Not your regular stormfather theory

[Rg2045]

Ok so this theory has been bouncing in my head for a good week and I read WoB but haven’t seen anything related to this. 
but here is the theory 

the stormfather didn’t always have the power to invest gems with stormlight. 
 

now we have some interesting facts about roshar 

1) it was purposefully made by adonalsium, no tectonic plates, storm, spren everything. 
 

2) we know honor and cultivation made new spren, but not the listeners 

 

3) from RoW we know the stones remember when they (most likely the listeners) used to “sing” and mold the rock around them, making bowls, swords, whatever they want out of stone. we don’t know if this is before the power of surges

 

4) in oathbringer we hear how honors perpendicularity is vary unstable in that it’s constantly moving.  
 

5) in RoW we find out that the stormfather is invested enough to have a small bit of a perpendicularly and that’s what allows The gems to be infused

5b) we know its not exactly a shard only power more a heavily invested property. 

6) the honor spren seem to be much older, older then the bonds.

 

so the theory time line is this. 
honor and cultivation come to roshar and start to effect things on their own 

honor creates honor spren and they form “bonds” to live in the physical realm. The singers hear the pure tone of roshar and are able to use stormlight to manipulate the stone. Their civilization is magnificent but limited due to their dependence on their stone based abilities. 
 

humans come, honor and cultivation are happy to see humanity after thousands of years and decide that it’s good to have humans as it reminds them of home

 

human and singers battle. Yada yada, honor is dying and has limited time. With help he makes the animals produce gem hearts(like the singers) to store stormlight and splits himself further to give the stormfather the ability to produce stormlight as well as higher thinking capacity. So yeah. I think stormlight was not a part of the storm until honor was dying. 

[Wandering Shade]

15 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

With help he makes the animals produce gem hearts(like the singers) to store stormlight

Up until this, I was following along and agreeing with you. I think the animals on Roshar have always had gemhearts like the singers. Which implies that Highstorms have always brought Investiture to Roshar, but that it wasn't as much before Honor invested himself in the Highstorm.

[Frustration]

The Stormfather predates the Shattering, and always was the storm.

Additionally Roshar was always invested it is just that after Honor arived there that it attuned to him, or maybe as soon as the shattering.

[Wandering Shade]

Given Connection and Spiritual Realm's timeless shenanigans, it was probably as soon as the Shattering, but that the Investiture there was only Honor's because that's where Honor and Cultivation would decide to go in the future. Stupid Spiritual Realm nonsense...

[Rg2045]

9 hours ago, Wandering Shade said:

Up until this, I was following along and agreeing with you. I think the animals on Roshar have always had gemhearts like the singers. Which implies that Highstorms have always brought Investiture to Roshar, but that it wasn't as much before Honor invested himself in the Highstorm.

Oh I agree that was the weak link in the theory and now that I think of it roshadiums where before the recreance if I remember correctly.  
So the gemhearrs might have been used to have symbiotic relationship with spren. 

9 hours ago, Frustration said:

The Stormfather predates the Shattering, and always was the storm.

Additionally Roshar was always invested it is just that after Honor arived there that it attuned to him, or maybe as soon as the shattering.

I’m almost completely sure that the storm is a work of investger but not originally invested enough to have a small perpendicularly 

basiclly I think that honor used to fulfill gems/power the knights before he automated the process by investing more into the stormfather 

[Frustration]

5 hours ago, Rg2045 said:

I’m almost completely sure that the storm is a work of investger but not originally invested enough to have a small perpendicularly 

It's not a perpendicularity.

And it has to have provided investiture because otherwise Stoneshaping wouldn't be able to work.

5 hours ago, Rg2045 said:

basiclly I think that honor used to fulfill gems/power the knights before he automated the process by investing more into the stormfather 

Then how did the dawnsingers shape the stone before Honor came?

Edited April 15, 2022 by Frustration

[Rg2045]

3 hours ago, Frustration said:

It's not a perpendicularity.

And it has to have preovided investiture because otherwise Stoneshaping wouldn't be able to work.

Then how did the dawnsingers shape the stone before Honor came?

That would be that they just drew it out with song just like how odiums forces did before the everstorm 

And it is a mini perpendicularly the way that Dalinar and the stormfather talked about it “the place where the physical, cognitive, and spiritual realm are one” 

im not saying it’s honors perpendicularly, I think that’s at the beyond, but I do think it’s a good bet that the stormfather didn’t start with that much investiture 

[Frustration]

1 minute ago, Rg2045 said:

That would be that they just drew it out with song just like how odiums forces did before the everstorm 

Are you meaning when they pulled the Everstorm into the Physical realm, or how the Song of Prayer allows them to receive Voidlight?

3 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

And it is a mini perpendicularly the way that Dalinar and the stormfather talked about it “the place where the physical, cognitive, and spiritual realm are one” 

That is Honor's perpendicularity they are talking about

4 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

im not saying it’s honors perpendicularly, I think that’s at the beyond,

The Beyond isn't a place, nor is it confirmed to exist

4 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

but I do think it’s a good bet that the stormfather didn’t start with that much investiture 

Why do you say that? Adonalisum had more than enough investiture to give Highstorms close to the investiture they have now.

