If.you.die.I.go.stupid

Pitty. Adolin is a great character.

Interesting. I saw it more as a mix of envy and hero worship but it makes sense. It was Jasnah's sexuality that stood out to me. I can't decide if she prefers women or if she has had some awful experience with a man in her past or maybe both.

I'm only half way through the compiled WoB. They can be teasing and coy. There are things that he doesn't want to discuss, but I haven't noticed anything deceptive. Of course, that's the point of deception, but I suspect Adolin isn't broken yet. Assuming he will break, maybe it will be caused by guilt, his fathers reaction or some other ramification of the murder.

That's the quote I was thinking of. It is more vague than I thought. I can see how it could mean cook, but I think cook is third son. Rock says he came down from the peaks because his people needed their cook to go with them. That seems to be how he was serving and he is no first son. Also, when he says he serves as an craftsman, no one ask about it. They only know him as a cook and hearing he is a craftsman doesn't raise an eyebrow, so I'm guessing cooks are seen as craftsman. He was a fourth or further son at some point, WoB, so that is most likely to explain his training with the bow.

I'll have to search the ebooks when I get home, but I think first son was a farmer because food is most important. Third son is artisan and cooks are artisans. I know he was a cook in the peaks. It's why Sadeas made him a cook.

Kaladin is more self centered than selfish. He thinks he can save everyone. This is part of what attracts Syl, but Kaladin doesn't know where to draw the line. He sees himself as responsible for everyone's safety and blames himself for things he has no control over. For a while he thinks the nightwatcher or almighty has cursed him. It seems the height of hubris to think god is out to get you specifically. Kaladin really reminds me of the Aristotelian virtue of magnanimity, knowing your worth and abilities and acting accordingly. He is missing this. He wants to do more than his abilities allow. As his abilities grow is is capable of doing a lot, but as a bridgeman with few resources or as a 15 year old with no training, he had extremely unrealistic expectations. As a bridgeman he had good results, but he was disappointed that he wasn't able to save every life. Even as a radiant he will have limits. It will be interesting to see if he can accept that, or if refusing to accept them is a core pat of who he is. Maybe even a core part of what makes him a windrunner. On the whole I think his motives are selfless, but his actions lack an awareness of what he can do to an extent that causes him depression. Sometimes he strays into selfishness. It is similar to what Navani describes in Dalinar. She tells him his guilt is selfish. Kaladin does the same, wallowing in guilt and taking on responsibilities that aren't his.

@soulcastJam sounds right to me, especially with WoB.

@SarevokYes, but the bond takes several days before the blade can be dismissed. I think it was five days, but would have to check to be sure. That's why Dalinar pretends to be sick and dissappears. Renarin is seen carrying his blade around during this bond time. After it is bonded he doesn't summon it much.

Just to add to this, Hoid also says that he thinks the storm will change the parshmen. I assumed her response was to the method of change not the direction of the storm.

I've always thought that Dalinar had some bond to the stormfather before the oaths. His use of stormlight and the visions both indicate this, but it is a pre-oath bond. Each oath/truth/set of words makes the bond stronger and requires more of the radiant and spren. When Dalinar confronts the stormfather, the stormfather says that he refuses to be bound in a way that could kill him, so while there was some bond already, it was not strong. It was like Kalidians first days with Syl, before he knew what was going on. For the bond to go further, the Stormfather demanded Dalinar get rid of his shard blade. @Argel My point with Glys was just that Glys might not have liked shardblades but didn't demand that Renarin get rid of it. I wasn't trying to speculate on Glys motives. @maxalHow do we know when Glys was bonded? I missed this. I know Renarin is uncomfortable with the blade from the very beginning, but it seems to bother him more later and his eyesight improves later. I could never decided if the initial discomfort over the blade was because of a bond or something else. I can't image walking around with that thing screaming in my head for several days.

His bond to the blade was the standard bond to a blade, i.e., through a gem stone in the hilt, not a direct bond to the spren. Having a bond to a 'dead' blade is very different, but it does tell us something. Glys was willing to bond when Renarin held a blade. The stormfather demanded Dalinar get rid of his blade. This seems in line with what Brandon said, some things will repel one spren while another can overlook it.

I know WoB put the officer uniforms as sort of french, just after Napoleon. I don't know what era, if any, he had in mind for armor. Lighteyes of low rank often become archers. I don't recall a description of their uniforms, but I wouldn't expect anything more than leather armor for archers.

Not something I've considered, and not a ship I'd like to see. It might be possible though. I don't know about Syl becoming physical, but Kaladin could become incorporeal and hangout with Syl and maybe even Kelsier in Shadesmare. I don't see it happening, but theoretically, I guess it could.

Oops. Rock. Or patrock?

True, but we know enough to see his struggle to be like his father. Most people have multiple motives. We aren't seeing all of his, only what other characters notice. That said, sometimes other people's view of a person is more accurate than their own view of themselves. I'd say there are hints he could be better than people think, but only hints. It could go either way.

