Exile

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All very true. I'm writing a fanfic right now with a lurcher and it's hella fun, but there are serious limitations that any serious coinshot would not have and the lurcher is doing some things that a coinshot wouldn't dream of doing. A competent coinshot in the first Mistborn trilogy should not have died in the few situations I saw them plument to their death. In today's society a lurcher would have the serious advantage due total monopoly of steel and other metals used in modern buildings. But it would still be more fun to be a coinshot, imo. Not only can you sore around on pennies but your basicly a walking gun. I good coinshot wouldn't need to fear a pewterarm. With any skill he could play keep away and down him from afar.

So as for the two physical external metals, I would choose to push.

In either case you are still better off being a coinshot than a lurcher, which was my orgional premise. A coinshot is just all around better prepared for a fall than a lurcher is for the majority of circumstances.

You're taking the example too literal. If anybody (lurcher, coinshot, etc) fell out of a plane they would be screwed. But if you fall from a cliff or large tree or stone wall, really anything with out metal, you would only have a chance of surviving as a coinshot. It is much easier to put an anchor below you (be it a coin or bullet casing or whatever) because there is going to be ground below you to push against. Percentage wise there won't be nearly as many chances to pull against something secure above you.

Unless you have an aluminum plane, I think the Lurcher will be fine.

Still, I would ultimately go with Coinshot, on the basis that while you're practicing, if something goes wrong, you're less likely to get impaled.

-- Deus Ex Biotica

Now you're just taking my example to literal.

Just how much is the difference in metabolic burn of metals? Pewter is said to be the quiest to burn (aside from atium) and copper/tin the slowest but I wouldn't mind a ball park (if that's within posting rules).

Like if you swallow enough pewter to burn straight for 5 minutes and the same amount of steel, how long can you burn that?

My first instinct is a Coinshot or Lurcher, coupled with a little BASE Jumping. Which one is the bigger question - Batman shows me that, in a city, being a Lurcher is actually far more useful and versatile than being a Coinshot due to greater control, but on the other hand, it couldn't help you, say, careen around the Grand Canyon without serious prep work, which a Coinshot could. Tricky.

I'd say coinshot for sure for these reasons. Yeah maybe spirderman and batman can grapel through skyscrapers with ease, but a coinshot with coins can do most of the same things. Not to mention I'd be seriously parinoid about falling and as long as you have something metal on you then a coinshot should not be afraid of falling. A lurcher on the other hand... you don't always have a tall metal building around to ease your fall. If you push a lurcher and a coinshot out of a plane and only one is going to survive.

Having said all that... tin would be pretty cool. More helpful in all the day to day stuff as well as anything dangerious.

Has to be cadmium(sp?). Stores luck. That is just all kinds of cool and useful.

When this game is played I doubt you'll be able to play as separate Mistings. You'll play one central character who is Mistborn. I'd put money on that, unless somebody has a source that says otherwise.

I'll admit that Malcolm Reynolds from Firefly is basically Wax plus a space ship and minus the twinborn.

I don't know but I think I could buy there being no more Mistborn. It sounds like at the end of Hero of Ages the only Mistborn left was Spook and other Mistings were only half-skaa or lesser noblemen. It's a bit of a stretch but I don't think it's impossible. Merely improbable.

As for there still being obligators around, I would very much agree. If only because they still use things like "Canton of Cartography" and the like. I doubt they have eye tattoos and do not shave their heads. They probably aren't even called obligators but I'm sure they have something that serves a similar function.

Exile, I am not sure I understand your stance properly, or, actually, that you understand mine either. The key to this twinborn flight comes from the twinborn's ability to adjust their mass. Kinetic energy is F=ma, while acceleration is a=F/m. The twinborn decreases his mass substantially and then pulls on the counterweight, pulling himself towards that direct. Even though F might be small, he can make m even smaller, so his acceleration can be great. He can then increase his mass substantially. No matter how small that F was, it is now being ridiculously multiplied by m. This gives him a huge amount of kinetic energy, which by pulling he can then transfer partially to the counterweight. He's now low on kinetic energy, so he decreases his mass, pulls on the counterweight when it passes, accelerates, and increases mass, restoring his lost energy and allowing him to repeat the process again. There's a net gain of energy, which is what lets one hover (if one is only pulling directly up and down) or, if one angels it properly, fly. Hovering would probably be the harder of the two possibilities.

Just a,

Thought

Okay, I think I understand in theory. Basically what you are doing is moving your anchor through the sky and following it and then pulling it after you, varying wait to insure you either get pulled to it or it is pulled towards you. Yeah that could work. But I think you might have to be a zinc ferring to get all the angles down. That would be incredibly hard. Harder, I think, than Vin's use of horseshoes in the second book.

That's a good question. What exactly does copper compounding do?

I always assumed the Lord Ruler compounded copper and therefore had a flawless memory. He didn't have to store any memories or what not, just as long as he compounded copper (what ever that entailed) which could be nearly constant as he copper is cheap and burns relatively slowly, then he would have perfect recall during this period.

