Twenty@20

2 hours ago, dvoraen said:

Likely not; most spheres are not perfect gems, which may be a condition required to hold one of the Unmade.  I suspect the size of the gemstone is relevant as well, which most spheres would likely fail on.  The spheres Gavilar had that he was giving out, were likely holding Voidlight he acquired from one of the Unmade.  Which one that was, is the real question.  It's quite possible he found Ba-Ado-Mishram and stored her perfect gemstone prison with his things, but it's just as possible he found one of the others still trapped as well.  Chemoarish is unaccounted for as well, after all.  Sja-anat and Dai-gonarthis are likely out and active.

It's just as likely that Gavilar found Ashertmarn or Yelig-nar, though.  I am honestly inclined to think he found Ashertmarn, though, because its appearance is rather sudden in Kholinar.  It's entirely possible he found more than one of the Unmade.  How does that explain the Voidlight spheres?  If Shadesmar spren have devices that can deposit Investiture into a perfect gem, then it's just as possible to withdraw it from one.  Navani said that Gavilar "made" it, and we know Nergaoul was shown to be made of Voidlight when he was captured, so, it stands to reason Gavilar could have snipped off a piece of Unmade Investiture into a sphere with some help from an artifabrian.

While I may be entirely incorrect in my amateur theory, I am going to put foward my train of thought. 

The part 3 epigraphs about truthwatchers provide a detailed account of how Ba-Ado-Mishran was responsible for forms of power and was providing voidlight to the Parshendi even after the last Desolation ended. She was captured by Melishi, the last Bondsmith probably similar to how Dalinar captured Nergaoul. This is also hinted at the WoR epigraph regarding Bondsmiths. Gavilar mentions to Eshonai in the prologue how “Our enslaved parshmen were once like you. Then we somehow robbed them of their ability to undergo the transformation. We did it by capturing a spren. An ancient, crucial spren.” This ancient spren seems to be Mishran. 

According to the essay about Mishran in Hessi's Mythica she is the commander and highprincess of Odium's army. The fact that she is out of commission during the crucial battles in OB may indicate she is still captive. 

If we assume that the sphere which Gavilar gave to Szeth had a captive Unmade (thats a big assumption, i admit I cannot rebut the voidlight theory; though to me the size of a gemstone doesnot seem to be important in capturing an Unmade, only that it should be flawless) then it is entirely possible that it was Ba-Ado-Mishran. Szeth could have hidden the sphere well enough to keep her out of action.

Random thought. Did the sphere which Gavilar gave Szeth hold Ba-Ado-Mishran? 

Quote

“Highprince Dalinar Kholin,” Kaladin said, Stormlight puffing before his lips, “has refounded the Knights Radiant. And this time, we will not fail you.”

The expressions in the room ranged from adoring to terrified. Kaladin found his father’s face. Lirin’s jaw had dropped. Hesina clutched her infant child in her arms, and her expression was one of pure delight, an awespren bursting around her head in a blue ring.

You I will protect, little one, Kaladin thought at the child. I will protect them all.

Had moisture in my eyes reading this. So many emotions.

51 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

If you're referring to this, then it's not part of a standalone novella, it's just a scene. It might make it into SA3, or it might be like Mistborn: Secret History where we the readers don't learn about it until well after.

Yes I was referring to this scene. I remember there was some talk around that time of a Jasnah novella about her Shadesmar travel. 

 

3 minutes ago, WeiryWriter said:

It's not going to be released:

 

 Thats sad but perfectly understandable. Thanks for the info Weiry. 

Any news/update about it? Thanks

To expand on this concept, could a nicrosil ferring store enough Investiture which when tapped could allow them access to any other feruchemical or allomantic power? Then suppose he becomes a nicroburst temporarily and starts compounding Investiture. Could we have another TLR eventually. Apologies if this sounds implausible. This theory has been playing on my mind since I read Bands.

PS:Alternatively a Soulbearer ferring could get a nicrosil spike with the same end result.

