Marmota he/him Posted August 23, 2014 Posted August 23, 2014 I don't particularly care for having a book focused on Dalinar, because I don't really see how his character could grow much more. You have got to trust the writter's abillty to come up with an interresting development for the characters. If Dalinar had no use for the general plot, he wouldnt be in the series, and specially wouldnt be the main character of the closing book of the arc. Therefore im pretty sure that Dalinar has plenty oportunity to grow. Actually i really cannot follow your thoughts. How come you think Dalinar wont grow as a character? He just became a new Radiant, has got the Almighty load to unite the new radiants, has to deal with several schemes among the highprinces, etc....He has plenty truble to deal with, which already changed and ill keep changing his personality as the series progresses. I think he is one of the most interresting characters and im looing forward for his book.
Guest Posted August 23, 2014 Posted August 23, 2014 You have got to trust the writter's abillty to come up with an interresting development for the characters. If Dalinar had no use for the general plot, he wouldnt be in the series, and specially wouldnt be the main character of the closing book of the arc. Therefore im pretty sure that Dalinar has plenty oportunity to grow. Actually i really cannot follow your thoughts. How come you think Dalinar wont grow as a character? He just became a new Radiant, has got the Almighty load to unite the new radiants, has to deal with several schemes among the highprinces, etc....He has plenty truble to deal with, which already changed and ill keep changing his personality as the series progresses. I think he is one of the most interresting characters and im looing forward for his book. I agree. Dalinar can still grow furthermore. He will have to deal with many issues in the following books, notably his son. How does he weight the crime committed by his son next to his own crimes for which he never answer to justice? Dalinar killed many, many, many people and many probably were innocents. He was a terrible warlord feared all across Roshar. He has made his peace with his past, but he has done so by becoming extremely pious and regarding on morality. These new beliefs will be put to the test once he learns about what his son did. How does he reconcile his new found morality, his past as a bloodthirsty warrior and his present with a son stepping foot into his old path? How does he unite the kingdom without dividing his family? And how does he guide? Dalinar is not a politician, but he is trying. He still has to learn to be this person, this figure people look up to and not laugh at.
Dawnshard Posted August 30, 2014 Posted August 30, 2014 I think they are all interesting choices. I believe in Brandon. I lot of people were saying how Shallon would be a terrible character for a book when it was released that WoR was her book. Look how that turned out. These flashback books will all be amazing! That being said I am most excited for Szeth and Nightblood. I think Brandon will show how Nightblood came to be separated from Vasher and how Szeth came to be truthless. So excited!
Gabriele she/her Posted August 30, 2014 Posted August 30, 2014 Lol, with all those wishlists here, Brandon will have to write 20 books so everyone gets his/her favourite flashback character.
Guest Posted August 30, 2014 Posted August 30, 2014 Lol, with all those wishlists here, Brandon will have to write 20 books so everyone gets his/her favourite flashback character. Yes. He has to write 20 versions of SA just to please us obsessive and harsh crowd that we are
weebojello Posted August 30, 2014 Posted August 30, 2014 Well, if Taln is not Taln, then my thought is that Taln is Jezrien which would compound the reason to have Shallash be a focus as well. The duplication of orders is troubling though. I think overall it's pretty good - the emphasis on the two heralds is interesting coming immediately after Dalinar. Given that he has a bunch of books planned after Dalinar, there has to be a really good resolution for a bit. I can't imagine us all taking it easy if there's a cliffhanger for ... 5 years.
