soulcast some god metal

[Slay This Rock]

I remember reading a WOB that it is possible to soulcast allomatic metals. Then, what's stopping us to make god matels?

Endless supply of mistborn and atium to fight voidbringers would be an interesting sight..

[Quiver]

The difference (so far as I understand it) is that the god metals aren't normal. Steel or iron are naturally occurring metals, which appear on a lot of different worlds. Atium and erasing are unique to Scadrial, because they're the physcial aspects of their shard. Being able to create more of them seems unlikely.

[Observer]

The Allomantic Metals are normal materials that happen to allow Preservation's power through them. God Metals are literally the physical form of Investure. You would likely wind up using just as much Investure to create them (Too much to be practical) than you would get out of them. So really, nothing would stop beyond ordinary physics and equivalent exchange.

[Swimmingly]

I would also assume that such metals would require actual Investiture from their own Shard to work. So, if you could jury-rig Soulcasting to work with Allomantic energy, it might happen.

[Ketek]

It would require that the exact same Investiture from the Shard be used, methinks.

 

You could perhaps create something that looks like atium with tons of BioChromatic Breath, but it would be fuelled by Endowment and probably do very different things.

 

It would be interesting though. What if someone turned all the Shards' investiture into god metals? What would their Allomantic/Feruchemical/Hemalurgical effect be?

[Slay This Rock]

Then maybe just enough investititure to coin the first bead of Lerasium.. and then after that start the breeding plan?

I know that may be the same amount of investiture of one shard splinter.

 

Soulcast night blood into a piece of lerasium?

 

That sounds like it is gonna hurt.

[A Joe in the Bush]

Hmm, If you got an Artifabrian capable of making a Soulcaster, together with a South Scadrian Artificer (Maker of Hemalurgic Machines) They might be able to Creath a Soulcaster that uses Mist instead of Stormlight. Then you just use it on a Misty Night.

[Robot Aztec]

 

The Allomantic Metals are normal materials that happen to allow Preservation's power through them. God Metals are literally the physical form of Investure. You would likely wind up using just as much Investure to create them (Too much to be practical) than you would get out of them. So really, nothing would stop beyond ordinary physics and equivalent exchange.

woudl you make Thanavastium and not atium? Becausse you soulcast with honoru not ruin?

[Ketek]

Tanavium, Odinium, Aonium, Skanium. I do wonder what they'd do...

[ninch]

I asked Brandon this question and he said no, the god metals are invested

 

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m104/theninch/sandersonanswerbigger_zps1501bca5.jpg

 

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m104/theninch/sandersonanswer_zps1e0737eb.jpg

 

edited to add link and then edited to to ad a link to the question so you could actually read it.

Edited April 29, 2014 by ninch

[Moogle]

I asked Brandon this question and he said no, the god metals are invested

 

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m104/theninch/sandersonanswerbigger_zps1501bca5.jpg

 

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m104/theninch/sandersonanswer_zps1e0737eb.jpg

 

edited to add link and then edited to to ad a link to the question so you could actually read it.

 

Thank you, that's very interesting. It's an indirect confirmation that Investiture cannot be converted into types from other Shards. Forgery just got a small nerf.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Moogle

[Aether]

Thank you, that's very interesting. It's an indirect confirmation that Investiture cannot be converted into types from other Shards. Forgery just got a small nerf.

I am not sure that is the correct implication. There is a WoB where he says that Atium and Lerasium are both at the core just basic metals that have a spiritual aspect to them. I think you could Soulcast the base metal just fine (of maybe not easily, but it should be possible), but you can't add the (correct) Spiritual element - the Investiture - to it.That isn't to say that Honour (pre-death) could make Tanavastium if he jury-rigged it properly. Or at least, I don't think that WoB gives a definite "no" the the question.

[Slay This Rock]

Hum.. If Brandon says so...

 

Thought I found a way to hack the system.. If it were possible, Ati would be so happy and go spike a few dozens of soulcasters to help him do this deed.

[Moogle]

I am not sure that is the correct implication. There is a WoB where he says that Atium and Lerasium are both at the core just basic metals that have a spiritual aspect to them. I think you could Soulcast the base metal just fine (of maybe not easily, but it should be possible), but you can't add the (correct) Spiritual element - the Investiture - to it.That isn't to say that Honour (pre-death) could make Tanavastium if he jury-rigged it properly. Or at least, I don't think that WoB gives a definite "no" the the question.

