FeatherWriter

Shakadolrin would be the ship name for when you're shipping Shallan/Kaladin/Adolin/Renarin together as a group (though most people tend to say that in such a match-up, Adolin and Renarin wouldn't be involved with each other, to avoid incest implications.) But yeah, it's an "everyone is dating everyone" sort of situation.

Tends to be known as "the OT4" for short, which is a term that evolved from the common fandom term for a ship, "OTP" or "one true pairing." People expanded OTP to OT3, for "one true threesome" and it helped that it rhymed. And from there it just kind of became OT(number) for however many characters you've got in a big ship pile.

Admittedly, it's definitely more of a tumblr thing. I tried to mix some 17S stuff in with the tumblr stuff for these cards, but there's certainly things from both spheres of influence. People also tend to use the term "the OT4" to just refer to the main 4 SA characters in that age group, even outside of an explicitly romantic context, too.

I... I think I'm in love. What a gorgeous ketek! I'm just sitting here in awe that something so lovely and beautiful exists in this world. 

*sighs dreamily*

Quick Mod Note: Y'all are doing a good job of self moderating (making my job easy), but yes, double posting and running threads off topic are frowned upon. Thanks, everyone, for helping to keep the thread tidy. I don't think we derailed too much in here!

Now then, as theory poster, I don't know if I ever discussed resonances re: Renarin. I'm... pretty unconvinced that the future thing is a resonance. Again, it just doesn't seem to be on par with other resonances. They don't match up. Resonances seem like little perks or quirks of each order, which kind of make them unique or help them out. I mean, Windrunners get more squires, Lightweavers get good memories, and Truthwatchers get all-consuming and utterly uncontrollable visions of the future, which entirely take over their body?

It just doesn't line up, for me. We're talking about very different classes of things here.

On 4/19/2017 at 5:59 AM, strumienpola said:

Sorry for necroing, but I'm a bit baffled that so many people seem to think Renarin's ability is inconsistent with Truthwatchers. 

I'll pop in to respond on this count, since I think my theory is probably the one that's swayed so many people in this direction.

What struck me about Renarin's abilities and the reason why I don't think they're normal surgebinding is the involuntary nature of them. Though we see Shallan and Kaladin surgebinding accidentally without realizing it, we never see other surgebinders being forced to use their abilities actively against their will. We don't see instances where their bodies are taken over and controlled by their powers, leaving them helpless.

I mean, Renarin falls to the floor, crying and screaming "Almighty why have you cursed me so?" That doesn't feel right.

Quite clearly at the end (and with plenty of hints leading up to it), Renarin is not fully in control of himself when the visions take over. He's forced to write or carve while he's in the throes of it, something he'd never do of his own volition. I mean, on one hand, it's deeply unmasculine, even if they're just glyphs, which is something Renarin's already very insecure about, but also, if he's going to so much trouble to try to hide the fact that he's having visions, why leave very obvious evidence behind that someone's seeing things, like number countdowns and written prophecies? My answer: he didn't have a choice.

And though Brandon has confirmed that there is an involuntary element to Renarin's visions, he has not confirmed whether or not they're surgebinding. I got a hard (and evil laughing) RAFO on that question.

Well I just saw that my links didn't work very well up top, so I've added those. If you'd like to play with these decks, you can do so online at Pretend You're Xyzzy, which supports the use of Cardcast decks. I believe Cardcast also allows you to order printed versions of Cardcast decks, if you want actual cards to play with, or to use with the regular Cards Against Humanity game. That should just be on the deck's page, at those links.

29 minutes ago, Demiandre said:

Weren't they written in glyphs, which are meant for men ? I remember an Adolin PoV were he tried to read it, but Renarin translated it first.

I just thought of something I'll have to check . If I remember correctly, the Thrill "vanished" for some protagonist at various points. Could that be related to fits Renarin has had ?

I probably really say "meant for men." While men are allowed to read and write glyphs, it's more of a only-when-absolutely-needed kind of thing, I believe. Using women's script is absolutely out unless you're an ardent, but even using glyphs is seen as feminine. Aside from Stormwardens and men who absolutely need to write, like Kaladin for his surgery training, I don't think it's a very common skill. I believe the reason that most glyphs are stylized to look like what they mean is so that men who can't actually read the glyphs themselves still know what they represent.

Quote

      Aunt Navani had just finished a glyphward. She stepped away from the pedestal, setting aside her brushpen, and held up the ward for him to see. It was painted in bright red on a white cloth.
      “Victory?” Adolin guessed.
      Navani lowered it, raising an eyebrow at him.
      “What?” Adolin said as his armorers entered, carrying the pieces of his Shardplate.
      “It says ‘safety and glory,’” Navani said. “It wouldn’t kill you to learn some glyphs, Adolin.”
      He shrugged. “Never seemed that important.”

