ experience in future books. It means that you have touched people, that you have excited their curiosity, that you have talent !

Writers should be honored and not offensed when such things happen.

I enjoy to read every kind of spéculations. I don't mind if it turns out to be wrong as long as the writing of the next book is amazing. I don't think you need litteral element or proofs to speculate about something (even if it's interesting to rely on proofs especially when the writer plays with the bigger picture the way Sanderson does).

 Wishes and imagination are okay, as long as it does not turn to fanfiction (well-written fanfiction is great but I prefer to read it once the whole serie is finished if I'm really frustrated about something in the plot).

What I like the most about speculation is the amazing imagination of the readers who often write another story, that will only exist in their minds.

It's the proof that creativity is something incredibly powerful that grows once it's shared !  

(Sorry for my English again, I do my best ^^)

 

Your English sounds fine to me. Where are you from? English is not my native language either. I think it is the case for a few sharders as well, so do not feel ashamed.

[Patrick Star]

During a highstorm, Kal and Syl will break out into a performance of "Singin' in the Rain"

 

Lift will eat Odium

 

Multiple characters will worldhop from Roshar to other Cosmere areas

 

There will be dragons

 

Rock will finally get his Horneater ale

 

Darkeyes-lighteyes society will cease to exist

 

Navani has a baby, which turns out to be the suckling child from the death rattle

 

Taravangian chokes to death on an olive

 

Lirin's name is actually "Tanavest"

 

Vasher was Dalinar's wife (don't ask me how)

 

Odium is incapacitated by a poem written by Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings

 

... I should probably stop now.

[maxal she/her]

 

Storms, where would all the fun be if we do not try to guess at things. Speculating about for example the way for Szeth or Adolin will develop are some of my favourite past times. Not to speak of potential plot points. (Still waiting for the Godzilla-Spren to posses the Reshi-Illes. )

 

Adolin's future is my most favorite area of speculations: in part because it is so open right now, the possibilities are numerous, in other part because he is my favorite character. My speculations are really wide and I haven't posted them all as I feel some of them may be ludicrous

 

Good one, Reshi-Iles Godzilla monster I wouldn't mind seeing that one.

 

 

In short, I have nothing against going off-road with idea, personally I´m just not interested in some of the more exotic train of thoughts.

 

Yeah, I understand what you mean. I guess I could this is how I feel about certain shippings. Not that I think people should prevent themselves from thinking them or even writing fanfiction about them, but when the evidence is just too thin, I just can't get in the bandwagon.

 

 

I don't speculate while reading a book, I just enjoy what I'm reading. But I'm a fantasy reader. That means several books. And you have to wait a lot between two books. I love to speculate during this time because it helps to keep the story alive. I believe that, once a writer publishes his story, it's not exclusively his anymore, as he has chosen to share it with his readers. I consider it a great success when unknown readers love the characters you have created as if they were truly alive, when they talk about their future développements and the things they would like them to do / become/ experience in future books. It means that you have touched people, that you have excited their curiosity, that you have talent !

 

Yes. This. I agree. This is exactly what I meant. This is exactly how I feel about it.

 

 

I enjoy to read every kind of spéculations. I don't mind if it turns out to be wrong as long as the writing of the next book is amazing. I don't think you need litteral element or proofs to speculate about something (even if it's interesting to rely on proofs especially when the writer plays with the bigger picture the way Sanderson does).

 

I agree. I do not care if the evidence of a said theory is not sound proof, as long as it has enough evidence to support itself. People have different interpretation of different scenes and unless Brandon specifically and explicitly disapproves of something, then it has the right to be a theory. Of course, there are speculations I can't back or I just don't like or even that even makes me angry as my reading is quite different, but it does not mean they have no right to be around. What I hate is being told my assumptions are unfounded because the literal meaning of the wording of a specific WoB does not confirm my line of thoughts without the inch of a doubt. This is just too, way too much, much for me.

 

If we can't try to guess, even a little, then were is the fun?

 

 

Darkeyes-lighteyes society will cease to exist

 

Actually, that one is part of my set. I won't give you the details, but I do have it.

