Vortaan Posted December 23, 2011 Report Share Posted December 23, 2011 This has been bothering me the last time I read WoK. Shardblades and Shardplate are both classified as Shards, but it just seems like they are too different to be intended to be used as a single unit. So a theory: could Shardblades actually be of Odium, not Honor? It could explain Syl's hatred of them, and the fact that really, Shardblades seem to go against Honor's purpose. Yes the Heralds have Shardblades, but they seem different from other Shardblades. Anyway, what do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 Interesting point but the Radiants themselves also used Blades. It seems very odd that the Radiants would use something that is of the enemy. Also, Honorspren like Syl would have been around the Radiants time too, which implies that the Spren were once okay with Shardblades. There are actually some similarities between Blades and Plates too. Such as how the Radiant's Plates could banish and summon their helms the same as they banish/summon their Blades. Also, considering the likeness of the Honorblades and Shardblades, it seems more likely that the Shardblades are just weaker copies of Honorblades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aiken Frost Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 Do we ever see how the blades work in past times? The "soul severing" method of killing things do look very Odium to me, but I'm not sure if that was the way they worked previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortaan Posted December 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 Is it possible that Odium changed the Shardblades? That maybe they didn't work on people before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 I think there are several theories going around to the effect that Shardblades used to be of Honor, but were somehow dishonered at the Recreance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
name_here Posted December 30, 2011 Report Share Posted December 30, 2011 I personally suspect they were dishonored by killing ordinary people in massive quantities and not by active intervention by Odium or by the Recreance. I note that the glow effect on the Plate went out as people started killing each other over them. The burning eyes effect was mentioned explicitly in that vision, so I assume Blades always worked like that. Also, while they're different, they feel like they're designed to be used as a set. Shardblades are too heavy to be used in the deadly quick sweeps Shardbearers favor without the enhanced strength provided by Shardplate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortaan Posted December 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2011 I personally suspect they were dishonored by killing ordinary people in massive quantities and not by active intervention by Odium or by the Recreance. I note that the glow effect on the Plate went out as people started killing each other over them. The burning eyes effect was mentioned explicitly in that vision, so I assume Blades always worked like that. Also, while they're different, they feel like they're designed to be used as a set. Shardblades are too heavy to be used in the deadly quick sweeps Shardbearers favor without the enhanced strength provided by Shardplate. Szeth uses a Shardblade in a pretty similar manner to Dalinar. So I'm pretty sure weight isn't an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
name_here Posted December 30, 2011 Report Share Posted December 30, 2011 Szeth's is much, much smaller than Dalinar's Blade. His is meant for being used in one hand, the others are two-handed swords that Shardbearers wield in one hand with ease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted December 30, 2011 Report Share Posted December 30, 2011 actually Shardblades are much lighter then they ought to be, but they are still awkward to use without Plate due to sheer size apparently, but Szeth can use Stormlight directly so..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahak Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Szeth's is much, much smaller than Dalinar's Blade. His is meant for being used in one hand, the others are two-handed swords that Shardbearers wield in one hand with ease. Plate reshapes itself to fit its wearer from what Dalinar says. It wouldn't be too unreasonable to assume Blades resize to suit their users as well. The King of Jah Keved didn't have any problem using his Blade without Plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Plate reshapes itself to fit its wearer from what Dalinar says. It wouldn't be too unreasonable to assume Blades resize to suit their users as well. The King of Jah Keved didn't have any problem using his Blade without Plate. Do you think Blades could also extend and retract at will? If some of the Voidbringers were like Godzilla monstrous in size would help alot if they could do more than a small paper-cut like cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortaan Posted December 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Come to think of it, it makes no sense if Blade and Plate are designed to be used together for there to be any Blades that are the size of Szeth's. Makes more sense that Blades do change shape to fit the wielder. I'm still thinking Odium is chiefly responsible for the Blades, as they really seem to fit his Shard more than Honor's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 There have been some theories floating around that Odium and Honor were on the same side, fighting agaisnt some unknown Enemy. Perhaps Honor gave men the Plate and Odium gave the Blades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahak Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Come to think of it, it makes no sense if Blade and Plate are designed to be used together for there to be any Blades that are the size of Szeth's. Makes more sense that Blades do change shape to fit the wielder. The other possibility is that Szeth's blade was one of the ones left by the Heralds [The obvious guess would be the Stormfather's]. Since the Heralds don't seem to wear Plate. But Dalinar mentioned something about bonding with Oathbringer and I suspect it set it's size during that process, rather than being variable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Of Nothing Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Hmm. I wonder what size Shallan's is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelek Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Another thing to factor in when comparing Shardblades to fabrials is that a fabrial is constantly in the physical realm, while the blades disappear to wherever when not in use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Do you think Blades could also extend and retract at will? If some of the Voidbringers were like Godzilla monstrous in size would help alot if they could do more than a small paper-cut like cut. The Blades were pretty effective against a chasmfiend, and those are humongous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