BlackYeti he/him Posted August 30, 2014 Posted August 30, 2014 I really like the list. There's a few characters that I'm not that excited for, but that's probably because we've not seen enough of them yet (Eshonai, the two Heralds, Renarin). And because I can't resist suggesting my own list of flashbacks, my order for the next three books would be: Szeth Jasnah Navani And for the last five books in no discernible order: Lift Zahel Rysn Iyatil (and because we're allowed to have dead people for flashback books) Tanavast 1
Guest Posted August 31, 2014 Posted August 31, 2014 I really like the list. There's a few characters that I'm not that excited for, but that's probably because we've not seen enough of them yet (Eshonai, the two Heralds, Renarin). And because I can't resist suggesting my own list of flashbacks, my order for the next three books would be: Szeth Jasnah Navani And for the last five books in no discernible order: Lift Zahel Rysn Iyatil (and because we're allowed to have dead people for flashback books) Tanavast I really like to see to see which characters other people are digging into. It fluctuates so much! I like yours because you say you don't feel so much about Eshonai and Renarin as you have not seen enough of them to care and yet you list Zahel, Rysn, Iyatil and Tanavast: characters we have barely seen or that had little screen time. All three, I believe, have had less development than Renarin, for example. I think it is very interesting you are more keen on reading about very minor (so far) characters as opposed to more major ones. You illustrates very well how we all get attached to different kind of characters. It is the beauty of SA, I believe, its richness of characters that appeal to people for different reasons
BlackYeti he/him Posted August 31, 2014 Posted August 31, 2014 Thank you for the response maxal, I really enjoyed reading it. I agree that some of my choices are quite ironic considering my earlier comments, maybe I should have included my reasoning for them. In case you're still interested, I'll sneak that in here (of course, it'll still be here, even if you're not interested, but then you can ignore it, I suppose). It took me ages to figure out how to articulate my feelings for these characters, and I'm not sure that I managed it that well, so I hope this is okay. Spoilers for Warbreaker Zahel is actually Vasher, so he's one of the characters who we've seen the most of on my list. He was my favourite character in Warbreaker. I really loved the way that, in just two pages, he changes from being a primary antagonist to a primary protagonist. He then takes on a mentor role for Vivenna (a role that I've always had a fondness for), so I'm really excited that he seems to be doing the same thing for Kaladin and Renarin. I really look forward to seeing how he develops in future Stormlight books, and really want to see just how he lost Nightblood and ended up where he is. Rysn is interesting. So far she has shown us two very different Rosharan cultures, and provided her unique perspective on them, thereby illuminating both her own character and the world around her. She has a huge potential for character growth, especially after the accident she suffers in her most recent interlude. Iyatil is truly fascinating: there is so little that we know about her, and so much that I want to find out. What does she know? What are her goals and her motivations? Why is she with the Ghostbloods? What is it that she is teaching Mraize? Will she teach Shallan it as well? And just what is behind that mask of hers? Her short scene with Shallan hinted at so much, so I really want to see a lot more of her. Tanavast has huge potential for flashbacks. He was Honour, so the wealth of information he could reveal to us is huge, and we would get to see Roshar at a very different point in it's timeline. But more than that, I think that there's a really great story that could be told here. If we assume that Tanavast survived the Splintering of Honour, then we would have a god-like character who had become mortal. We would have a character who knew that the Heralds had abandoned the Oathpact, that the world is very likely doomed, and that there is very little that he can do any more to change this fate. Given his new mortality, he might have to struggle with his feelings for Cultivation. And of course, he ultimately ends up dying, so it would be somewhat tragic. That's just based on what we know about him, there must be so many other possibilities from what we don't know. It would undoubtedly be fantastic. The other choices are, I think, a bit more obvious. Szeth offers insight into the Shin culture, moreover we should get to see what makes him so committed to it. Jasnah is my favourite character from Stormlight, and I was very disappointed at how little she was in Words of Radiance. I really like Navani, and she would offer a fantastic perspective on both Dalinar and Gavilar. (I really love Dalinar as well, but the Blackthorn doesn't interest me as much, at least from what we've heard about him from back then. It will be fascinating to see how he changed into the character he is now, but we could see that from Navani's perspective just as easily as from Dalinar's.) And Lift is Awesome. I wanted to try and fit Adolin and Taravangian into the list as well, but there ended up not being enough space for them, so I ended up leaving them out. 1