[kaellok he/him]

For me it depends. Naturally, I love putting together clues and theories myself, otherwise I never would have made my way over here, and some of the connections I have seen made by people are down right impressive. One of the most enjoyble moments are, when you read a theory that´s just mindblowingly awesome or if one of your own gets confirmed.

Thisthisthis!  Most especially if it's not something that's super obvious.  And the closer you get to spot-on, the greater the thrill.  Hell, finding for sure that spren are Shardblades gave me such a moment of YES! that it's nearly indescribable--and I had 'merely' guessed that spren formed Shardplate, and the Blades were something else altogether.  Good stories demand speculation that helps to invest the reader/audience in the story, making all the payoffs that much better.  A great example of this done well is, well, Sanderson--and an example of this done terribly is the ending to Mass Effect 3. 

 

I'm a fairly literal, logical person--who is prone to sudden blasts of irrationality and illogic and craziness that just sounds fun.  So, most of the time I like to follow the breadcrumbs and hints of evidence that we have to formulate theories, and where it's murkiest is sometimes where I get the most frustrated--so I try to stay away.  However, it's also those weird, wild leaps of random abandon that are the most fun, so I tend to take it all in and evaluate it separately...no matter how time-consuming that may be lol.

[Dellexe he/him]

My terrible speculation is that Nightblood will kill one the the new Knight Radiant's Spren.

[kari-no-sugata]

I think it's fine to post about anything that interests you so long as it's relevant (and fits within the posting guidelines). I don't think fans should be discouraged from being fans.

 

Sometimes it can be lost in the heat of the moment but I try to avoid saying things like "you should like/dislike character/scene X" and instead will argue about reasons. There's certain types of topics I tend to find annoying but I'll just try to avoid them.

 

I think it's fine for people to post spontaneous theories or the like. Even if it's wrong it can lead to interesting discussions. So long as the "signal to noise ratio" stays fine, at least - something I think this site is doing well with.

[Patrick Star]

Serious speculation here: There are no Odiumspren.

 

Thunderclasts, Midnight Essences, and other Odious monsters are all (at least composed of) radiantspren corrupted by the unmade (which one was it, again? I forget the name).

[maxal she/her]

Here a few of mine, mostly character development oriented.... These are mostly far-fetched I think...

 

1) Dalinar will kill Elhokar.

 

2) Lirin and Hesina had a third child following Kal and Tien's departure.

 

3) Elhokar will turn bad: he'll bond something evil and he'll turn into a tyrant. Alright, this one is not so crazy It could be canon

 

4) Renarin will misinterpret his visions and by doing so will cause great prejudice to his brother.

 

5) Navani will die trying to protect Elhokar and won't admit he has turn bad.

 

6) Adolin will try to cross the mountains in an attempt to run away from Urithiru, but he'll fail.

 

7) Amaram is the next highprince of Sadeas and will turn out being not so bad after all.

 

8) Kaladin will get stuck in Kohlinar... He'll be drag within the queens games and will end up in her bed.....

 

9) Shallan will join the Ghostblood for real, meaning she'll think they are right in their pursuit.

 

10) There is a 3 years old mini Kaladin somewhere with a mother named Tarah...

 

I have so many.... but that's it for now.

[maxal she/her]

Oh another one... which I think is funny...

 

11) Following his break-up with Shallan, Adolin gets massively drunk and enter a "bar fight" with Jakamav only to be pick up by Kal and the bridgemen. He ends up sprending the night at Bridge 4, alternating between crying over his failed love life and throwing up in the bucket much to Kaladin's dismay.

[kari-no-sugata]

This is a serious speculation: we're told over and over that Shardplate is "beautiful" (or similar) and that each set is unique. Who are the Order most associated with "beauty"? The Lightweavers (Shalash is the Herald of Beauty). They can also Soulcast. The material that Shardplate is made of seems inherently magical - even the small piece Kaladin used in the duel had magical properties. It seems like a "magical metal" or "magical alloy" (ie some real world metal combined with heavy Investiture), something that cannot form naturally. An imaginary metal, as it were. That also seems something more suitable for the Lightweavers.

 

So, I think that the basic structure for a set of Shardplate is the creation of Lightweavers, quite possibly augmented with fabrial technology or similar to create the Shardplates we actually see.

