rdog2213
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Posts posted by rdog2213
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Also means that Kaladin's name is something like "Born unto Eternity". Pretty cool!
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Did anyone else think it odd that Venli's spren (Timbre) was initially found near Eshonai's body? I think that either Eshonai was close to swearing her oaths as a KR before the whole stormform debacle or, moving into wild speculation territory, that spren was some remnant of Eshonai like her Cognitive Shadow or soul. Either one makes sense to me since Eshonai fits the underlying values of the Willshapers (general love of adventure, novelty, or oddity) perfectly whereas Venli doesn't fit them quite as much. I guess the whole searching for voidspren thing could fall under that but it seems more Eshonai's thing than Venli.
While reading, I was pretty certain it was the latter and we'd get a big reveal that Timbre = Eshonai but it does make more sense for Timbre to be the missing lightspren mentioned by the captain so perhaps the former is more likely. Kind of a similar situation to what Wit did in the epilogue with Elhokar's presumed spren.
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I think he'll revive her and will bond her. The whole Sadeas murder thing and Adolin's guilt regarding it (or more specifically his guilt regarding how his father saw him) might have started breaking his soul a bit and, with enough breaking, I think he will qualify for a Nahel bond. He had a bit of a rough childhood with his mother's death and Dalinar's guilty drinking but I feel like he was always upbeat in the flashbacks and came out really well despite it all. Before that murder, I don't think he was really broken at all but I think that at least cracked him a bit. Combined with his guilt over Elhokar and Kholinar, I think he might be on his way to being a good candidate for a bond though he needs to figure out how to awaken Maya first.
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Agreed that Cultivation is definitely not one of the letters since she is has no problems interacting with other shards (ruling out letter 1) and is in direct opposition with Odium at the moment (ruling out letter 2).
The author of Letter 2 seems like it could be Autonomy ("we need not suffer the interference of another") or at least an agent of Autonomy but the references to the sea seem odd for a Shard whose main world (that we know of) is like half desert. We do have good evidence that Autonomy is meddling outside Taldain so maybe this is laying the groundwork for an upcoming short story set on Obrodai? Also, Letters 1 and 3 have language that directly indicate the authors are Shards but Letter 2 doesn't read that way to me. Based on the rest of the letter, I think its probably an agent of Autonomy though it would make more sense to have all three coming from Shards as Chaos and Rider of the Storms mentioned.
Another wilder guess is that the author of this letter might belong to one of the worldhopper organizations like Khriss's group, the Ghostbloods, or the 17th Shard. Some group with past relationships with Hoid and a somewhat warmer view on Odium and his actions. Maybe the Ghostbloods since the other two groups seem to disapprove of Odium's actions while we really don't know what the Ghostbloods really are or what they want. Perhaps they intercepted a letter that Hoid sent to some other Shard that is either destroyed or in some weird state ("you have spoken to one who cannot respond").
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So, the Part 2 Epigraphs seem to be 3 different letters all addressed to Hoid/Cephandrius from Shards or at least envoys of Shards. I was curious to see if there was any new information on Shards or vessels so I typed them up in full here:
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Dearest Cephandrius, I received your communication, of course. I noticed its arrival immediately, just as I noticed your many intrusions into my land You think yourself so clever, but my eyes are not those of some petty noble, to be clouded by a false nose and some dirt on the cheeks. You mustn't worry yourself about Rayse. It is a pity about Aona and Skai, but they were foolish violating our pact from the very beginning. Your skills are admirable, but you are merely a man. You had your chance to be more, and refused it. No good can come of two Shards settling in one location. It was agreed that we would not interfere with one another, and it disappoints me that so few of the Shards have kept to this original agreement. As for Uli Da, it was obvious from the outset that she was going to be a problem. Good riddance. Regardless, this is not your concern. You turned your back on divinity. If Rayse becomes an issue, he will be dealt with. And so will you.
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Cephandrius, bearer of the First Gem, You must know better than to approach us by relying upon presumption of past relationship. You have spoken to one who cannot respond. We, instead, will take your communication to us - though we know not how you located us upon this world. We are indeed intrigued, for we thought it well hidden. Insignificant among our many realms. As the waves of the sea must continue to surge, so must our will continue resolute. Alone. Did you expect anything else from us? We need not suffer the interference of another. Rayse is contained, and we care not for his prison. Indeed, we admire his initiative. Perhaps if you had approached the correct one of us with your plea, it would have found favorable audience. But we stand in the sea, pleased with our domains. Leave us alone. We also instruct that you should not return to Obrodai. We have claimed that world, and a new avatar of our being is beginning to manifest there. She is young yet, and - as a precaution - she has been instilled with an intense and overpowering dislike of you. This is all we will say at this time. If you wish more, seek these waters in person and overcome the tests we have created. Only in this will you earn our respect.