Really the character concept is pretty cool. A bit like that new tv cop drama called "Unforgetable", I think (ironicly I can't remember it very well). There wouldn't be much of a combat orientation for this but having a flawless memory is still pretty freaking helpful.

EDIT: and as for the iron compounder, the actual problem would be going anywhere but where you started. Even angling the metal when you throw it would cause you to fly back to your original position. You could hover, but actual flying might prove impossible.

Do you mean the earring given to Wax? I don't remember Miles getting one.

And correct. There really is not such a thing as good tasting poison. It usually has to bet masked by a really strong type of flavor like mint or cinnamon.

Is there a timeline for Sanderson's annotations to come out for his books? I have never paid attention to them before but I would really like to see what he was trying to convey most strongly with Alloy.

Do we have any speculation on the system, story or style?

I'm going to throw this out here and maybe I'm wrong but...

I love being critical as much as the next guy, but until you finish the series you should probably hold off on the skepticism and critiquing. Sanderson manages to answer a number of your worries with what I feel are credible responses. And I'm sure a number of people reading this thread want to respond to your worries on idealism, black and white morality and so on with different examples, but a lot of them come to fruition in the final book.

So please, finish the Hero of Ages. If you finish that and still have worries about character motivation and beliefs then we can start this party in real grandeur.

p.s. Also on the passion of Vin and Elend, the main topic of this thread, I think that was one of the harder to read subplots of the book. The tension of their relationship was a very important part that was hard to notice as more than annoying until you realize what Zane wanted of Vin. Then it became very important. Also, the scene in the tent at the end of the Well of Ascension where Vin mentions sleeping naked is enlightening as to the state of their relationship. That time period was a bit like their honeymoon come to think about it.

I think you guys are putting to much stock in burning metals unconsciously. I would think you would need a large amount of the metal to really realize you're doing it. A flash of strength or enhanced senses would be hard to notice. Blue lines sprouting from your chest would probably be easier though.

Also I think it is interesting to think about the awesomeness of, after your really intense beating at the hand of other nobles of your house, you swallow the 8 basic metals and feel for reserves. Imagine finding one and not knowing what it is. Or finding all 8 there. Like winning the lottery or somesuch.

Tan was definitely a Slider, having reread it. As to why he didn't use it to prolong the battle seems simple. If you read the prologue, clearly he is insane. Dude stuffs humans for show. It is really a disturbing sequence. Good catch.

I am curious as to how Sazed reads the minds of his followers. That seems a bit off from most canon. The earring is the obvious point of communication. He is wearing it during all of Sazed touches on his emotions and actual conversing.

I'm not sure why people are so disbelieving of Steris being the Kandra. As some people have pointed out not all Kandra follow Sazed. Some seem to be rogue. And if Uncle Ladrian is going to want a spy there would be no better than her. He had plenty of time to torture copious amounts of information from her and have her replaced before she is rescued and as previously stated, she has no allomantic powers to speak of. Not to mention all you hopeless romantics will enjoy it when she is outed and Wax can go after Marasi.

That being said... the Constable makes a pretty decent case too. Kandra working for Sazed who wants Wax involved with the law enforcement in town. But there might be something else going on with the Constable, some bribe or even his own religious affiliation. He has a slight lead on Steris, but she is still plausible.

Wax's uncle being Mister Suit wasn't exactly hard to guess. Between Miles talk of him "disinheriting" and the butlers suicide bombing pretty much sealed it. Still a cool confrontation scene.

Marsh's entrance was pure win. His name dropping and whatnot caused a lot of nostalgia in a short scene. I had a theory that Marsh was using Cadmium to hustle through time, but I guess Sanderson has confirmed Marsh's use of the Lord Rulers youth trick.

I've got to say this new Twinborn mess is awesome. It's going to start a wide flow of fanfiction that I might participate in. I really want to see what it would be like to have a professional gambler who was a Chromium ferring.

The reason this book catches a lot of flack is because of it's super generic plot. Cargo theft and kidnapping in the old west? Right out of the book. I loved the characters, but Wax being a retired lawman with a haunted past isn't exactly original. However I do believe Sanderson does this on purpose. This was suppose to connect two trilogies over an extended time skip. To keep the change more subtle and easy to follow he kept a generic plot and let the fireworks show with his character development and awesome metal magic tweaks. It makes sense, but this seems to be where he loses a lot of support. I understand it but it didn't appeal to the masses.

There's more here to discuss, but I need to read it one more time.

Is it so wrong that I want to see Nathan play as Miles? He always seems to play a good guy (Captain Reynolds, Castle, etc). He plays a great cowboy but I'd like to see him go bad too.

I scanned and didn't see it mentioned but I don't think anybody could convince me that Timothy Olyphant (most commonly known now for his current role in Justified) would not make a perfect Wax. Hell, he basically already plays that character on FX. It's pretty much the guy I used in my head while reading the book.