Tasty Flesh

Interesting theory! Unfortunately a friend of mine has my copy of WoK, so I can't read through the passage with Galivar... that said, the following are my thoughts.

Positives:

It would explain why Odium is still on Roshar, if Odium was trying to recover his investiture.

It would explain why Odium hadn't splintered Cultivation.

It would explain the name "The Broken One," which I always found a bit of an odd title.

Negatives:

I propose he was broken by the Radiants stealing a portion of his power using the sphere--possibly given by the Ire?

Two parts to this.

First, I doubt it was the Radiants, but rather the Heralds are more likely candidates for this. Even then though, I'm not sure if they have the power necessary to do this. I think it is more likely it was Honor who would responsible. This could possibly be the Oathpact, although, that name doesn't seem to fit these circumstances very well, so I think that is something else.

Second, I would doubt the Ire. I doubt they would be interested in giving others the ability to take up a shard, especially when that is their interest to do so themselves. That said, they may want to do anything possible to keep Odium at bay, or weakened, so who knows. However, if the investment of this sphere happened as early as you seem to suggest, then I think it is unlikely that the Ire is responsible.

Dang, I wish that 2nd part had been as concise as the 1st part...

I don't know much about fabrials, but I would assume this is the difference between fabrials and metalminds. Fabrials channel investiture, while metalminds store it physically inside themselves. The way half-shards work is they are putting that investiture into the shield itself, to block shardblades. At least I assume.

Huh. I never really thought of the difference that way, but it's a good, and important, point. 

I think that a gemstone would take two cuts from a Shardblade. First, to sever the investiture, and second to dun stone itself.

Half-Shards are nowhere near the Shardplate. They can take one hit from the Blade and then are gone; Shardplate regenerates, imbues user with some enhancements; as for the "without direct Investiture", I have to remind you that destroyed part of Shardplate explodes in molten metal and gaseous Stormlight - it's likely that, similarly to the Blades, Shardplate is made of solid Investiture.

I seem to recall them being able to take more than one hit from a blade, though being considerably weaker than Plate itself, although I could be wrong.

The enhancements though are a very good point, it does certainly differentiate it from the half-shards.

Nonetheless, I think it still shows that, theoretically, and with enough research, Shardplate could be created. Half-shards are only the first step in that process.

I don't think Plate is solid Investiture. 

Then again, it seems radiants may have been able to summon their plate, as as Dalinar sees in his visions the Radiant seemingly summoning their Helmets.

So, perhaps! I always thought of them differently, but that could very well just be mistakes on my parts.

You should in fact be thinking Shardblades in that case. Being physical metal manifestations of Spren, they're technically made of tanavastium. No idea what Shardplate is atm.

Yeah, I think Shardblades would be more likely in that case than Shardplate. Especially considering that Half-Shards are able to be created, meaning that one could theoretically create Plate without direct investiture.

Actually it would mean 18*16 metals. 16 base metals + 16 pure god metals + 16 * 16 god metal alloys. It gets worse when you allow for god metal alloys of god metal alloys (like lerasium alloy of malatium, for example).

You may want to check this. I believe paragraphs 1, 5 and 6 are relevant.

Oh dang. that is so many possibilities it makes my brain hurt. 

Thanks for the link to that! Really good post, and interesting theory. 

Every God Metal may be used as pure metal or as alloy. Every God metal may creates 16 Alloys with any other Mundane Metal.

 

Anyway I don't know if it possible to speak about Shadow of Self outside of the Spoiler tag now. To avoid problem I suggest you to put the last part into Spoiler Tag

Interesting thing I didn't consider! That allows for, well, 16² possibilities for allomancy, if it's true, so, well, wow.

Yeah, I wasn't sure about the policy for SoS spoilers, but best to air on the side of caution, suppose!

I think Leras did specifically mention that "he is Splintering me" or something along those lines at one point. I could be wrong, though.

Here is the exact quote:

"No. You weren’t. Kelsier, he’s splitting my power. He’s breaking it apart. It will be gone . . . Splintered. . . . He’ll destroy it." [Leras] 

I don't really know if this is a new theory persay, but it's not something I've seen talked about it, so I'd like to hear your thoughts on it.

A couple of things on the metallic arts, and a theory about metals. 

We have a complete table of allomantic effects, relating to the 16 allomantic metals, but Atium and Lerasium don't fit into this table. Furthermore, this table seems to be complete, considering what we know about Sixteen, and it's relationship to the Cosmere as a whole, as well as the words of Preservation.

Although Sazed could have changed the table, it is unlikely that he added more metals to it.

Atium and Lerasium never did fit on this table. They have a separate table that they fit on. A table of the 16 God metals. Just as Ati (as Ruin) created Atium, and Leras (as Preservation) created Lerasium, other Shards could invest their own metals if they wanted, and this would fill out the other table of 16. 

Please let me know if you have any critiques, or anything to add to this.

Then, everything changed when the Darksiders attacked...

 If this isn't a quick re-skin of Preservation and Ruin I don't know what is.

Hm, that's a really good point. It does fit the Preservation-Ruin dichotomy really well. I still think Trell is Badavin, but still, good point.

I don't recall any mention of mist wraiths in this book. Is there anyway Kelsier manipulated one of them through a spike to eat his bones. I believe WOB stated his bones are still around

As far as we know, Mistwraiths no longer exist as a species. 