We know Adolin, the son of a highprince, can't really read glyphs at all. Renarin is better at reading them, I believe, but I would doubt that he's had much experience at all writing. Kaladin's probably the best at reading them among our male cast, because he needed to read anatomy books while studying, which probably had non-stylized glyphs. Even Kaladin, though, makes mention of the fact that Sigzil writing glyphs would probably make most people uncomfortable.

Quote

    [Sigzil] continued to write numbers on his ledger. That would have made most of the other bridgemen uncomfortable. A man writing was seen as unmasculine, even blasphemous—though Sigzil was only writing glyphs.
    Today, fortunately, Kaladin had with him Sigzil, Rock, and Lopen—all foreigners from places with different rules. Herdaz was Vorin, technically, but they had their own brand of it and Lopen didn’t seem to mind a man writing.

I don't think Renarin would have chosen to do something unmasculine and borderline blasphemous by choice, as insecure as he is. I think he can read glyphs fairly well, since he tends to be fairly analytical and good at scholarly thoughts (much to his dismay.) As someone trying to learn Chinese, I can say that it's far far easier for me to recognize a character than to actually write them myself. Rushu, the ardent who inspects the first set of numbers calls them "sloppy" and guesses that whoever did it was "not practiced at drawing glyphs." 

I'm guessing Renarin was fairly decent at reading glyphs but had not written before much at all, until the visions forced him to.

Oh, a favored topic for me! And not just because it concerns my favorite character. I've said my piece in pretty lengthy terms over here about what I think is going on with Renarin and his visions, but I tend to be of the camp that he is probably actually a surgebinder, but those visions are not normal Truthwatching. I fall in line with @Demiandre in that I feel that something is taking control of him and the fact that our Vorin characters constantly freak out about the future gives me cause to be concerned.

On 12/14/2016 at 8:55 PM, IntentAwesome said:

I had always thought Renarin's behavior during the climax of WoR was mostly because what he saw was so terrible/traumatic to witness. I had taken it more as a clue to just how bad things are going to get. And I think we have a recent WoB saying that was haven't really seen odium spren yet. Though, to be fair, we haven't actually seen Renarin's spren. 

While I do think there is an element of that in his reaction, what sticks out to me is that Renarin, a Vorin man who is extremely concerned about his masculinity and feeling like an outsider, is writing during his visions. I have trouble believing that's something he would do willingly at all, and according to Brandon, there is some kind of compulsion or involuntary nature that overtakes Renarin when he's seeing these things. I feel like his breakdown during the climax is him seeing the worst vision he's seen yet, but also us as the audience watching him lose control of himself and his body and the terror and despair that he feels as it starts happening to him. 

8 hours ago, Jedal said:

I mostly meant the lore. But Bungie also has the room to make some pretty great Guardian storylines in a book series. I mean, channeling Light and uncovering mysteries and I mean WHATEVER HAPPENED TO THE PEOPLE WHO FIRST WENT INTO THE VAULT?!? WHAT REALLY HAPPENED TO ERIS IN CROTA'S WORLD? IS THE QUEEN DEAD? These are some great story ideas, and if they don't do it in the games, they better be some damnation good books. I'd write them myself.

If Mara Sov's dead, I'll eat my Ghost, though I suppose what with me being utter garbage I'm mostly just pleased that Uldren survived.

8 hours ago, Jedal said:

Definitely. One of the things that kept me drawn in WAS the story. There is a lot of potential for a good book. Just not Brandon, because I don't think it works well with him.

Funny, up until the Taken King, I'd say that Destiny's storyline was easily the weakest point of the series. (And even after TTK, because I'll be real, Rise of Iron's story was pretty bare bones.) Now, I know that there was some stuff in vanilla Destiny with apparently the entire original story got scrapped way too close to the finish and the original scriptwriters were fired or something like that. So vanilla Destiny ended up as this kind of storyline that technically I guess made sense, but was also so meaninglessly vapid that it was pretty dang boring.

Did anyone get to the mission with the Black Garden and really feel like this was the climactic culmination of everything we'd been working toward? Hmm, probably not. Destiny original's plot can get summed up as "there are bad things, go kill them" with the set pieces changing behind, and different voice actors saying "yes go kill the things."

I mean, we have such stunning voice lines as "I don't even have time to explain why I don't have time to explain" and when my Ghost wakes my Guardian up and says "You must have questions," it would... be nice to maybe answer those at some point? But we don't. The mission style is pretty much all the same too: "fight your way through small things and then there's a big thing at the end." And while the cutscenes seem very cinematic and dramatic, when you get to the end of them, it's pretty much just... yeah go kill the next thing.

Thankfully for vanilla Destiny, the gameplay's fun, the settings and graphics are gorgeous, and if you take the time to dig into the Lore, it's stunning. But the story itself? Pretty sad, honestly.

The Dark Below has Eris, who is the most extra, but you know what, I love her anyway. Kind of a slightly better story in terms of Crota's soul and all that, but also super short. :C

House of Wolves is... kind of interesting, but unfortunately all of the really interesting things seemed to happen before we got there. A dangerous Fallen Kell escaped prison and led the Queen's Fallen guards in a bloody betrayal before fleeing? That sounds really cool. Except by the time the first mission starts, it's already over and the Guardians are just on clean-up duty. Which, is fine, but again we're getting missions that are all "go fight through little guys to the big guy at the end" sort of thing. Skolas, Petra, and Variks are pretty cool though, and at least we get some dialogue over our comms during missions now. That's nice.