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Friend, Your letter is most intriguing, even revelatory. I would have thought, before attaining my current station, that a deity could not be surprised. Obviously, this is not true. I can be surprised. I can perhaps even be naïve. I think. I am the least equipped, of all, to aid you in this endeavor. I am finding that the powers I hold are in such conflict that the most simple of actions can be difficult. I am also made uncertain by your subterfuge. Why have you not made yourself known to me before this? How is it you can hide? Who are you truly, and how do you know so much about Adonalsium? If you would speak to me further, I request open honesty. Return to my lands, approach my servants, and I will see what I can do for your quest.
Interpretation:
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Letter 3 is definitely from Sazed but letters 1 and 2 are a bit harder to pin down. Based on the tones, I would say letter 1 is from someone who may have been Hoid's friend while letter 2 seems to be more antagonistic. Letter 2's writer also seems to admire Odium, which is curious.
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Looks like we have another Vessel name! Since Uli Da is dead, I guess that must have been the name of Ambition's Vessel?
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The "bearer of the First Gem" is an interesting title. I'm guessing it probably doesn't relate to Roshar despite the gem reference but who knows?
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None of the letters seem to come from Cultivation in my opinion. The first disapproves of dishardic worlds (Cultivation's relationship with Honor would preclude this) while the second is approving of Odium's initiative, which Cultivation probably wouldn't be since Odium kinda killed her lover.
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The phrasing in Letter 2 is kinda odd with the many references to the sea and whatever the heck Obrodai is. There's not much information on Autonomy but the apparent antagonism of Letter 2 might fit with Bavadin since she has bad blood with Hoid and seems to have some sort of relationship with Odium based on Hoid's grudge against the two of them. The allusions to the sea are weird however for someone whose main planet is half freaking desert though. It seems like its written by an agent and we know Autonomy is meddling outside Taldain so maybe this indicates some sort of plot on Obrodai (whatever/wherever that is)?
Any thoughts beyond those?
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I managed to get my copy of Oathbringer a bit early and have been thinking and trying to make sense of Dalinar's awesome transformation at the end. In crafting a theory to explain this, I made a list of some important details and thought I would share those with y'all in the hope of a good discussion:
Important Details:
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UNITE THEM! - Chapter 119 - I'll start off with the obvious detail, when Dalinar freaking grabs the fabric of reality with his hands and merges the Physical, Cognitive, and Spiritual realms together into a perpendicularity. We've had tidbits of perpendicularities in Arcanum Unbound and different things but to my knowledge, we've never seen anyone short of a Shard or splinter do something this powerful in the Cosmere as of yet. According to the Arcanum Unbounded, this generally requires "concentration of so much Investiture" that "creates points of ... friction, where a kind of tunneling exists". As far as I know, only Shards themselves have caused this in the past and it seems well outside the powers of a bondsmith so the question is how is Dalinar doing this? Syl says its Honor's perpendicularity so we at least know that it is Honor's power that Dalinar is wielding somehow. Whatever this power is, Dalinar seems to be able to do it on command now since he overcharged Kaladin with Stormlight in Chapter 122 before Kaladin takes off to find his missing bridgemen.
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I am Unity - Chapter 119 - When asked what he is by Venli, Dalinar responds with the awesome phrase "I am Unity", which could have many interpretations. Is this referring to his overall goal of unifying? Is it simply a cool way of leading into his unifying the Realms? Or is the capitalization of Unity important and does that signify that Dalinar has become something far more?
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WE KILLED YOU! - Chapter 119 - Perhaps my favorite detail is Odium's reaction to Dalinar's epiphany. Not only is Odium shocked by Dalinar's resistance, he seems to be downright scared here. And most interesting is the choice of pronouns here. In their previous discussion regarding Dalinar's sins, Odium always said "I" as in "I was there, influencing you", so this doesn't seem to be a royal "we". With the available information, I can see two possible explanations. One, Honor's death was a cooperative effort between Odium and some other party such as Autonomy though this seems unlikely since all of our evidence so far indicates that Odium killed Tanavast by himself. Second, and more intriguing, is the shattering of Adonalsium, which seems to better explain the anger, outrage, and fear in Odium's statements. What about Dalinar's Unity frightens Odium so much? What does Dalinar look like to Odium's eyes?
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How? What have you done? - Chapter 119 - Despite being the Cognitive shadow of a god, the Stormfather has no clue what or how Dalinar just accomplished. Is this just the typical Spren forgetfulness since he hasn't been bonded in millennia? Their later conversation seems to indicate that this really hasn't been done before...
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We are something different - Chapter 119 - Dalinar's own words to describe this event are "We are something different. His remnants, your soul, my will". This is interesting to me since it could be interpreted in a realmatic context as the combination of Physical (his remnants), Cognitive (my will), and Spiritual (your soul) components though the remnants seems like it should really be of all three and not just Physical.
