CosmereScholar

Hey, I’m not trying to insult you. Unless I am sorely mistaken, Ettmetal technology can be used without refueling, except maybe very rarely, as the crew in bands of morning manages to sail across the ocean using their airship, without any allomancers. If this is a serious issue, one can create a mechanical mechanism to make sure they are synchronized. Let’s say when the turbine is in the proper position, it lets a small electric current through, triggering the allomantic effect.

Perhaps you are right. There are many factors in engineering which make casual analysis of designs difficult. However, I doubt this would be more effective. Most of the investiture expended would be lost in drag. Also, the chemicals used in a liquid metal generator would be toxic, risking spills. You are correct my design would be error prone, but it would be a lot more friendly than something like a particle accelerator which require pinpoint timing. A computer with sensors could monitor the blades and time the pulses to ensure everything is in order, like in many modern generators. As for lighting, it could work in the dark or underground, I wouldn’t mind. : )

Indeed, this makes sense. So you would be creating something like a water turbine, but with currents created by Allomancy in liquid metal? This would certainly work, but from a thermodynamic point of view it would likely be more efficient to push on the turbine directly.

What ideas do you all have for Allomantic technology in the modern era? Here are some of my ideas. A-Steel/Iron Tractor Beam-As discussed in a previous thread of mine, Allomantic pushes (and likely pulls) produce some friction. Here is the thread: Physics of the Metallic Arts And here are relevant quotes as presented in the thread: This is observed most readily when Vin and Kelsier pushed on a coin and suspended it between them in Mistborn, and when Allomancers balance on a push from a single anchor. These principles could be used to create an Ettmetal tractor beam. It would work most readily on metal, but with sufficient power it could work on objects with only trace metal. It would both push and pull on objects strongly. By varying the relative strength of the pushes/pulls, you can manuver an object toward and away from the beam, and it could move an object in the other directions by swiveling the beam: the frictional force would hold it in the beam. This would be interesting to see in Era 4 on spaceships. Hovercraft-By installing metal anchors underground on a massive scale, we could create flying cars and larger hovercraft with Ettmetal Pushing and Pulling beams. The beams would be integrated into the vehicle's carriage, enabling it to propel itself with only Ettmetal as fuel. Generators- A turbine could be powered using Ettmetal, though this would depend on how scare a resource it is, by switching attrative/repulsive beams on and off at the correct frequency to maintain the spin of a metal turbine. Indeed, this could be done directly inside of a vehicle to provide a portable power source. A-Cadmium/Bendalloy Refrigerators-We could use Cadmium stasis fields to preserve foods, enabling fresh food to be stored at room temperature. Imagine an aluminum lined refrigerator with a cadmium Ettmetal device inside, which triggers once the door closes, so only seconds pass between openings in the door. Food and other unstable goods could also be transported in similar shipping creates. Medical "Cryogenics"-EMTs would carry portable Cadmium field generators, and the interior of ambulances would be slowed using this effect, turning off only at the turns and times of acceleration. This would greatly aid in medical care. Transportation-Two applications that I can see. Vehicles, like the ambulances above, could be equipped with Cadmium generators to decreadde apparent transporation time from the point of view of an observer. Or, superfast vehicles could be created with Bendalloy fields. Imagine a subway line, with Ettmetal generators running along the line whenever it is in use. A train would travel at immense speed from the point of view of an external observer. Indeed, the carriages could be lined with alluminum, so the fields don't penetrate the interior, so transport will be almost instant from the passengers point of view as well. One could create mobile vehicles with this technology, provided they sufficiently massive. One could create superfast jets, ships, trains, and submarines. Manufacturing-Once we reach the era of mass-production, I imagine most automated conveyor belts would have Bendalloy generators running along their length full time, as they would around chemical reactors. Energy-Generators, such as common steam turbines or something more exotic, could be accelerated in their operation by Bendalloy fields, greatly increasing their power output from the point of view of an external observer. There might be some problems taking the energy out of the field, if wires count either as being in-field or out of field. But, a transformer might be set up with one coil on either side of a bubble. However, there might be a reduction in power output because of the boundary's modification of the momentum of photons as they pass through, to eliminate red-shift. I doubt it though, as transformers do not move energy with photon. Worst case senario, a generator charges batteries, which are physically carter out of the field. Computing-Computers would have bendalloy fields in increase their speed of computation. This effect would not be as dramatic as it seems, as computers are growing in power very quickly. But I am sure this edge would be well utilized. F-Chromium-Engineers who use this power would be more likely to discover optimal designs, scientists to happen upon a crucial experiment, mathematicians on a crutial realization. This should increase technological progress immensely. Additionally, chemists using luck might be able to create thermodynamically unfavorable reactions. I doubt this could be done large scale, too improbable. But small quanities of nanoparticles could be created by chance, which would give a significant edge to nanoengineering on Scadrial. Even a small amount of an enzyme could be used as a catalyst to create large amounts of useful substances, which would create shortcuts in developments which might otherwise have taken decades to progress.