name_here Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Standard Blades are six feet long. You don't get larger swords unless you're a JRPG character or a mech. They might have formerly been re-sizable, but there's no indication that they are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 The Blades were pretty effective against a chasmfiend, and those are humongous. Yeah but from the descriptions them seemed more around between a very large elephant and a mammoth. Godzilla is like 100x bigger. If I recall correctly, the picture in the book seems to show them to tower over buildings, though of course the reliability of it is questionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeatherWriter Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 I think the Blades are probably resizable, but perhaps people have simply forgotten how to do it, or perhaps they can only do it a little bit. This coincides with a something in Warbreaker a little bit. Minor Warbreaker spoilers The way that the Returned can change their appearances. Normal Returned like Lightsong and Blushweaver change forms unconsiously, but someone who knows what they're doing like Vasher can change his whole appearance at will. I like the idea of extending and retracting Shardblades, but I don't think it'd necessarily be possible on the battlefield. (And really, how much more deadly do Shardblades really need to be?) More likely I think you could change your Blade with conscious effort over a period of time. Hmm, I wonder how much you could change it? Could you perhaps make an entirely different weapon? I wouldn't mind seeing Kaladin weild a Shardspear! That'd be awesome! I've had some questions about the Blades themselves that I've never really been able to answer. What do they look like? My first read-through I had them imagined as kind of glassy, see-through, glowy, rainbow blade, a little like the energy swords from Halo. Though on subsequent read-throughs they mention that the Blades are metallic. Do they just look like regular swords though, aside from the size and shape? What about a normal-sized Blade like Szeth's? Is his only recognizable by his summoning and the way that it kills? Seems like with Shardplate being so distinctive from regular armor, Shardblades should be distinctive too. Also, what part of the Blade is sharp? Just the edge? Obviously the hilt won't cut otherwise it would cut off the wielder's hand, unless Shardblades can't hurt their bearers. But would the back of the Blade cut things? Would the flat of the Blade? Why don't dropped Shardblades (such as when the bearer dies) slice through whatever they touch? At first I thought perhaps you had to be holding a Shardblade in order for you to cut something, but we see Dalinar's Blade cut into rock when he drops it here: In a heartbeat Dalinar found himself rolling, Oathbringer tumbling from his fingers and slicing a gash in the stone ground before puffing to mist. --Chapter 13 (sorry I don't have a page) There's just a lot about them that we don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 Most Shardblades seem to have a single sharp edge, but Szeth's is double-edged. Also I like the idea of a Shard-naginata for Kaladin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeatherWriter Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 I also like the idea that the Shardblades and the Thrill are of Odium. It seems to be reinforced by the line by the female Shardbearer in Dalinar's vision. Fighting, even this fighting against the Ten Deaths, changes a person. We can teach you so that it will not destroy you. Sounds like the Thrill is something that happens to Rosharians when when they fight, and the Knights Radiant seem to think that it needs to be controlled and contained. Random Theory Time: Odium made a deal with the Heralds: they stay with him between Desolations to be tortured while Odium provides weapons that can slice through anything. Odium takes the deal because he gets people to torture and a bunch of people going around with crazy powerful weapons. The Heralds/Radiants take it because they need the edge in the Desolations. But the Radiants think that they can control Odium's influence by relying on Honor - they use bonds and oaths to keep themselves from being corrupted. But normal people, without the oaths are completely susceptable to the influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcanist Lupus Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 I found a line in WoK that indicates that Shardblades might be adjustable in size. WoK pg 910: [The Shardplate] fit as only Plate could, having molded to his large stature. If Shardplate molds to fit the wearer, than it seems likely that Shardblades also mold to fit their wielders. Note the grammar of the sentence. The way molded is used here implies to me that the Plate molded itself, as opposed to being molded by people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahak Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 But would the back of the Blade cut things? Would the flat of the Blade? Edges only. Or Dalinar wouldn't have mentions having to keep speed up to avoid the blade being trapped. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeatherWriter Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 Hmm. Now that you mention it, that does sound familiar. It just seems a little weird I guess. If you hit someone with the back or flat of a Shardblade, it would bounce off? Seems strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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