LogicSpren

@Lightning

Yes please! Always supporting Bridge 4!

This is kind of what I'm trying to say; that this secret Chapter 84 Epigraph is related to the idea that abandoning Radiant Oaths kills the spren, so the secret (in my reasoning) must be related to the Spren. Now, it could be that the spren are coming to help, or coming because that's what they do (their nature) or to save themselves, or any number of reasons. But if in the process of doing so they force bonds where they wouldn't have normally developed, it seems like that idea/knowledge could result in the abandonment of oaths and killing of spren.

I guess the main point that i'm trying to make is thus; what if the Recreance ocurred because the Orders suddenly learned that their best buddy spren had bonded with them NOT because they exemplified a virtue/attribute, but because they were driven to by some other force/drive/whatever. That the spren were widening the cracks in an already somewhat broken soul so that they could 'help' mankind as a whole or just that individual. I'm not really sure why they would do so, but I feel like the realization that the spren were not all that they said they were would potentially be cause for the Knights to abandon/kill the spren. Because abandoning your oaths as a full Knight would most definitely and obviously kill the spren they were bonded to, it seems like the Recreance as an event was not just a protest/corruption, but a way of hurting the spren for some reason.

Yeah, but how much of that is their nature? Seons are devoted b/c of Devotion, makes sense if the spren are 'honorable' in their minds and thus want to 'protect' men and thus are returning.

When you do this in art class.

Hey all, first-time poster, but I had a theory about Spren and the 'Secret that broke the Knights Radiant' So, on the back cover of WoR it says "It is the nature of the magic. A broken soul has cracks into which something else can be fit. Surgebindings, the powers of creation themselves; they can brace a broken soul, but they can also widen its fissures" And somewhere in WoK or WoR, it says that the number of people who bond with spren increases right before a Desolation. Think about this for a second; The people we see in Dalinar's Vision of the Recreance (Windrunners etc. abandoning their oaths and shardblades/plate) were full knights. Kaladin, after swearing 3 ideals, gets to use Syl as a Shardspear/weapon. We learned that all shardblades are spren, living or dead (excluding blades like Szeth's) The question is, why would these Knights, who had bonded with their spren, probably having a good relationship with them like Shallan/Kaladin have with Pattern/Syl, abandon their oaths, KILL their spren buddies, and walk away? What IS the secret that broke them? Here's where theorizing comes in. We know that a person has to be 'broken' to allow a Nahel Bond (see back cover quote), and that more people bond to spren before a Desolation. Chances are, people aren't suddenly becoming more attractive to spren. I think the spren, acting on their nature left from Honor's splintering, believe it to be honorable to save mankind by giving them surges. To do so, they are forcing bonds onto people. Example 1, Shallan. She was terrified by the symbol-headed Cryptics that followed her around until she said her first truth and went into shadesmar (soulcasting the goblet). I realize she had already bonded partially, but I think that her broken household may also have been inluenced by spren or some other force (Her father's hate is unnatural, don't remember the WoB, but I know he said it wasn't just him) Example 2: Jasnah. In the beginning of WoR, she's freaking out about the whole 'backwards-shadow' thing. Then, abunch of spren attack her, forcing her into shadesmar, where she fights back, and eventually bonds with Ivory. This, to me, is the most overt example we have of spren forcing a bond. Example 3: Lift. She grew up in Rall Elorim, City of Shadows. I think we have further WoB somewhere saying that there is some nasty spren-like stuff going on there. Furthermore, Wyndle says this "I wanted to pick a distinguished Iriali matron. A grandmother, an accomplished gardener. But no, the RIng said we should choose you. 'She has visited the Old Magic,' they said. 'Our mother has blessed her,' they said. 'She will be young, and we can mold her,' they said." emphasis added Example 4: Kaladin. I think this might actually be the odd one out. Syl left, she said, without permission from the honorspren leadership in shadesmar. She truly was simply attracted to his honorable life. Finally, we know from Jasnah's return at the end of WoR that the spren in shadesmar actually have civilization. "It's been a long time since the spren had to deal with someone alive" pg 1078 and also the earlier quote from Wyndle. It's been mentioned a couple of times in the books that spren want a bond with humans because it gives them intelligence. But, they have civilization in shadesmar. they already are intelligent. So why do they really want the bond? Feel free to rip it to shreds

When you do this in shop class