“So to create one with multiple powers…”

“You must be very skilled,” Allik said. “More skilled than any who has lived among us. Or…” He chuckled. “Or you’d have to have all the powers, rather than adding yours to the medallion, then passing it to another to have it added to! If that were the case, you’d be a great god indeed. As powerful as the Sovereign.”

Emphasis mine

So using the band someone would have all the powers and can use them to make another band. After all that's how the Sovereign made the original band bypassing the skill problem.

So did Kelsier make the bands of mourning? If so,this raises so many questions.

Secret History

Can it be that Kelsier stole the bands from someone else and pretended to have made it. TLR could have made it before Vin killed him. During the 1st trilogy it was forgotten and Kelsier later dug it up once he learnt of its value. Other possibility could be that Marsh (does he have all the allo & feru attributes?) made it and then Kelsier stole it.

Kelsier making the bands is the biggest surprise of the Mistborn series yet. A throwback to the Original trilogy with cosmere wide ramifications. Just imagine if he makes more of these bands? Can Wax or the Kandra using the band make more bands. Whoa. Game over.

Since no one has brought this up(I think), I have to point out this detail with cosmeric implications.   When Wax was chatting with Harmony, Hoid was sitting on top of the carriage. Now that is definitely not a coincidence. Chances are Hoid came to Scadrial specifically for the chance to eavesdrop Harmony. So how did Hoid plan to hear the conversation since it was taking place inside Wax's head? Maybe he had spiked himself too? If Hoid indeed managed to hear Harmony how might he use this knowledge about Harmony's intent and limitations. What are the chances that Harmony took notice of Hoid? 

 

Hoid and Wayne were together for an entire ride and we don't know what they talked about. This scene is  begging to be written.

So Lord Ruler's superspy fell in love with a lawman for hire. Beat that Romeo and Juliet.

I get a sinking feeling that all this speculation about Highprince succession and associated politics will come to a nought in the face of the Desolation. The neutral highprinces will folk towards Dalinar because they are out of their depths in the face of the Desolation. Among Sadeas' faction Aladar already jumped ship and Ruthar is disgraced through his son. Ialai will have a personal vendetta against the Kholins but she will be hardpressed to find allies.

 

The power of being a Highprince will go for a toss when when the only job of a Highprince is to direct the war effort against the Voidbringers. And dont forget the Voidbringers will target the highprinces. Good luck to whoever wants to be a non-Radiant Highprince. Also its unlikely that Dalinar wll try to install Kaladin as a highprince because Kaldin will be much more valuable as a one man army.

 

I think Dalinar will next try to unite the whole of Roshar and in that his next challenge will be Taravangian.

And when I see how the character arcs of Dalinar and Szeth seem to be currently inversed, I have hopes that I'll be able to relate to Szeth's journey more when it's finally told.  Besides, if, as you say, Szeth becoming Truthless really is one of the defining moments of the SA--wouldn't it make more sense for its realization to come about at the end?  Tying the beginning up with the ending, etc. etc.

 I bet Brandon thought the same and therefore decided to postpone Szeth's flashbacks to the 5th book. I remember him mentioning in one of his tweets something about deciding whose flashback would take the story forward the best in book 3. And he decided on Dalinar. One can suppose in the same vein, he kept Szeth's story for book 5 because he thinks it would contribute to that book's plot the best. So I would say we can definitely expect some "aha!" moments in the his flashbacks.

 

 

A culture that is capable of producing a creature like Szeth is one where we (meaning them and myself) differ at a fundamental level of what it means to be alive--and I dread reading about that for 55,000 words, because there will be no "aha!" moment for it.  It will just be trudging through things that make no sense to me, in an effort to make me understand a character that will become something I despise.  Or, at least, that is what I fear.

 

I wonder what you think about the Listeners as a culture. If our knowledge about their culture was limited to Dalinar's perspective only, perhaps the Listeners or their leaders would also appear despicable for killing their ally on the very night of signing a treaty with him. What I am trying to suggest is that lets not prejudge Szeth and the Shin untill we hear their side of the story.