Nalthis and Roshar. Due to the similarities and ease of interchangeability between Breaths and Stormlight, I think it would be super useful....imagine being to awaken using Stormlight...

Yes, I agree KyloRen. Excellent job of laying it out. I think Autonomy is by far the most likely candidate, although I also think that Autonomy is Trell. 

1. Tregalism (the religion of Trell) is a religion of night, (and Nalt is of day). Specifically, the religion focuses on the the night vs. day.

2. White Sand, where Badavin is located, is a planet that is tidally locked, so one side faces the sun and the other faces away. One is perpetually light, the other dark.

I do not think these two things are a coincidence.

With the combination of evidence that Trell is active on Scadiral, such as Miles being a follower, and with evidence that Badavin is also active on Scadiral, I think it is logical to assume that they are one in the same.

Interesting.

A Ruin Splinter, seems likely - equivalent to the Storm Father for Honour - could well be the solution. Particularly if it were called Rust.

No, The Stormfather is a Cognative Shadow of Honor, or the Almighty, not a splinter. The Stormfather is effectively a spren.

Point #2: The mountial pool is not necessarily a shardpool; it could just as easily be a perpendicularity that allows for world-hopping. Perpendicularities may or may not be shardpools. I think right now the possibilities could be represented as a Venn diagram...

Where do we see perpendicularities in writing? I'm curious what sources you're getting this from. (not that I'm doubting you, I just want to learn more)

We haven't yet found out what Harmony did with his extra Ruin, though there's lots of speculation. (Gave it to Kelsier, used it to make koloss a true-breeding race, etc.)

That's actually a really interesting idea I hadn't considered. Having Koloss be more invested with Ruin than Preservation.... it would be a nice parallel and counterpart to the Humans on Scadrial. 

Maybe! I wonder if not because the humans on Roshar wouldn't be invested by Odium (as far as we know), as they were probably created by Honor and Cultivation, as opposed to Scadrial, where the humans were created by Ruin and Preservation.

 Honor and cultivation's magic would mingle in some ways, though.

Intersting point...I wonder if perhaps, as we saw Feruchemy being in between Preservation and Ruin, that might be what the Nightwatcher's magic is...would that also mean there is one in between Honor and Odium, and Cultivation and Odium? Or perhaps Odium hasn't been on Roshar long enough for that to occur.

Only two perpendicularities on Scadrial; Preservation's Shardpool (The Well of Ascension, where Kelsier was trapped) and Ruin's (the Pits of Hathsin).  Kel destroyed the Pits, so therefore Hoid's only alternative is the Well of Ascension.

On the contrary, it does not say it was the only perpendicularity, it says it is the only one with "reasonable ease of access." If there were one on the southern pole, using it would be useless if you wanted to be in the northern hemisphere.

It seemed to me that the Ire in the fortress used a fabrial of the same type as the merchant used in Shinovar, in order to determine if anyone was nearby. I find this interesting!

As far as we know, this is supposed to take place before the events of Stormlight Archive, which means that this type of fabrial was not as recent invention, when we see it in WoK. This is not something I expected, I thought it seemed like kind of a new thing on Roshar. That, or it was invented perviously on Roshar and lost to Rosharans, and later reinvented. 

What do you think of this logic? 

I haven't read any books taking place on Sel yet, so I can't comment on Soul Stamping.

I think it's more likely that Kelsier found a Perpendicularity, and somehow used that to cross over, possibly using a Spike to ground him in the Physical Realm.

I'm not sure how he would be able to do this, persay, since he was unable to at the Well, but that makes the most sense to me, especially considering he seems to have his original body back. It depends on where the other perpendicularitys are on the planet.

“Destroying the Pits, O scarred one. That was the only perpendicularity on this planet with any reasonable ease of access."

- Drifter (but lets be honest, probably Hoid), Chapter 1, Secret History

If we assume there is a perpendicularity at the south pole, opposite the Well, then that might be it, perhaps. 

I also thought about Kell taking up Survival, but personally I think that would be very difficult to do. He would have to kill that shard holder to begin with, which would be difficult both because it's a shard based on survival and because of this.

Some backup that Wyndle is a Cultivationspren: (we also have WoB that Wyndle sees himself as such in the same way Syl sees herself as an Honourspren)

I agree with this assessment, Ari. I think there is also a mention of this on WoR, from Jasnah, when she is on the ship at the beginning, talking to Shallan. I'll try to find the quote when I get home.

Personally, I think that Surgebinding (that is, Investiture coming from Honor) is end-positive, Boons and Curses (Cultivation) are end-neutral, and Voidbinding (Odium) are end-negative. I think it makes sense based on what we know of the shards on Scadrial, and based on what we know of the former two magic systems.

That said, Boons and Curses in relation to Feruchemy doesn't really fit in, since Feruchemy isn't of any shard in particular, so maybe not. 

At the very least, that's how I think of the magic systems of Roshar.

How is it that since spren exist in the cognitive realm, that in the form of shardblades they seem to cut only the physical and spiritual realms? This seems contrary to me.

Hello everyone.

Two questions today.

First, can one feruchemically store something in a hemalurgic spike?

Second, how does one create a hemalurgic spike? Is it s specific process, or could (theoretically) any piece metal become one? If so, would swords (that had killed someone) not carry a charge? Perhaps it has to do with the specific composition of the metal, as it does for an allomancer burning it.

Thanks!