Janet is an awesome voice for Nightblood! Now I won't be able to get that out of my head. I just imagined a cheerful male voice, a bit goofy.

I would disagree with this. Many stone artifacts of that age in our world are quite illegible. Also, we know that Aharietion's stone formations are unknown to modern Rosharans, and they included evidence of liquification of stone holes where thunderclasts were. I think that erosion/crem is likely responsible. But, could the artifact have not just been sheltered?

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Foolishness. : )

I have speculated that the misleading part of the quotation is that Bondsmiths have always been able to give stormlight to other radiants, but never have they been able to unite the realms or draw unlimited stormlight.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/136-general-signed-books-2014/#e2661

Wow! So indeed there is a frictional force perpendicular to the pushes/pulls. Thank you! You have just confirmed that part of my theory. I cannot believe I had never seen that. This by itself explains the coin situation and the balancing on the top of beams (assuming friction also affects the allomancer, which I hold is very likely). This implies that it would indeed be possible to build a tractor beam using allomancy, as speculated! Also, if this behaves similarly to normal friction, it would slow the rotation of objects affected by allomancy, and allomancers themselves, as they push. I wonder if in future novels this effect might be discovered. Though it is merely speculation, I do think that different pushes/pulls repelling to be centered in different parts of the body would explain all of the crushing/ripping phenomena, though I agree that it appears inconsistent at this point. You're talking about Feruchemical Iron I assume. Yes, there are severe problems with it.

Indeed, I have seen both of your WoBs. They did not seem to me to specifically say that speed does not create a personal speed bubble, though perhaps I was mistaken. But, this is definitely inconsistent if the effect is not temporal. I hope that Sanderson will not canonize how it works yet. Any thoughts on the other physical conundrums?

Not a typo, but a physical anomaly stood out to me in two places. Hardcover pg. 90 This does not conserve momentum properly, as simply lashing himself upward, then making himself weightless would not lead him to hover in place, but would leave him slowly drifting upward. To cause hovering, we should instead have: "He Lashed himself upward so he rose into the air, then added a Lashing downward to slow himself, gradually reducing it to hover about two feet above the floor." Hardcover pg. 868 This wording is less explicit but stands out to me because of the previous situation. Also, we have Kaladin nearly blacking out at one point when he changes direction. But, if Lashings truly manipulate gravity, he should not experience acceleration at any point, and should feel almost weightless at first, only feeling weight when he approaches terminal velocity. Blacking out would only be caused by uneven acceleration. Hardcover pg. 1100

Thank you! Indeed, I have read that thread. Unless I missed something, it appeared to mainly address the strength of pushes and pulls. These are issues which I believe have not yet been discussed. The discussion on Steelrunning I mentioned comes from https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/79017-allomancy-physics/#comment-762438