So, If you looked at the twitter, Dalinars flashbacks are done, and the first draft is at 13%

 

I've been trying to chart the progress, it seems to be about 1% per day.

 

So.... first draft done October 11th?

 

I thinking there will be a summer 2016 release. I there any date Brandon said?'

 

You know your a Sanderfan when you get more excited about a book release than your vacation.... :/

Brandon started the Dalinar flashbacks on 16th June and finished them on 16th July. Thats a month to write 13% of the 1st draft. i think you have to revise your estimates. Roughly we can expect the 1st draft to be completed around mid February. 

 

I hope that people that are downvoting me for hating on Szeth are among those that are posting why they disagree.  If not, please feel free to join the discussion, if only to offer support to one of the voices offering counter-arguments that you may actually agree with.  I don't care too much about upvotes or downvotes, but if you're going to send negative votes towards someone you simply disagree with, then I think you should be adding your voice to the discussion, too (no need to say, "Arrgh! I downvoted ye, an' now I'll be stealin' all yer treasure! Arrr!" unless you are a fan of pretending to be a pirate.)

 

To the points I've bolded: Of course it'll add to the story.  If Sanderson wrote "I am a stick" 50,000 times, it would add to the story.  Maybe Joker isn't the perfect example, but I still say it's pretty darn good.  Joker is one of the most iconic villains of all-time, and yet has never had (to the best of my knowledge) a storyline dedicated to his origin.  Would it add to the story?  Would it add to Joker as a character?  Yes, inevitably.  But the time, story, and space that it would take wouldn't be as meaningful as if they told a different story instead.  The same is true of Szeth, as he is right now. 

 

Where the story, and Szeth in particular, are at--would having flashback scenes of Szeth add as much, as easily, as if they were delayed a bit?  I've specifically said that showing the course of progression that Dalinar has made will make it substantially easier to show Szeth in a sympathetic/relatable light; am I wrong?  (Sympathetic and relatable don't mean "good" or "redeemed."  Mr T is largely sympathetic, and probably the most evil human alive in Roshar right now.)  In order to write these scenes in a believable way that continues to track with the result of the Szeth we have now, Sanderson would have to pull off some incredibly risky moves.  The chance of failure would be, if not high, much greater than the alternatives, while the payoff for success would be exactly the same.  Why bet $100 for a chance to win $10 in profit, when you could bet $10 for a chance to win $10 in profit?

 

Further, if Szeth is a major focus character in SA3, some much needed character development can occur, it remains possible to learn things about his past without having specific flashbacks to it, we will learn more about the Shin regardless, etc.  I am not, and haven't been, saying "Not ever" to his flashback story; just "not yet." 

 

I'm pretty sure that why Szeth is a Truthless will not be a big deal; it will be about a group of scared humans grasping at retaining power for as long as they may.  Remaining blinded to the truth of things.  I'll be utterly astounded if it's anything else.

Let me start by saying I personally would like to know about Szeth's past. I was happy when Szeth's flashback was planned for the 3rd book. Book 2 ended with Szeth starting afresh and I thought his flashbacks and his upcoming expedition to Shinovar would have provided a kind of symmetry to book 3. 

 

I would say that Szeth becoming a Truthless was one of those defining moments without which Stormlight Archive wouldn't have started rolling. Szeth is the first character we come in contact excluding the WoK prelude. As much as Brandon talks about years of planning about Dalinar and Kaladin's stories, I am sure he has kept some surprises for Szeth's story as well. Even though we have got some hints about his past, its definitely going be heartbreaking to watch a good honest guy being turned into a killer. If its going to be anything like Eshonai's arc in WoR- a story of manipulation, missed opportunities and evil smothering the good, I look forward to it.

most people think squires get the passive bonus of stormlight, but no activesurges. we stilll don't know foor sure, though.