Taken King is honestly the storytelling highlight for me. The Dreadnaught feels alive and the cutscenes and plot are really actually engaging. Cayde-6 shines far and away above everyone else, both within missions and outside of them, but everyone else is pretty good too, with Eris, Holiday, and Zavala doing some pretty fun moments. Oryx is a compelling and terrifying antagonist, which is very much something that helps the story. When playing the TTK story missions, I feel like my Guardian is actually doing something, and the creative mission design on these, with some stealth missions, climbing puzzles, the mission-end fakeout at Crota's soul, all just make it feel really fun and engaging in a way that the game didn't before.

And unfortunately, Rise of Iron feels like a step back in terms of story. SIVA feels too inanimate to make a good antagonist, especially when compared with Oryx. It's just a virus thing, and yes, that's bad, but also not super interesting. Shiro-4 and Saladin are okay, but neither carry the same kind of engagement and characterization that TTK brought to the table. I'm a bit disappointed, since it feels like a step backward, but eh, whatever.

Anyway, I probably didn't need to type all of that out, but while the lore of Destiny is fantastic, I'd say storytelling (TTK aside) is still a pretty rough patch for the franchise. I think I once compared it to setting a game on Roshar and just... not actually having anything to do except kill random things. It's baffling how the game designers could come up with such an interesting world and just... not do very much with it and sequester all of the really cool stuff in cards that aren't even accessible in the game! Bungie, pls. Hopefully, Destiny 2 can learn from some of these mistakes...

Kabsal uses it twice while talking with Shallan:

Quote

“Everything has its opposite, Shallan. The Almighty is a force of good. To balance his goodness, the cosmere needed the Voidbringers as his opposite.”

“So the more good that the Almighty did, the more evil he created as a by-product? What’s the point of doing any good at all if it just creates more evil?”

“I see Jasnah has continued your training in philosophy.”

“That’s not philosophy,” Shallan said. “That’s simple logic.”

[Kabsal] sighed. “I don’t think you want to get into the deep theology of this. Suffice it to say that the Almighty’s pure goodness created the Voidbringers, but men may choose good without creating evil because as mortals they have a dual nature. Thus the only way for good to increase in the cosmere is for men to create it—in that way, good may come to outweigh evil.

--WoK Ch. 45 "Shadesmar"

Ym talks about the Cosmere when explaining his philosophy of the One as well in Words of Radiance.

Quote

To live was to be a fragment of the cosmere that was experiencing itself.

(...)

So far, Ym had used this ability only a handful of times, and had always disguised it as medicine. It was unlike anything he had ever heard of. Perhaps that was why he had been given it—so the cosmere could experience it.

--WoR I-2 "Ym"

Hoid also uses it while talking to Dalinar, but I figure that one doesn't really count, since Hoid isn't really Rosharan. Dalinar didn't seem terribly confused by the term, though.

40 minutes ago, Spoolofwhool said:

Roshar is also the name of the continent they live on.

This is true, but seeing as it's the only (known) continent, I don't tend to see too much trouble in using it interchangably. I mean, it's up in the air when a character talks about the Almighty "creating Roshar" whether or not they're referring to the world or the landmass, but in most situations their meaning doesn't really change if they're including the oceans (Roshar the planet) or just talking about land (Roshar the continent).

Yes, the books are meant to be understood as "translated" from their original languages into English (or whatever language you end up reading). So long as it's not capitalized, you can assume that the use of the word "earth" is generic, to just mean "world" or "planet" or occasionally, as a synonym for "dirt" or "ground."

Running a book search, I can see that the word "earth" shows up frequently throughout just about every Cosmere book, from Stormlight, to Mistborn, to Warbreaker to the others. It's definitely not a forbidden term in the cosmere, at all! Note that the word "universe" is also not forbidden, and does show up from time to time, though you do also see some characters using the word "cosmere" to mean the same thing.

Interestingly enough, the word "Scadrial" only shows up once in the Mistborn books, in Bands of Mourning, when Khriss is dancing with Wax. Notably, she, the non-native, non-Scadrian worldhopper, is the one who uses the term. It's very possible that people on Scadrial do not refer to their world that way at all. Scadrians do, however, use the word "cosmere" to refer to the universe, though only in the second trilogy.

Rosharans, on the other hand, frequently refer to their world as "Roshar" in both speech and narration. Rosharans also use the word "cosmere" in casual speech.

The word "Nalthis" has never shown up in a Cosmere book, nor has a Nalthian ever used the word "cosmere."