Guest Posted September 1, 2014 Posted September 1, 2014 Thank you for the response maxal, I really enjoyed reading it. Thanks I agree that some of my choices are quite ironic considering my earlier comments, maybe I should have included my reasoning for them. In case you're still interested, I'll sneak that in here (of course, it'll still be here, even if you're not interested, but then you can ignore it, I suppose). It took me ages to figure out how to articulate my feelings for these characters, and I'm not sure that I managed it that well, so I hope this is okay. Of course I am interested, that was the whole purpose of this thread. Discuss characters we would like to see in the flashbacks. The idea was also not to limit ourselves to the established ones as I, for one, was not entirely happy with Brandon's current lineup Spoilers for Warbreaker Zahel is actually Vasher, so he's one of the characters who we've seen the most of on my list. He was my favourite character in Warbreaker. I really loved the way that, in just two pages, he changes from being a primary antagonist to a primary protagonist. He then takes on a mentor role for Vivenna (a role that I've always had a fondness for), so I'm really excited that he seems to be doing the same thing for Kaladin and Renarin. I really look forward to seeing how he develops in future Stormlight books, and really want to see just how he lost Nightblood and ended up where he is. You don't need to put information about Zahel/Vasher in spoiler mode. It is pretty much canon now that Zahel is Vasher and all people that dwindle in this forum knows about it I agree Zahel is a most interesting character and I nearly pick him myself. I changed my mind as I feel SA is not his story and I felt I would rather hear about other characters. I am especially interested in how he came to be within Dalinar's service and how it is he decided to become Adolin's swordmaster. In fact, most of his time on Roshar seemed to have been spent teaching one particular kid how to be the awesome duelist he ended up becoming. I have always wondered why Zahel purposely chose the position of an ardent, why he decided to set himself as a swordmaster and why he chose Adolin as a student. He called him stubborn and I really wanted to hear how their mentor/student relationship evolved from the beginning. I also feel Zahel is not done teaching Adolin: his insights during the famoust 4 vs 1 duel were quite telling. His mentoring of Renarin and Kaladin is also sweet. He takes Renarin as a student mostly because Adolin insisted greatly and tricked him into agreeing. He takes Kal as a part-time student as he sees he has potential and a dire need of a good master. I am too hoping to read more about Zahel. Rysn is interesting. So far she has shown us two very different Rosharan cultures, and provided her unique perspective on them, thereby illuminating both her own character and the world around her. She has a huge potential for character growth, especially after the accident she suffers in her most recent interlude. I like Rysn, she is an interesting interlude character. I would like to see her grow as well, but I am compel enough by her story to wish to see it in a flashback. Besides, it is her present I find interesting: I wonder if her past is worth reading about. Iyatil is truly fascinating: there is so little that we know about her, and so much that I want to find out. What does she know? What are her goals and her motivations? Why is she with the Ghostbloods? What is it that she is teaching Mraize? Will she teach Shallan it as well? And just what is behind that mask of hers? Her short scene with Shallan hinted at so much, so I really want to see a lot more of her. Honestly, I have never gave Iyatil more than a second thought You are right in thinking she may be more then she seemed... To follow. Tanavast has huge potential for flashbacks. He was Honour, so the wealth of information he could reveal to us is huge, and we would get to see Roshar at a very different point in it's timeline. But more than that, I think that there's a really great story that could be told here. If we assume that Tanavast survived the Splintering of Honour, then we would have a god-like character who had become mortal. We would have a character who knew that the Heralds had abandoned the Oathpact, that the world is very likely doomed, and that there is very little that he can do any more to change this fate. Given his new mortality, he might have to struggle with his feelings for Cultivation. And of course, he ultimately ends up dying, so it would be somewhat tragic. That's just based on what we know about him, there must be so many other possibilities from what we don't know. It would undoubtedly be fantastic. OK you sold it to me. I have never thought of Tanavast as a person or a character I like your idea of seeing him as a mortal who has failed with a tragic love story... I agree this would be fantastic. However, we get so little flashback character, I wonder how he would fit into it all. I wanted to try and fit Adolin and Taravangian into the list as well, but there ended up not being enough space for them, so I ended up leaving them out. If you have followed my posts, then you know I am a die hard fan of Adolin , so yeah, I'd like to see more of him. Dalinar is one of my favorite as well. I am therefore highly interested in reading about his time as the Blackthorn. Taranvangian is worth considering, but I am ambivalent about him.
sun tzaro Posted September 3, 2014 Posted September 3, 2014 Since Taln might very well have been forced to bear the accumulated burdens of the 9 Heralds who did not return to Damnation, he might not be feeling so forgiving when he returns to sanity. Considering that the Heralds did abandon their burden, they are clearly not flawless. I wouldn't be surprised if Taln decides to seek vengeance, so maybe the "Taln becomes Dustbringer" theory isn't unreasonable. The Renarin book should be interesting. It's clear that his "blood weakness" is related to his powers as a Truthwatcher, and his ability to see the future is at extreme odds with the Vorinism's hatred of foretelling the future (probably the reason for why he refused to join the Ardentia, even at the urging of his family). It seems he curses and fears his ability, so I see a lot of potential for internal conflict in the chapters we get from his point of view.