HBO? Not enough sex in the story for them. Could be fun to guess where they might insert it.

All good points. I'm not totally sold on his motives though. He is selfish, but most of that seems to come from insecurity. He could have deeper motivations that we haven't seen. I don't see much evidence for this so far. I also don't recall a POV from him, so his motives are second hand and inferred. I think you pretty well nailed it though. He wants to do what's right, but really he wants to be the one doing it. He won't step aside for someone better. That whole conversation with Kaladian could be an outline for Elhokar's future conflict in the story. Can he accept his limits or learn to overcome them, will he ever put what is best above his desire to be the hero and leader his father was? I really think he needs to speak a truth "I'm not the man my father was." I don't think it has anything to do with a bond. He needs that truth to progress as a character and discover what kind of man he can be. If he can do that, I think a bond is possible. I don't think the spren watching him want a bond with him. Something else is going on.

This doesn't perfectly describe Elhokar, but it describes him pretty well. His mother uses some of these words to describe him. He is definitely erratic. He loves a good adventure, race or duel. We don't know much about Willshapers but the little I've read, well it seems a decent fit., assuming he ever does bond a spren. I can see why his temperament makes him appear unfit. I'm not convinced he will bond a spren. I think it was lie spren watching him. They fit the description, and they went awa when Kalidian and Syl came on the scene. Lie spren and honor spren don't get along, so I think they avoided Syl. They probably didn't want the honor spren to know they were watching the king. However, I don't think he is unfit. Kalidian describes himself as a broken man. This could be said of Elhokar to, broken by paranoia, the weight of being in his fathers shadow, and his own ineffectiveness as a leader, but when Kalidian told Syl he couldn't be the hero she wanted because he was a broke man, she told him "they all were, Silly", referring to KR. I'm not sure if this means broken in the since Kalidian meant or if Syl is just saying they were all flawed men/women. Either way it leaves open the possibility of Elhokar. He is selfish and a poor leader, but he tries, and he wants to be better than he is. That may attract a certain kind of spren.

@Iron Eyes I think rick seeing spren has something to do with parshindi heritage.

Yes. Third son is artisan, hence cook. He does seem special. I don't think all Horneaters can see spren. I am interested in what happens with him, especially if he shows up on the peaks glowing.

I'd like to see Kalidian with his shardspear, fighting Szeth in the storm with wind spren zipping around him. Adolin talking to his blade would be awesome too. Seems like foreshadowing.

Nice. I really like the the shardplate. Dalinar looks good too, but could use a broken nose.

Only thing that comes to mind is when Kaladin and Shallan fought the casam fiend. She summoned her blade and his cheek brushed against the "cold metal". So some sort of metal. Spren or ideas, so I'd go for ratium. Ratio for idea and ium for metal.

Wait, the first time she summoned a blade was after the shipwreck? I thought it was in her mother's death. One of the bodies has burned out eyes, the whole thing with her mother's soul seemed to be in reference to a blade and when a shardblade is pointed at her father he glance up and says something like “no, this one is different.” implying he thought for a second it was the blade used in his wife’s death. Do you mean she didn't summon a blade as a child or that she did but probably couldn't do so as an adult until she said the truths again? That makes sense. Pattern says he was dumb for a long time. I think that is the time when shallan ‘forgets’ about him. The truths reestablish a connection that allows pattern to gain intelligence again and allows Shallan to surgebind. I think she may have been able to draw the blade before the truths. Mother's soul was behind a painting at her home. Was it there or was it placed there and then pattern left because he wasn't fully ‘dead’? I've never put much thought into this, but if pattern remained a blade could she, the one originally bonded to the spren, summon it or would any summoning require a gem in the hilt? If pattern didn't remain a blade, I'm not sure what that tells us. The bond could have been strongly intact after she kills her mother. It could have faded over time as she grew in her denial of the truth. Maybe it broke at a specific point I'm missing or we haven't seen yet. Maybe it didn't break but just regressed and pattern wasn't dead but went backwards, acting more like a spren without sapieces. Shallan summoning a blade in any of these scenarios seems unlikely to me, except for one thing, her summoning her blade could be seen as a truth, I have a blade, this blade is different from others, I killed with this blade in the past… that might have been enough to reestablish the bond.

Fairly sure Dalinar isn't the only one to see the visions. One of the death gasps is said to be from a man who saw strange visions during high storms. Seems likely they would be the same sort of visions that Dalinar see, but I guess they could be different. I don't see why others seeing visions would rule out a bond with the storm father. Honor left the visions behind somehow. I think the storm father was left the task of making sure someone sees the visions. Maybe he wasn't specifically instructed to, maybe he just feels obligated to for some reason. Some level of bond may be required for the visions. He is obviously resistant to a full bond but may have initiated the bonding process because of his obligation to make sure the visions are seen.