1 hour ago, yurisses said:

Brandon told FeatherWriter that in WoK Prime Renarin wrote the Diagram. This adds to the list of arguments for there being something atypical about his Truthwatching. Brandon has confirmed that the writings Dalinar thinks he is writing were done by Renarin. I wouldn't be surprised if the Nightwatcher/Cultivation was involved... It's kind of similar to how Taravangian wrote the Diagram on walls in a frenzy.

I mean, I tend to keep the idea of what happened in WoK Prime as "cool trivia" rather than letting it inform many of my theories, personally. Lots has changed since WoK Prime. I mean, from the first five chapters of it that were released a while ago, we also saw Renarin placed in charge of the Alethi armies, almost get challenged to a duel to the death with Elhokar, get disinherited and humiliated while his father thought this was fair, and then lost his shards, since he was a full shardbearer. It's a very different story.

We don't know if the Diagram served the same purpose in Prime, we don't know if it was a Nightwatcher thing like Taravangian's diagram was or if it had something to do with these visions that Renarin's now seeing. I have a feeling that the fact the Diagram has been wholesale ported to a different character means that its lingering influence on Renarin and Renarin's story arc is minimal now, though Renarin now has different things in the Diagram's place.

@Secrets Ayyy, Warlock master race!

Mmm, I finally buckled down and did the hours of resource gathering to get my Dark Drinker (I had a Raze Lighter before!) and I finally got to use it against those captains at the end of Wrath of the Machine and it felt so wonderful. I will say I tend to keep my girl on Voidwalker for the most part. With Nothing Manacles in PvE, I can throw grenades about as fast as a Sunsinger in Radiance but all the time, as long as I'm getting kills and triggering energy drain off of them. With max discipline, a grenade kill will replenish my grenade in a second or two, and with two grenade charges, I don't even have to wait.

I mean, the Manacles are pretty nice in PvP too, but I also just picked up an Ophidian Aspect and that's just too good in PvP to pass up. 

Even though I end up using my exotic slot for other things, I have to admit, there's nothing more fun to use than those exotic swords. I feel like such a Shardbearer rushing in to the heart of danger with it!

It's fab. I'm trying to think what the best way to rewrite "How Far I'll Go" into a Cosmere song would be, because I'm dying to cover it.

9 minutes ago, Ookla the Indefinite said:

Just to be clear, because I saw this discussed earlier, but I do not think Renarin, or any other Truthwatcher, is actually Nahel bonded to one of the Unmade. I think that the rogue Unmade might be taking advantage of some aspect of his bond with Glys in order to send these visions.

Yeah, I agree. Signs point to Renarin having a legit Nahel bond. I just also think he's got other things on top of that messing with him.

3 minutes ago, emailanimal said:

That's what I thought.  As I point out above, the historic quote makes me suspect that Renarin is, by far, not the first person in the order of Truthwatchers who is receiving these visions...  

Perhaps someone can ask Brandon how many Oaths Renarin swore (probably a literal RAFO), how many Oaths Ym swore (may get an answer), whether Renarin is further in his development than Ym (very likely, Renarin is in the company of three people who are past two Oaths/Truths), and whether Ym has had anything that could constitute a "vision" (this might get a "yes" or a "no").

A good parallel might actually come from Wheel Of Time. The Forsaken spent more time trying to kick each other in the shins (or directly offing each other) than directly conveying the will of their master.

If I had to make a guess, I'd not be surprised if Renarin is not any further than his first oath. Looking at the way he talked about his Surgebinding in that last chapter, this is something he's been actively trying to deny and suppress about himself. He thought his Shardblade screaming and Glys and, likely, the visions themselves were a sign that he was going mad. I feel like unlocking the Oaths involves a certain amount of acceptance of one's role and an understanding of why they have been chosen and what they're supposed to do with their powers.

Not to mention, the other times we've seen Radiants unlocking an Oath, it's usually been at a crux moment, which then turns to a triumph as they realize what it is they're supposed to be doing. This happened with Kaladin on the plateau and protecting Elhokar, Lift when she saw Gawx struck down, Shallan when she needed to get into Shadesmar with Jasnah, and even Dalinar, during his confrontation with the Stormfather.

Renarin, unfortunately, due to his sheltered role in the war camps, has fewer opportunities for those kinds of demanding changes. I feel like he willingly throws himself into some dangerous situations in an attempt to help people, such as joining the duel or rushing out on to the plateau, and yet he never reaches that moment of realization of the Oaths, I don't think. On the plateau with the chasmfiend, he's sent back immediately before he can help. In the duel, he's inexperienced with fighting and finds himself defeated, rather than triumphant. 

The moment in the last battle, at the Everstorm, is probably the most heartbreaking. That feels like a moment where, if Renarin was accepting of his role and understood what he was there to do, he might have been able to find an Oath and really progress in his training. But the experience is so terrifying and overwhelming—losing control of himself, publically committing what his religion says is a heinous blasphemy—that at the end of it, he's even more broken and defeated than before. 

I think having other Radiants around, who can help him learn to accept his powers and figure out what's really going on with him, as well as learning to believe in himself and stay confident, is going to be a very good thing. My poor boy's been so scared and alone these past few books. He needs some real friends and real allies who can stand beside him and help him out.