Guest Posted September 3, 2014 Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) Considering that the Heralds did abandon their burden, they are clearly not flawless. I wouldn't be surprised if Taln decides to seek vengeance, so maybe the "Taln becomes Dustbringer" theory isn't unreasonable. I do not think Dustbringers are about vengeance... They are about bravery, they are quite different things. The Renarin book should be interesting. It's clear that his "blood weakness" is related to his powers as a Truthwatcher, and his ability to see the future is at extreme odds with the Vorinism's hatred of foretelling the future (probably the reason for why he refused to join the Ardentia, even at the urging of his family). It seems he curses and fears his ability, so I see a lot of potential for internal conflict in the chapters we get from his point of view. I may be at fault here, so please feel free to correct me, but don't we have a WoB stating Renarin's blood weakness is not linked to his Radian powers? He has had it since childhood, but his spren bond is quite recent. As for his reluctance to join the Ardentia, I doubt it could be explain by his visions of the future... His family have asked him years ago to join them, but the visions started only in WoR. He was not having visions when he refused to become an Ardent, nor was he having a spren. Edited September 3, 2014 by maxal
Savanorn he/him Posted September 3, 2014 Posted September 3, 2014 I do not think Dustbringers are about vengeance... They are about bravery, they are quite different things. I may be at fault here, so please feel free to correct me, but don't we have a WoB stating Renarin's blood weakness is not linked to his Radian powers? He has had it since childhood, but his spren bond is quite recent. As for his reluctance to join the Ardentia, I doubt it could be explain by his visions of the future... His family have asked him years ago to join them, but the visions started only in WoR. He was not having visions when he refused to become an Ardent, nor was he having a spren. Wait, hypothetically couldn't his Radiant-ness have healed it?
kreeble Posted September 3, 2014 Posted September 3, 2014 I imagine it could heal it, in the same way that the stormlight could heal Kaladin's slave brands. But Renarin likely has such a strong perception of himself as being afflicted by the disorder that the stormlight doesn't heal it. 3
Guest Posted September 3, 2014 Posted September 3, 2014 I imagine it could heal it, in the same way that the stormlight could heal Kaladin's slave brands. But Renarin likely has such a strong perception of himself as being afflicted by the disorder that the stormlight doesn't heal it. Well I was referring to a WoB I recalled reading... Something about how even stormlight cannot heal his sickness... Again, my recalling of the said WoB is dim, so it could be I am mistaken here.
kaellok he/him Posted September 4, 2014 Posted September 4, 2014 Well I was referring to a WoB I recalled reading... Something about how even stormlight cannot heal his sickness... Again, my recalling of the said WoB is dim, so it could be I am mistaken here. Wait...you're saying that Stormlight can heal Souldeath, but not Renarin's blood weakness? Really hoping you're wrong about that WoB, because that's just...weird haha. It seems very likely to me that it wouldn't because it's so much a part of how Renarin sees himself, as kreeble said above. 1
Guest Posted September 4, 2014 Posted September 4, 2014 Wait...you're saying that Stormlight can heal Souldeath, but not Renarin's blood weakness? Really hoping you're wrong about that WoB, because that's just...weird haha. It seems very likely to me that it wouldn't because it's so much a part of how Renarin sees himself, as kreeble said above. Perhaps. But I did recall reading something along the lines that Renarin's sicknes could not be fully healed with stormlight... It could be kreeble has guested right. I am unsure about this one.
missionaryofgod he/him Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 (edited) Alright. We have a few more tip nips about the flashback characters. We already know about the first half of SA. 3 = Szeth 4 = Eshonai 5 = Dalinar Now apparently, Brandon has decided for the following for the second half: 6 = Taln 7 = Shalash 8 = Lift 9 = Jasnah 10 = Renarin I really don´t think we need two heralds. Put in Rysn or Adolin instead. Renarin must be there. If Brandon are not planning to do Adolin that could be a hint he is not becoming a radiant. I hope so. Edited October 11, 2014 by missionaryofgod
Guest Posted October 11, 2014 Posted October 11, 2014 I really don´t think we need two heralds. Put in Rysn or Adolin instead. Renarin must be there. If Brandon are not planning to do Adolin that could be a hint he is not becoming a radiant. I hope so. Couldn't agree more with your first sentence. Even if I do not care so much about Rysn, I would prefer her over Shalash... As for the second, I do not think it is a hint of anything. He never planned to do one on Adolin, so he must be having other plans for the character. I hope they will be awesome.