But, in reality, a spaceship would not be affected by flying between two strong sources of gravity. They would just cancel. Unless they were strong enough for the distribution of force to be skewed significantly from one side of the ship to the other, in which case a tidal force would cause the ship to stretch, even if there is only one source of gravity, not two competing ones (just as the moon causes the tide.) What do you mean though by uneven opposing forces? Because if they weaken across the coin with distance from the allomancer, that would cause the coin to turn so it was in-plane with Vin and Kelsier, as occurs with tidal effects. However, if this were generally true, we would indeed see a slow in the rotation of objects as they were pushed as they become tidally locked, though to clarify, I doubt this rotation would actually happen. This is merely a test I would like to conduct to test this frictional theory. I agree the forces must be unevenly distributed to some degree, at least when the allomancer chooses, in order for the crushing to happen, though I would prefer for them to be evenly distributed, as I like the smooth acceleration theory. But, why do allomancers then not damage their bodies? Unless...this only happens when two pushes act on an object, and they affect each other's distributions. I did not think of this! That would actually explain crushing perfectly, and I hope it becomes cannon someday (though I realize it almost certainly wasn't Sanderson's original intention). Unfortunately, there does definately need to be some perpendicular force on pushed objects for allomancy to be consistent. But, I agree with you : (

I doubt that the heralds are the nine shadows. Too much build up with Ash and Taln as characters. However, I am not certain they will be the unmade as the stormfather suggested, if only because Sja-anat seems to be in rebellion. Could it be the shadows are just some evil effect, like the inverse shadows are somehow linked to Shadesmar? After all, there is some evil lore with shadows going the wrong way (though personally I doubt this is true.)

As for your second spoiler. Vivena is pretty prominent in Oathbringer, almost as prominent as Hoid. Keep an eye out for her. It should become obvious who she is by the last third of the book. You noticed Nightblood at the end of Words of Radiance I presume. Did you notice Vasher? He's in the second book but it's less obvious. I did not catch it when I read it. He uses lifesense...

No, this would not work. Have you studied the principle of conservation of momentum? The center of mass of the coins/mistborn system would continue falling at the usual acceleration, so this scheme could not remain airborn for long.