1 minute ago, Landis963 said:

I can't speak for Destiny as I haven't done nearly the amount of research necessary to figure out the Traveler's and the Darkness' Intents (Although Odium does appear to fit surprisingly well for the latter).  Dishonored, on the other hand, I am quite familiar with so here we are.  The Outsider's Intent is not simply "Chaos," I think.  He's far too interested in and appreciative of Low Chaos protagonists for that.  In addition, Word of Harvey Smith (the game director) states that the Void Ritual that made him what he was filled him with an "insatiable curiosity about what people do when given power over others."  (from a Twitter conversation, screencapped here) Part of that comes from his human origins as a powerless boy forced into the ritual, of course, but not all, especially since the ritual in question happened some 4000 years in advance of the games, (Another Twitter conversation, here).  I suspect that he is a mixture of Ruin and at least one other Shard (Honor, perhaps?), with the intent of "Nemesis." (Hence the empowering of a select few and sending them out to seek their version of justice)  And Delilah is a Cognitive Shadow that (I suspect) found the memory of the ritual (Or at least found the Cognitive Realm version of that knife the cultist was holding) and used it to start siphoning off the Outsider's power.  And of course, she's more of a Ruinous character, so that's what she's drawing from the Outsider, and why he's willing to return Corvo's powers to him, should you choose to play as him in the sequel.  The rest of Delilah's actions in Dishonored 2 match pretty closely to Kelsier's situation.  

Also, Dishonored's world's Focus is clearly bone, and their subastral (except for the bits that the Outsider Invests for live visitors) is clearly meant to evoke the ocean depths.

Yeah, he's actually kind of a difficult one to pin down into one good Shard-y sounding word. I mean, he obviously has some amorality going on in that he doesn't seem to be disappointed in high-chaos protagonists, and yet, as the devs said, the Outsider is fascinated by the low-chaos protagonists, at seeing someone be given extreme powers and not using them selfishly or violently. I'd be tempted to say his intent was something like "Curiosity" but that's really just him, and doesn't really have anything to do with his powers. "Motivation" or "Consequence" perhaps? Neither sound particularly shardic. "Nemesis" could work, though since the Outsider himself doesn't really have any rivals, it's hard for him to act that out.

Honestly, as I think about it, as simple as it sounds, "Power" might be the best fit. The Outsider's motivation, as you pointed out, is seeing what happens when the powerless are given power. He contacts Corvo and Emily only at their lowest points, and presumably he did the same to Delilah, an illegitimate daughter kicked out to the street. The Outsider is most interested in seeing the powerful who are brought down low, and the lowly who claw their way up to power, and playing with the dynamic there with his interference.

Also, now that I think about it, if I were to try to name the Traveler something shardic, I might go with "Progress." Some of the lore talks about other worlds that the Traveler visited, and in each case, societies and civilizations blossomed, spreading and thriving in the gifts that it gave them.

One of the Darkness' races in particular, the Hive, is morally opposed to this idea, weirdly enough. (The Hive are fascinating.) The Hive's philosophy (and likely the Darkness' as well) is that only those things which are strong enough to keep themselves alive deserve to exist. Therefore, the Hive feel a moral obligation to figure out what those "worthy" things are... by attempting to eliminate every civilization that they come across. To them, peaceful societies encourage weakness, and allow it to fester, which makes the universe weaker. They see the Traveler as evil, because it shelters and coddles weak races that don't deserve to continue existing of their own right. 

Ohhhh my goodness, I can't believe I missed that one. Blue, I am utterly addicted to Dragon Age, and the number of times that I've called the Well of Sorrows the Well of Ascension is so many. Honestly. I mean, I wrote almost 25,000 words on a story of all the Stormlight characters in Thedas. And the Fade is definitely a Cognitive Realm equivalent. Perfect, perfect, perfect.

Okay so here's a few ideas that I've kicked around in my head for a while because I love video games and I love lore and I love Cosmere and I love crossovers. So as I was playing certain games, I started to notice a few... similarities to some of my favorite Shardworlds, and the more I looked, the deeper the parallels became. It's amazing how easily some of these games would fit into the cosmere, I think, and the way that they share some cool aspects with some existing Cosmere books.

This is all just for fun, some wacky coincidences between some of the stuff I love. There will be spoilers for the following: Dishonored, Dishonored 2, Destiny and its DLCs, Stormlight Archive, and Mistborn. This is a super long post too, because I love this topic and can babble at length.

To start us out:

Destiny as Stormlight Archive (in SPACE)

Primer for those who don't know anything about Destiny here:

Now that we're all on the same page, basically, I'm gonna dig into how this one plays out Cosmere-wise:

• The Traveler is a Shard. This one feels pretty obvious. Being of immense power that changes entire solar systems with its very presence with insane amounts of power? Shard.
   