[Zea mays]

My speculatory speculation -

Lirin is not Kaladin's biological father. On his first appearance in WoK, Lirinis described as a short man. On his pretty much every appearance in either book, Kal is described as extremely tall. Sure, hight disparity between fathers and sons can happen, but such an extreme difference is not likely. Also, Tien is not physically similar to Kaladin.

- A newer idea to me: Geranid discovered that writing down the size of a spren fixes it at that size. Would writing about more abstract properties of spren influence them similarly? Did Nohadon write his "Way of Kings" to define honor for and in spren?

[maxal she/her]

My speculatory speculation -

Lirin is not Kaladin's biological father. On his first appearance in WoK, Lirinis described as a short man. On his pretty much every appearance in either book, Kal is described as extremely tall. Sure, hight disparity between fathers and sons can happen, but such an extreme difference is not likely. Also, Tien is not physically similar to Kaladin.

 

Oh neat one! I wish I had thought of it. It is true Kal is freakishly tall whereas Lirin and Tien are small... It is rare there is such a disparity between the height of siblings... can happen, but it is good spotting.

[Zea mays]

Thanks Max. :-) The thing is, if not Lirin, who is his biological father ?(not to mention mother-side question)

Random dark-eyed soldier #17? King Gavilar? Amaram? Zahel? The herald Kelek? Someone we haven't met yet? I haven't the foggiest idea.

[Dellexe he/him]

Thanks Max. :-) The thing is, if not Lirin, who is his biological father ?(not to mention mother-side question)

Random dark-eyed soldier #17? King Gavilar? Amaram? Zahel? The herald Kelek? Someone we haven't met yet? I haven't the foggiest idea.

"Child of Honor."

-

I'll leave now.

[Patrick Star]

42?

[BadWolf]

"Child of Honor."

-

I'll leave now.

 

I noticed that, too, although near the end of WoR the Stormfather refers to Dalinar as "Child of Honor" as well, making me think it's just how he refers to humans (or at least a subset of humans).

 

(Source: pages 1004 and 1005 of my Kindle edition [ch. 83])

 

Finally. Some progress. "Are you the Almighty?"

"I said I am not, child of Honor."

...

Distant thunder rumbled ominously. The rain beat harder against Dalinar's face.

I AM CALLED. I MUST GO. A DAUGHTER DISOBEYS. YOU WILL SEE NO FURTHER VISIONS, CHILD OF HONOR. THIS IS THE END.

 

Kaladin being adopted or otherwise not his father's biological child is certainly a possibility, although I also have a vague theory that an adolescent proto-Radiant (i.e. someone with the very beginnings of a Nahel bond, like I imagine Kal to have had as a 16 or 17 year old) might have some subconscious control over his physical development. I don't recall that we're ever told Kaladin was tall when he was younger, but becoming a squadleader at a young age and getting himself into positions of authority over significantly older men might have allowed him to sort of conceive of himself as taller at a point in his development when his actual height was still somewhat plastic. In other words, we know that the healing powers associated with surgebinding return the subject to his or her self-perceived "correct" physical state, but at an age when that state is less locked down, genetics become less law, more guideline. (Also, on a related note, I don't think he's supposed to be "freakishly" tall... taller than average, certainly, but I think Shallan's penchant for hyperbole might be contributing a bit to that assessment as well.) 

[Shaggai]

Serious speculation here: There are no Odiumspren.

 

Thunderclasts, Midnight Essences, and other Odious monsters are all (at least composed of) radiantspren corrupted by the unmade (which one was it, again? I forget the name).

Sja-anat. I'm not sure if I agree with your theory (Midnight Essence is almost certainly generated by Re-Shephir, for one thing, although I realize that wasn't the main point), but it would make sense for Sja-anat to be (one of) the strongest Unmade, since it's probably a Satan analogue.

[Patrick Star]

I noticed that, too, although near the end of WoR the Stormfather refers to Dalinar as "Child of Honor" as well, making me think it's just how he refers to humans (or at least a subset of humans).

 

Nah, Honor was probably just REALLY busy

 

 

Also, I'm not saying that Sja-anat makes the Midnight Essences and other monsters, I'm just speculating that they are made from spren corrupted by it.  For example, Re-Shephir might use a few corrupted truthwatcher spren to make each midnight essence.