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Dalinar was not supposed to Ascend - Chapter 122 - Another Odium line that stands out since the topic of Ascension has a known definition within the Cosmere: a vessel taking up a Shard of Adonalsium like in the Mistborn series. The context of this phrase is a bit murky though since Odium and Mr. T are talking about events in the past, present, and future so it's a bit unclear whether this is directly referring to Dalinar's display or if it is some future event that both Odium and Mr. T have foreseen. Still, this clearly indicates to me that something major is going on with Dalinar and it seems like Odium thinks that this is not a one-hit wonder use of power on his part. Interesting side note is how the heck do y'all think the "Renarin Kholin" reference fits into this conversation? Was he the one who should have Ascended or was he the catalyst that caused Dalinar's Ascension (perhaps in that one flashback where Renarin breaks Dalinar out of his drinking and makes him realize a bit how awful he is being)?
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A warmth that he had known once before - Chapter 119 - Right before Dalinar Unites, he feels this weird warmth. As far as I can tell, this seems to refer to Dalinar's curious dream/vision in Ch 89 of WoR, where he seemingly relives a childhood moment before stepping outside where "warm light bathed him. A deep, enveloping, piercing warmth. A warmth that soaked down deep through his skin, into his very self. He stared at that light, and was not blinded. The source was distant, but he knew it. Knew it well. He smiled". Still don't have a good explanation for what's going on here but we do have confirmation a few pages later that the Stormfather did not send this. Since all of Dalinar's previous interactions with Honor have been mediated by the Stormfather, what could this warmth be?
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Unite them - Throughout all books, Dalinar's thoughts are almost always drawn to a single phrase "Unite them" that has driven a lot of his actions so far. Presumably, the first instance of this was the vision that Honor/Stormfather gave him but it continues to be repeated time and time again in Dalinar's viewpoints. It's a phrase that has been interpreted to mean many things over the books like "unite the highprinces", "unite the world", and "unite the radiants" but here we see it once again in probably the most spectacular fashion as he physically unites the realms. Are these words just Dalinar's continual introspection on these words or is this an external voice speaking to him? The Stormfather said it wasn't him in Chapter 111 and Dalinar definitely perceived it to be an external voice. Was it always an external voice or just this time? Who or what could this be?
Theories: Looking at the available evidence, I have come up with three possible explanations for the power that Dalinar is wielding now:
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Dalinar has, or is in the process of, reforming Honor and is its new vessel - I believe we have some WoB that this is possible but very difficult. The "something different" and "we killed you" details seem like they dispute this but either one could be interpreted to support it. Syl claiming that the perpendicularity is Honor's does seem to support this however. Another possibility is that he has somehow accumulated enough of Honor's Investiture to become something like a mini-sliver like a Herald or above.
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Dalinar has somehow accumulated enough Investiture to become something new, Unity - Perhaps not a full Shard but something akin to or above a Herald in power and not necessarily linked with Honor alone. At this point, he's had direct interactions with three Shards/remnants of Shards, which seems unique, and could somehow have taken some measure of power from each. To be specific, Odium has been shaping him into a Champion for what seems like his entire life and likely had to sink some Investiture in him to do so. Cultivation took a piece of him and perhaps gave something in its place when he visited. And we all know that he has a big piece of Honor in his pocket in the form of the Stormfather. Syl's claim that the perpendicularity was Honor's could just be her best guess or it could be that the bulk of Dalinar's new power is of Honor and that's what she's sensing. Has the combination of all of this Investiture made him into something unique? I think this is the most likely theory though the "we killed you" detail doesn't seem to quite fit.
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Dalinar is, in some way, connected to Adonalsium on a deeper level than we thought - This is a bit more out-there than the other two theories and is predicated mostly on the "we killed you" detail. I think there's a WoB out there somewhere that Dalinar was one of the first characters of the SA that Brandon came up with (number 17 here) and this makes me curious. I'm probably reading too much into this random detail but could Dalinar be something like the reincarnation of Adonalsium? We've had absolutely no evidence of this before now but it kinda fits the fear in Odium's reaction to Dalinar's Ascension. Of course, I would expect a god to pick up on that fact if he's been watching and influencing a dude for most of his life but maybe there's more going on than we know? There was also that curious exchange between Wit and Dalinar in WoK regarding Adonalsium (Chapter 54) that could support this theory but there's a WoB (number 1 here) saying that was probably not that significant. Building off the previous theory, perhaps Odium interprets Dalinar's combination of the three Shard's Investiture as a preliminary attempt to reforge Adonalsium.
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[OB] On the Varieties of True Spren
in Stormlight Archive
Posted
Hmm... I totally missed a spren hanging around Eshonai in WoR and that would definitely eliminate the Timbre=Eshonai theory. Guess I need to reread those interludes...