• The Traveler was splintered by a rival Shard, the Darkness. I feel like the Traveler ends up as a good mix of Honor (establishing orders of guardian knights) and Cultivation (creating life and habitability on otherwise barren landscapes), and that leaves the Darkness as Odium, who has splintered Honor/the Traveler.
   
• Ghosts are Splinters, specifically spren. Little, sentient pieces of a dead power? Check. Bond with an individual to give them powers? Check. Cute little companions that appear and disappear at will? Check. 
   
• The Traveler's Light is investiture, specifically Stormlight. I mean, come on. Light siphoned from the power of the shattered power of an extremely potent entity? It even gives Guardians extreme recovery abilities, letting them heal from wounds in only a few seconds, and making them basically immortal.
   
• Guardians are Radiants. Thanks to their bond with their spren/Ghost, Radiants/Guardians have different and unique ways that they can channel the Light to create various distinct powers.
   
• Guardian subclasses are Radiant Orders. Though there are only three classes (Titan, Hunter, Warlock) for Guardians, each of those classes has three subclasses (Titan - Striker, Defender, Sunbreaker; Hunter - Gunslinger, Bladedancer, Nightstalker; Warlock - Voidwalker, Stormcaller, Sunsinger), and each has their own powers. The names even sound like Radiant orders. Edgedancer/Bladedancer? Stormcaller/Elsecaller?
   
• The races which serve the Darkness are Voidbringers. The four enemy races in Destiny—the Fallen, the Hive, the Vex, and the Cabal—are fighting against the forces of Light in hordes, serving a nebulous but terrifying enemy of the Traveler and the Light. Guardians have to defend the regular people against these overwhelming armies.

And finally, one of my favorite little tidbits about Destiny and its implications on this crossover comes from the heavy weapons category in Destiny. Guardians can carry three guns at a time: a primary, a secondary, and a heavy. Primaries are most used for normal encounters (regular guns, pretty much), secondaries are special situations (shotguns and snipers and stuff), and heavies (which deal massive damage, but are hard to find ammo for).

For the first year, there were only two weapon types in the heavy category: machine guns and rocket launchers. As of Year 2 and The Taken King DLC, though, we got a new kind of weapon in this category:

Swords.

Now if you are thinking that putting swords in the same category as rocket launchers is not really fair, you are right, because swords are so much cooler than rocket launchers in Destiny. (Spoilers below are gifs and pictures)

These are weapons of powerful energy that eat through bosses, and when you pull them out, they flash into existence from the hilt. They're all gorgeous and unique looking and though they're pretty massive, the Guardians hold them like they're weightless.

Guys, they're shardblades. Destiny has shardblades. Look at those jagged waves on the back of the right-most sword, Razelighter. That's completely something a Shardblade would have. Oathbringer has waves just like that on its backside.

Case closed, everybody, pack up and go home. Destiny is the Stormlight Archive. 

Now that that one's settled, let's move on to our next game and book pairing:

Dishonored and Dishonored 2 as Mistborn

Once again, for those not familiar with the two Dishonored series, here's your quick primer:

So, there's a few really obvious ones right off the bat that I'll get out of the way before I start delving into some of the really cool Cosmere parallels. Even those of you who have just watched the trailers can probably pick up on some of these:

• Aesthetic and ambiance. If there were ever to be a Mistborn video game, I'd want it to feel like Dishonored does. The worldbuilding of Dishonored's Empire of the Isles, especially in the first game, has an extremely Scadrian feel to it.
  
  We have a dark, dismal, dystopian Empire, where the rich hold opulent lavish parties while the rest of the city suffers and dies in squalor just outside their golden-lit stained glass windows. The guards exist to beat the lower class down and keep them from bothering the upper crust, and the government holds all the power.
  
  The bureaucratic Abbey of the Everyman, a religious organization more focused on tracking down illegal magic users and summarily executing them rather than any kind of real piety, is a perfect fit for the Steel Ministry, and the Canton of Inquisition in particular. 
  
  Dunwall, the city of the first game feels a lot like Final Empire-era Luthadel, albeit with a Victorian steampunk twist that would be right at home with Elendel. The best of both Mistborns here.
  (spoiler tag is pics)

• The Outsider's Mark powers feel very Allomantic. Though there aren't any metals involved, and both Corvo and Emily (and Daud, the DLC protagonist) have different powers from the Outsider, there's no denying that the powers that the Outsider grants are perfect for the kind of stealthy, sneaky, stabbity modus operandi that Mistborn favor. Corvo and Daud's Blink power feels a lot like Steelpushing, whereas Emily's Far Reach power could be the Lurcher equivalent. Watching Emily toss a grenade and then yank it back toward her over her head, or yank a body or living guard towards her in midair feels exceptionally like Ironpulling. The Dark Vision power feels a lot like tin, as it enhances vision and sounds around you to help you keep silent and keep track of where the guards and enemies are.
  
  Dishonored is a game that you can play perfectly stealthily, carefully never being seen, or you can rush in as a malestrom of superpowered death. Even the most high-tiered enemies, the "hazekillers" of Dishonored, really can't stand a chance against a Marked assassin who really knows what they're doing with their powers.
  