 

I think I was unclear. What I meant is that you likely cannot use Stormlight (Honor/Cultivation/Adonalsium? Investiture) to create atium or lerasium because atium and lerasium are from another Shard. Any Shard could create their own God-metal if they went to Scadrial, I'm sure, but you likely cannot create 'pure' essences of a Shard from the Investiture of another.

 

Consequences if the theory is correct:

• You can't Soulcast god-metals, mists, or Shardpools.
• You can't use Forgery to stamp things full of Breath or create Hemalurgic spikes with Allomantic powers.
• You can't use Feruchemical nicrosil to store Allomantic Investiture and convert it to Breath.
• You can't get Breath anywhere but Nalthis, so if you want to be fabulous, you have to suck up people's souls or find pure Endowment in the planet.
• Preservation could never create atium, nor power atium's effect (since it was done through use of Ruin's Investiture), though Preservation might be able to power a very similar effect with a workaround. WoB:
   

  Andrew the Great (19 October 2008)

  Why can Vin fuel Elend's atium-burning, even though Atium is Ruin's Body and Vin is using Preservation? Or did I misread that and he was just burning atium and had run out of everything else?

  Brandon Sanderson (20 October 2008)

  Yes, as has been pointed out:

  As a note here, the powers granted by all of the metals—even the two divine ones—are not themselves of either Shard. They are simply tools. And so, it's possible that one COULD have found a way to reproduce an ability like atium's while using Preservation's power, but it wouldn't be as natural or as easy as using Preservation to fuel Allomancy.A powerful peace swelled in Elend. His Allomancy flared bright, though he knew the metals inside of him should have burned away. Only atium remained, and the strange power did not—could not—give him this metal. But it didn’t matter. For a moment, he was embraced by something greater. He looked up, toward the sun. (From the text.)

  The means of getting powers—Ruin stealing, Preservation gifting—are related to the Shards, but not the powers themselves.

It's not terribly limiting as things go, but there's some sweet benefits to holding certain Investiture, like Breath (perfect pitch) that you can't get from other Shards.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Moogle

[ninch]

I think being able to soulcast these metals would be bad. It would be like abducting the shards body right? For the plan to horde atium and keep it hidden from him to work there must be finite amounts of atium that can exist in bead form at once, so if you could soulcast these metals i believe it would be stealing parts of Harmony and he'd notice that.

[Curiosity]

The biggest principle at play here is the fact that different types of Investiture from different Shards do not interact easily. One cannot Soulcast Preservation Investiture, since Soulcasting requires Honor/Cultivation Investiture. The interaction is impossible. It would be like trying to Soulcast Stormlight or Breath.

 

Edit: Soulcasting copper or zinc has nothing to do with creating Investiture. This is because these metals don't have any power within themselves. "Normal" Allomantic metals are simply catalysts to bring the Investiture of Preservation to fuel certain pre-determined powers ("hard-written into the user's Spirit-Web"). 

 

I don't think that I got that quotation verbatim, but it illustrates the point. I remember it from "On the Three Metallic Arts". 

Edited May 7, 2014 by Curiosity

[skaa]

I am not sure that is the correct implication. There is a WoB where he says that Atium and Lerasium are both at the core just basic metals that have a spiritual aspect to them. I think you could Soulcast the base metal just fine (of maybe not easily, but it should be possible), but you can't add the (correct) Spiritual element - the Investiture - to it.

I could just imagine Shallan talking to a chunk of metallic rock.

"Become atium."

"I am a rock."

Ugh! Not this again! "Atium is a type of rock. Just focus on ruinous thoughts, okay? Be one with Ruin!"

"I am a rock."

"Storm it!" *kicks rock*

*rock becomes angry* "I am... RAYSIUM!"

"Wha..."

(Note: I don't actually believe that raysium or any other God Metal can be made this way.)

***

Kidding aside, now I'm eager to see Shallan trying to Soulcast an Invested object into something else. She'll fail, of course, but I bet the resulting conversation will have Stick levels of awesomeness.

Edited May 9, 2014 by skaa