A fan of Sanderson's work here! I thought I would create a thread with all of the conundrums in physics that occur in the Cosmere, and my theories. I hope these will be clarified eventually, as consistency seems very important to Sanderson's style. Allomancy-Steelpushing/Ironpulling Crushing/Ripping Effect- Several times in Mistborn it is mentioned that opposing forces can crush objects. In The Final Empire, Vin and Kelsier push on a coin, trapping it between them and flattening it. Additionally, at the end of Well of Ascension Vin opens a heavy door and anchors herself by pulling on sources of metal behind, and notes that the exertion nearly rips her apart. Several times it is mentioned Mistborn can burn pewter to strengthen their bodies and be able to push metal in opposite directions with being crushed. If allomantic forces affected the object as a whole equally, or around the center of mass, then these effects should simply cancel. Resistance to Lateral Motion- Though it is mentioned numerous times that allomancy can only exert forces directly towards or away from yourself, several times phenomena imply that pushes can cause an object to resist lateral motion as well. For instance, in mistborn, when Vin first studies allomancy, it is explained that a person can hover at the top of a steelpush off a single anchor, and allomancers do this throughout the series. However, it should not be possible without some sideways stabilizing force. One could argue that allomancers can exert a push off-center, as with an outstretched hand, or that they can push on their anchor off-center (shown to be possible in Kelsier's last fight scene in The Final Empire, where he pushes on different sides of a rod.) However, as coinshots are able to reach the hight of a city wall with this technique, and the anchor being so small the distance should be such that it would be impractial to balance oneself with this method, as the slightest deviation should send them toppling. More conclusively, when Vin and Kelsier push on a coin and flatten it, as mentioned previously, it hangs in the air between them. If indeed allomancers could only push directly away from themselves the coin should fall immediately under the influence of gravity. One could argue their forces are directed slightly upward exactly enough to counteract the coin's weight, but the slightest deviation would push the coin to the side (as happens with other coins in the same scene). Theory-Allomantic forces are not applied to the object as a whole. Instead, they are applied to the surfaces of anchor/allomancer exerting them which face each other. This would allow for a coin to be crushed, because the forces are applied each to only one side of the coin. It would allow for an allomancer to feel compression/stretching, as forces would be applied to different sides of their bodies. Additionally, there pushes exert some force perpendicular to their direction of action, acting a little like friction. The pushes on either side of a coin would hold it in place, because it would be like two walls pressing the coin together. It would also prevent Vin from falling at the edge of her push, as it would be as if she were standing on a virtual surface with friction. There are problems with this, however. The most major one is that, if allomantic forces are not evenly distributed, then each time the allomancer pushes themselves into the sky, it would feel as if a car were crashing upward into them. Alternative explantions are that the effect is not strictly on the surface. They could penetrate inward into the body a bit, lessening the destructive effect. Applications for the theory: If the effect resisting lateral force does act like friction, it would also reduce spin in objects affected by allomancy. So a spining rod heading towards an allomancer would slow its spin when pushed away. Whether or not the friction idea is correct, a mistborn should be able to suspend objects in midair, even at an angle, by pushing and pulling very strongly on the same object. Then, the object would be unable to move perpendicular to the push/pull (as Vin does not appear to slowly destablize on the top of a push, I postulate the force adjusts automatically to keep an object stationary, like static friction), and motion parallel to the beam could be adjusted by changing the power of the push (something like this might have helped Kelsier move objects back and forth towards the inquisitor at the end of his final fight with an Inquisitor, though I agree this could have just been done by adjusting his own position very carefully). One can imagine an ettmetal tractor-beam based on this phenomenon. Indeed, one might be able to create a trap for metallic organic molecules with enough power, though this would be several steps in power level above even the allomancy of the lord ruler, as a single molecule would be a poor anchor. Feruchemy-Iron We have been told that weight storage actually changes your mass, but does so in a way that does not affect your density, using the Higgs Field in some way, and also has a strengthening effect, so the body can withstand small falls. Momentum is to be conserved in the iteration. It also shouldn't make a person's arm more massive, so they can punch someone with incredible effect, according to a WoB, nor make them so dense bullets can't affect them. Firstly, if indeed Higgs Field interactions were changing a person's mass, then Feruchemist's density should certainly be increased. Let us say however, that the person's increased mass is instead attached to them abstractly, perhaps around their center of mass. Then we could have punches be light, though one could still injure someone by jumping on top of them, and we do see Wax do this a bit in Mistborn Era 2, both jumping onto someone and knocking open a door like this, though not to its maximum effectiveness in my opinion. However, Wax should definately be impervious to bullets if he chooses to based on what we have seen, regardless whether the above theory is correct. Even if he is not becoming denser, we know he can strenghten his body enough to withstand pressures which break paving stones and crush floors (though he should really be pulverising his clothing on landings). He should also be able to then withstand the pressure of a bullet, or possibly even a knife. Also, if he is strong enough to stand at such weights, he should be strong enough to kill with a single punch, though it could be he just prefers his flying at low weight tactic. Also, using the strengthening effect, he ought to be able to withstand large falls without pushing off an anchor. He could fall at normal weight, then increase his weight dramatically at the last moment, so as to become impervious to a speed which would have been generated by a very small fall at that weight. Possibly he has had no need of this tactic, though it seems unusual he has not mentioned it. There are also distinct problems in Wax's conservation of momentum. He mentions several times that changing mass during a fall does not slow him, because acceleration due to gravity does not depend on mass. While this is true, he should definitely slow down temporarily if he increases his mass, otherwise, he would be gaining momentum. Also, he mentions that he speeds up slightly if he reduces his mass midflight. This is unusual, as if he halves his weight, his speed should actually double, hardly a slight effect, though he could just be misjudging both of these cases. There is one scene specifically in which Wax does not conserve momentum. At the finale of Alloy of Law, he reduces mass, Pushes off the floor, increases mass, then pushes up at a building, annihilating it. He does this presumably so pushing the building doesn't send him down through the floor. However, since he became lighter, he almost certainly did not have much upward momentum before his massive push. If he conserved momentum, this would not have slowed his descent much at all. Possibly, he was so massive he did not appear to accelerate and was mistaken that his strategy would have helped, though he ought to have noticed massive downward acceleration when he lightened again. Feruchemy-Crashing(F-Iron+A-Steel) There is an additional effect of Wax's powers that appears unusual. He mentions that he can gain an advantage by lightening himself mid-jump, to gain a slight boost of speed. This would indeed make him faster. But, would it not be even faster for him to stay light as much as possible while flying, so he could accelerate more rapidly? Perhaps this is just him being unfamiliar with his powers, but I find it strange to have someone as experienced as Wax make wrong analyses. Feruchemy-Steelrunning This is by far the most unusual physics-wise, as has already been observed in the forums. It is supposed to make someone faster without really increasing the force they can exert. In Shadows of Self, we see Bleeder run down steps and jump a window ledge at high speed. However, using conventional propulsion would have destroyed the steps, and indeed the ground whenever she tried to run. Also, she would have had to pull herself down the steps, not run as was described (though it might not have been visible at speed) for her to move down faster than she could have fallen. Also, I doubt ground could support static friction necessary for walking at such conditions. Also, Marasi strangely doesn't seem to notice any inertial effects as she moves around. The only explanation I can think of is that Steelrunning actually manipulates time, creating a bendalloy bubble just around your person. Then, gravity would function normally from your perspective, allowing Bleeder to go down steps with no trouble, and forces you exert would be the same as normal movement, and would only interact with the surroundings briefly from their point of view, causing no damage, and also keeping you from punching someone with unusual strenght. However, there are problems with this theory. The inertia of objects would make them very difficult to move from your perspective, making it so you could only open doors and wield guns at normal speeds, contradicting what we know from Shadows of Self. More seriously, your clothing and the air would resist your passage, and Marasi did not appear to notice the effect of her clothing in Bands of Morning, though she could have been unconsciously tapping strength to move it, though this would likely have damaged it. The most likely explaination is that the Bendalloy field also encompases objects you're touching, but not other people if you punch them, because their investiture rejects it. I would expect that someone very powerful would then be able to overcome this effect however. Sanderson has stated that it would be possible to "burn up" by using too much speed though, and this fits with this theory. Any thoughts?