Marmota he/him Posted October 12, 2014 Posted October 12, 2014 If Brandon are not planning to do Adolin that could be a hint he is not becoming a radiant. I hope so. ... I do not think it is a hint of anything. He never planned to do one on Adolin, so he must be having other plans for the character. I hope they will be awesome. I agree with maxal. It is actually in fact heavily implied that Adolin will become a radiant. It is more of a hint that Adolin will play a much smaller part (if any) in the second half.
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Posted October 12, 2014 It is more of a hint that Adolin will play a much smaller part (if any) in the second half. I don't think we can tell at all. It could be he will remain one of the main POV characters despite not having a flashback or it could be he'll die or it could be he'll shrink down to the occasional POV. We don't know. Szeth and Eshonai have not played any significant part in the story so far and will yet have a flashback. Personally, I would prefer if the main characters remained the same for both arcs. I tend to get attached to my characters, so I would rather keep on reading about Kaladin, Shallan, Adolin and Dalinar with the occasional character taking up more space from time to time. Well, if Dalinar dies, then he can be replaced by someone else.
Marmota he/him Posted October 12, 2014 Posted October 12, 2014 I don't think we can tell at all. It could be he will remain one of the main POV characters despite not having a flashback or it could be he'll die or it could be he'll shrink down to the occasional POV. We don't know. Szeth and Eshonai have not played any significant part in the story so far and will yet have a flashback. Personally, I would prefer if the main characters remained the same for both arcs. I tend to get attached to my characters, so I would rather keep on reading about Kaladin, Shallan, Adolin and Dalinar with the occasional character taking up more space from time to time. Well, if Dalinar dies, then he can be replaced by someone else. Yeah thats true, its difficult to say. But i really doubt Adolin will have POV on the back half (except maybe really ocasional like Sadeas or Amaram so far). Since the series will have to start focusing on the new POVs, i guess all surviving POVs that we know will get set aside as POVs, though Brandon already said that they wll appear more often than the back half POV appear in the first half.
Guest Posted October 12, 2014 Posted October 12, 2014 Yeah thats true, its difficult to say. But i really doubt Adolin will have POV on the back half (except maybe really ocasional like Sadeas or Amaram so far). Since the series will have to start focusing on the new POVs, i guess all surviving POVs that we know will get set aside as POVs, though Brandon already said that they wll appear more often than the back half POV appear in the first half. Maybe you are right, maybe you aren't. This is a hard one to call. I am not so keen on the new POV unless they leave sufficient room for the characters we have grown to love. I do hope our current crew will get decent page time in the second half, unless they all turn out dead, which would be dramatic. I hate when authors kill of their cast as the replacements are never as good. Adolin is a difficult call.... Most people think he will die by the end of book 5. I would prefer if he survived and keep on playing a significant role in the back half.
missionaryofgod he/him Posted October 12, 2014 Posted October 12, 2014 I don't think we can tell at all. It could be he will remain one of the main POV characters despite not having a flashback or it could be he'll die or it could be he'll shrink down to the occasional POV. We don't know. Szeth and Eshonai have not played any significant part in the story so far and will yet have a flashback. Personally, I would prefer if the main characters remained the same for both arcs. I tend to get attached to my characters, so I would rather keep on reading about Kaladin, Shallan, Adolin and Dalinar with the occasional character taking up more space from time to time. Well, if Dalinar dies, then he can be replaced by someone else. What if some of the flashback characters are not radiants or heralds. That would give both Rysn and Adolin a chance(even if he is not a radiant). Who knows even Teft or Lopen or somebody could grow to have more space. I agree you want to keep reading about Kaladin, Shallan etc. I´m also a little worried Adolin will die by the end of book five
Guest Posted October 13, 2014 Posted October 13, 2014 What if some of the flashback characters are not radiants or heralds. That would give both Rysn and Adolin a chance(even if he is not a radiant). Who knows even Teft or Lopen or somebody could grow to have more space. I agree you want to keep reading about Kaladin, Shallan etc. I´m also a little worried Adolin will die by the end of book five It could be, but so far all the announced flashback characters are either Radiants or proto-Radiants, with the exception of Taln and Shalash........ who are Heralds........... As I said in another thread, most people think Adolin will die by the end of book 5. I sincerely hope that will not be the case, but I am afraid it will be. Needless to say that if he does die, I will have a hard time reading the second half.
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