And there is an investiture cycle on Roshar, so raw amount is not that much of an issue

Spoiler

Skyler Cecil

Is there an Investiture cycle on Roshar? Cycling through the crem rain and flora and fauna back into the storm, or something like that. Like the water cycle. If Investiture is finite, is it recycled back into the Cosmere when Investiture like Breath or Stormlight is expended? Otherwise, wouldn't Investiture run out?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, there is such a cycle. It is renewed and changed time and time again. It gets in and out of the Spiritual Realm, often with the birth of new individuals.

Skyward Pre-Release AMA (Oct. 5, 2018)

 

[Anomander Rake he/him]

Not a perpendicularity persay, but there is this:

Quote

Steeldancer

Would it be correct to say that the highstorms on Roshar have left the realms closer together than on other worlds? 

Brandon Sanderson

You could say [that] is true. I'd be comfortable with that idea. Though there are worlds where this goes even further than on Roshar.

Skyward Pre-Release AMA (Oct. 4, 2018)

My headcannon is this "bringing closer" is what lets the investiture from the other realms leak to the physical and how gemstones are renewed

[Rg2045]

3 hours ago, Frustration said:

Are you meaning when they pulled the Everstorm into the Physical realm, or how the Song of Prayer allows them to receive Voidlight?

That is Honor's perpendicularity they are talking about

The Beyond isn't a place, nor is it confirmed to exist

Why do you say that? Adonalisum had more than enough investiture to give Highstorms close to the investiture they have now.

And there is an investiture cycle on Roshar, so raw amount is not that much of an issue

  Hide contents

Skyler Cecil

Is there an Investiture cycle on Roshar? Cycling through the crem rain and flora and fauna back into the storm, or something like that. Like the water cycle. If Investiture is finite, is it recycled back into the Cosmere when Investiture like Breath or Stormlight is expended? Otherwise, wouldn't Investiture run out?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, there is such a cycle. It is renewed and changed time and time again. It gets in and out of the Spiritual Realm, often with the birth of new individuals.

Skyward Pre-Release AMA (Oct. 5, 2018)

 

1)was using it in comparison to the song of prayer honestly we don’t know much of preshattering abilities so I’m making this assumption based on what we know of current abilities

2) as far as I know it hasn’t been confirmed, but what has been confirmed is that when a location is highly invested the spiritual, cognitive, and physical realms bleed together it doesn’t mean it’s a shards location. 
3) sorry I meant the origin the “hypothetical” location that the storms are made where Dalinar says he constantly feels the stormfather. 
4) I use the stormfathers own words for this. When he talks about way before that he didn’t have much memories because he was a simple storm then. And we know that investiture gains intelligence when left alone 

4b) and we know that honor infused the stormfather with more investiture before his death as well as merge his CS into him.

5) I never considered it an issue especially sense they keep saying the powers infinity 

edit:

That could be the case with the above, just it sounded a lot like what Dalinar said when he pulls together the perpendicularly 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Rg2045
Not to double post

[Frustration]

4 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

1)was using it in comparison to the song of prayer honestly we don’t know much of preshattering abilities so I’m making this assumption based on what we know of current abilities

The Song of Prayer seems to require Odium's approval, so how would that work without a shard?

8 minutes ago, Rg2045 said:

4) I use the stormfathers own words for this. When he talks about way before that he didn’t have much memories because he was a simple storm then. And we know that investiture gains intelligence when left alone 

The Dor has far more investiture than he does but it isn't sentient.

[Rg2045]

5 minutes ago, Frustration said:

The Song of Prayer seems to require Odium's approval, so how would that work without a shard?

The Dor has far more investiture than he does but it isn't sentient.

1) unsure honestly sense we don’t have much information about preshattering abilities but a shard could do it why not the one whole that made the planet?

2) sorry but I don’t know what dor is I’m starting to expand my knowledge of the cosmer so I assume that I’ll get to it eventually but I’m sure a huge part of the stormfathers intelligence is due to being merged with tanavast CS as well as the nature of spren

[Frustration]

Just now, Rg2045 said:

1) unsure honestly sense we don’t have much information about preshattering abilities but a shard could do it why not the one whole that made the planet?

That seems like a lot of work when you can simply automate the prossess.

1 minute ago, Rg2045 said:

2) sorry but I don’t know what dor is I’m starting to expand my knowledge of the cosmer so I assume that I’ll get to it eventually but I’m sure a huge part of the stormfathers intelligence is due to being merged with tanavast CS as well as the nature of spren

You'll get to it eventually, the point being that the Stormfather not being fully sentient before does not preclude him from being highly invested.

[Rg2045]

1)true but have this theory because there is parts for it. I give this about a 30% of it being true 

2) that’s acceptable,