Surgebinding-I like the ability to heal both myself and others.

Thank you all for welcoming me! What are these cookies? Warbreaker. It is also the first book of his I have read, other than the Wheel of Time. However, the Stormlight Archive is close. It is my favorite series. I really like whatever Renarin is. His healing and future sight are my favorite powers, I think. Or, possibly Elsecaller, depending on how transportation works.

Hello!

Questions: An Awakener-Allomancer stores breath in metal, then burns it. Can they Breath-compound? If so, will it generate Breath, or just increase the person's heightening? Can a coinshot in a cadmium bubble push on metal outside of the bubble? (I believe it was done out of a bendalloy bubble in Shadows of Self). If so, will the acceleration of the metal outside the bubble appear shockingly high because of the differing rates of time? An infused sphere is placed in an aluminum chamber. Does it stop going dun beyond a certain point (as would happen if stormlight obeyed gas dynamics)? If so, will a surgebinder in an aluminum chamber not leak stormlight below a certain point? Can an allomancer still use their powers normally in an aluminum chamber? Why does Wax not slow down when he increases his weight when falling? Though his acceleration should remain constant, he should slow down temporarily if he indeed conserves momentum. A forger stamps herself to be an ideal candidate for a Lightweaver and bonds a Cryptic, progressing until they have a shardblade by continually renewing her stamp. She forgets to stamp herself one day. What happens to the bond? What about if she restamps herself? If she breaks oaths in a different persona (her true self or someone else), does it count? What if instead, a forger becomes a surgebinder as her true self, then stamps herself? Is the bond interfered with then?