  Not to mention what the mark looks like. Crescents, dots, and long strokes? The Outsider's mark would fit in with the Steel Alphabet perfectly.
   
• Protagonist story parallels. Corvo is thrown into a terrible prison and tortured as a regular person, and then receives magical powers and goes to overthrow the evil empire who did it to him. Though it happens off-screen between the two games, the tutorial of Dishonored 2 shows him teaching Emily how to fight, sneak across rooftops, and defend herself. The Kelsier parallels are manifold.  
  
  Meanwhile, Emily, especially after inheriting her powers, feels like a wonderful Vin parallel. The empress who'd rather go galavanting off across the rooftops than sit in court, an avenging assassin, using her powers to take down her enemies with deadly precision and skill. 

Now, that the surface level is taken care of, let's dig into some of the ways that Dishonored really and shockingly lines up well with Realmatic theory, and some of the more intricate Realmatic things on Scadrial specifically. 

• The Outsider is a Shard. Unlike Destiny's the Traveler, which felt like a splintered Shard like Honor, the Outsider as a Shard would be one with an aware and active Vessel. Though he appears to protagonists in the Void, it's very clear that this is an avatar that he projects of himself, for his true form is something far more nebulous, something that suffuses the entirety of the Void and can watch over the entire physical world as well. He speaks only to a special chosen few, and only a handful of individuals merit enough attention from him to be gifted with his Mark.
  
  The parallels are even more clear when you find out more about his backstory. Like the Shards' vessels, the Outsider was once a human, who was sacrificed in a ritual to bind him to the powers of the Void. After his ascension, he remained fascinated with humanity, even though he himself was quite beyond human himself, now. (If I had to pick a Shard name for him, I'd probably go with Chaos.)
   
• The Outsider's power is the investiture which fuels the powers of the Marked. In the same way that the powers of Allomancy are drawn directly from Preservation, Marked individuals draw their power directly from the Outsider.
   
• The Void is the Cognitive Realm. This is an exceptionally important one, and I'll expound on it further in the next point, but the way the Void functions in Dishonored is strikingly similar to the Cognitive realm in the Cosmere. It's misty and off-balance, filled with moments and memories that seem more based in perception than reality. Though the Outsider can manifest himself within the physical world on a few special occasions, the Void is his true home. And like a Shard with a nexus, though his focus is usually in one place, his power is everywhere.
   
• Delilah Copperspoon/Kaldwin was a Cognitive Shadow who returned to life, just like Kelsier. Spoilers for the plot of Dishonored 2 and Secret History, but if you watch that Outsider backstory video linked just above, it explains a bit of Delilah's situation. Her spirit was banished to the Void, however, she was still able to communicate through the dreams of those who had been close to her, whispering ways to them that they could bring her back. In much the same way that Kelsier was able to, as a Cognitive Shadow, whisper to Spook because of their Connection so that they could find a way to bring Kelsier back.
  
  Delilah's friends and supporters then, were able to perform a seance to draw her spirit back from the Void into the physical world once more, and in the process, made her immortal. Much the same way Kelsier and Spook apparently figured out some way to use hemalurgy to return Kelsier to the physical world and make him immortal as the Sovereign.

All in all, it's pretty dang incredible just how many ways these stories line up with each other, in some really really cool ways. In case you guys couldn't tell, I love both Destiny and Dishonored, and could talk about them endlessly.

Anyone familiar with the games (or introduced to them here) have anything to add to my interpretations? Or can you think of any other games that line up well with Cosmere worlds like this? Sorry for the massively long post, but I'd love to hear you guys' thoughts on this!

1 hour ago, kari-no-sugata said:

Maybe Renarin is getting visions from Cultivation...? I don't think we can say for sure whether Renarin is a unique case or not yet (unless I'm missing something) though if all Truthwatchers get something similar during highstorms then it could explain why they're (apparently) particularly secretive. I can think of lots of different possibilities at least, due to the lack of solid information. 

Will Renarin continue to get visions during highstorms? Will being in Urithiru make any difference? Will he be similarly affected by the Everstorm passing over?

 

Porting this reply over to this thread.

I mean, my main problem with the visions being Cultivation's is that Vorinism has, time and time again, decried future sight as something evil. It is specifically stated on multiple occasions to be "a thing of the voidbringers" and Vorin society at large is extremely distrustful of anything that even seems close to knowing the future. Think of the bad rap stormwardens get for things like weather predictions. 

All that cultural fear of future sight came from somewhere. I mentioned somewhere that when I questioned Brandon about this theory, he gave me a counter-question, asking if I remembered what Vorins believed about seeing the future.

On 10/10/2015 at 10:41 PM, FeatherWriter said:

Brandon: Okay, can I ask you a question?

Feather: Yes... okay?

Brandon: Do you remember what Vorinism thinks of seeing the future?

Feather: Yes! They think it's evil, of Odium. Hence why I was asking in the first place! I'm very concerned.

Brandon: *laughs*

The fact that Brandon went out of his way to make sure I was remembering that little tidbit gives me more than enough cause for concern.

My poor dear son, Renarin... What is happening to you, bab?

Just to keep this one on topic, @kari-no-sugata, we should probably keep discussion of Renarin's visions in that thread. This one's for Ym and Edgedancer! I'll go respond over there.

On 11/29/2016 at 9:32 AM, Chull #445 said:

I think there are theories that says that Renarin is fooled to believe that he is becoming a Radiant, while in fact, he is affected by something else (Odium, I think). I do not know it very well myself, but if you look around a bit, you will probably find it.

On 11/29/2016 at 9:39 AM, emailanimal said:

Fair enough, although the one blurb about the order of Truthwatchers we do have seems to be consistent with what is going on with Renarin.  I myself have little doubt about it.

Hello, hi friends. Pretty sure the theory you're talking about is mine, Renarin's Visions and Truthwatching. There's a lot going on in that theory but the crux of it is that Renarin's visions aren't a normal expression of Truthwatching, and that there's something possibly sinister going on with them.

That said, I do believe that Renarin is probably actually a Truthwatcher. He has a spren, he healed his eyes with Stormlight, he hears screams when holding dead Shardblades. I just also thing there's more going on than just normal surgebinding when it comes to his visions.

As for the rest of this thread, it's funny, I immediately pegged both Ym and Stump for Truthwatcher, and thought it was confirmed by the text alone. I'm now trying to figure out why I did that, considering I don't remember Ym using anything other than Progression. I think. It was probably the appearance of his spren, who looked like refracted light rather than the vines and crystals we got from Wyndle. 

Now, the fact that neither Stump nor Ym displayed or mentioned any kind of compulsive vision behavior during highstorms or any kind of hypergraphia just kind of feeds into my "there's more going on with Renarin than just Truthwatching" theory. I feel like Stump's orphans, at least, would have seen and mentioned something if she were succumbing to visions like Renarin was. 

Cosmere characters doing song covers! Or rather, it's me, singing from the point of view of various Cosmere characters. 

I've definitely stolen the format "Broadway So-and-so" from the Homestuck fandom, who used to have a whole slew of singers rewriting lyrics and singing them in-character. No, they're not all Broadway songs. Actually... I don't think I've actually covered any actual Broadway songs, but that could be fun...

Anyway, I realized I'd never really posted my covers here all in one place and thought I should probably try to fix that. The newer ones are more polished as I've gotten better recording software and equipment, as well as just figuring out how to edit songs better with practice, but I figured I'd post even the rougher ones. Relistening to some of these is making me want to redo some.

The Cosmere lyrics for each song are in spoiler tags to keep this from cluttering. If there's no credit given for the cover track, then it's one that was either an official version provided by the artist themselves, or it's one that I pulled the vocal track out myself.

From most recent to oldest:

It's Over, Isn't It?
Character: Paalm, Shadows of Self
Original: "It's Over, Isn't It?" by Rebecca Sugar and Deedee Magno-Hall (Steven Universe)
Piano Cover: ThePandaTooth
Lyrics:

Light Runs Out
Character: Shallan, Words of Radiance
Original: "Love Runs Out" by OneRepublic
Karaoke Cover: Cyberwave Karaoke
Lyrics:

Let It Go
Character: Vin, Well of Ascension
Original: "Let It Go" by Idina Menzel (Frozen)
Lyrics: (Inspired by those written by @Lightflame)

Additionally, I've done a few songs that are Cosmere-focused but aren't actually from any specific characters. Those are always fun too.

Fandom Monster's Beautiful Darkside
Description: Written in honor of the annual "Cosmere Fandom is Still the Worst Fandom" writing challenge, which is always a good, fun time to make everyone you know distressed and crying. Also, I love sad fanfics. Fandom monster's gotta earn her title somehow. Though technically the lyrics could work for any fandom, it was specifically written for the Cosmere.
Original: "The Beautiful Darkside" by The Classic Crime
Lyrics:

Cosmere's Happening
Description: Meant as a "fandom anthem," this one cheers out references to events and places all over the cosmere, because heck yeah, why not?
Original: "Something Big" by Shawn Mendes
Karaoke Cover: YOU SING
Lyrics:

In the Final Empire
Description: A Survivorist hymn, meant to be from a later era, looking back on the time of the Originators before. (Also the first song I ever covered like this!)
Original: "In the Bleak Midwinter," Traditional Hymn
Instrumental: Sarah Brightman
Lyrics: (written by @EHyde)

So, that's what I've got for now. My SoundCloud has a few other covers, but for other fandoms. I'm willing to take requests, though of course, it depends on how well I know the song, if I can adapt the lyrics, and if I can find or make an instrumental track to sing over. Someone on tumblr asked me if I'd do a cover of "Colors" by Halsey for Warbreaker, so I might end up doing a Vivenna and Siri duet for that one.

Let me know what you think!