 

lopen'ss potential order was already discussed in the past, here

http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/8048-the-lopens-order

but i will repeat what i said at the time:

the lopen is an order all by himself, with the power to summon cousins to do his bidding

 

we may tentatively call his surges cousingbinding and favorcalling

 

here an example of how his power works:

-kaladin can fly with the power of stormlight. lopen cannot, but he has a cousin who has a cousin who owns an airplane factory, and owes him a few favors, so he can loan a plane (favorcalling) and fly.

-Kaladin can fight like a little god with the power of stormlight. lopen cannot, but after all they've been through kaladin is practically his cousin (cousinbinding), so lopen can get kaladin to fight for him (favorcalling again).

My morning looks so much better after reading this.

I was despairing of the wet Taln thing, but as it turns out Kholinar is right next to not one, but two rivers. So the water thing may actually be pretty mundane.

He he, I was planning to point out this since I was pouring over the Alethkar map few days back in another thread.

Anyways I thought maybe there is another explanation for "Taln's" wetness. What if he was drenched in sweat due to physical exertions during his journey. The fluid loss resulting from sweating can also account for his exhaustion in the same scene.

While the interaction between Jasnah and Kaladin will be a dynamic one (guaranteed they will butt heads over everything), she else-called to a place where there are mountains to the west. Hearthstone doesn not have mountains (as far as maps and in-world descriptions go). However, Kholinar has rivers and also mountains west of it, which makes it more likely that, a)Jasnah is close by to the capital and b)when Kaladin makes his way there from Heartstone, they will meet there. Makes for a more dramatic confrontation, when 2 Radiants with different objectives (1 to protect, the other has no qualms about removing 'festering wounds') meet. At least that's how I would write it.

If you look at the Alethkar map closely, there a small mountain range just east of Hearthstone. Probably Jasnah appeared on the other side of that mountain. There are also quite a few unnamed streams near-by draining into the bay. So Wit and Jasnah would have to travel west, crossing the mountain and they would reach Hearthstone. Anyhow this is all guesswork and your guess is as good as mine provided Jasnah meets Kaladin sooner than later.

So,

 

When Jasnah elsecalls out into the wilderness in the WoR epilog, Wit say that its "four weeks to the nearest town"

 

What if that town is Hearthstone?

 

 

Discuss.

Have been thinking of replying for a couple of days. So here it goes. At first sight this looks like wishful thinking. I mean doesn't Jasnah appear somewhere in the Unclaimed Hills east of Shattered Plains probably near Shallan's landing place. Because Wit mentions hills and the fact that they are at least a week away from civilization. Also as Jasnah mentions she was somewhat pressed at the time of her departure from Shadesmar so it make sense to just reappear beyond Shadesmar's land into Physical land closest to where her ship had drowned. That's a convoluted way of saying that she mostly likely had reappeared close to where Shallan was rescued by the slavers.

So I am assuming she escaped Shadesmar somewhere near the Expanse of Vapors. However a bit earlier in the epilogue chapter Wit mentions

A small river gurgled nearby, one of the few permanent waterways in this strange land. Extending in all directions were rolling hills, furrowed by passing water and grown over in the valleys with an odd kind of briar. Very few trees here, though farther west a true forest sprouted on the slopes down from the heights.

This mention of a river along with the fact that rivers are rare in Roshar is important because a map of Alethkar and Unclaimed Hills in WoK shows exactly two rivers. And one of them flows right by Hearthstone. Hurray.

So if Jasnah left Shadesmar from the direction of Expanse of Broken Sky, there is every possibility she appeared on the Northern coast of Alethkar near the Windrunner river. And if the map is any indication Hearthstone should be about a week or so away from the sea.

So fingers crossed. And by the way, Stormlight 3 is at 9%.

Here's the thing: the spammers are no longer just bots. A lot of them go through the verification process, which means it's a real person. If we put such steps in place, they would still get through.

We had one who was rather clever. They would make posts (not just topics) that were generic, but almost fit the topic at hand. Then, one of the characters (I remember one being a period) would be a link to their website.

Sadly, the best option truly is just to hit the report button and have one of us do a ban.

Rose, Chaos and all other moderators, you have been associated with this wonderful website way longer than me and I completely trust your judgement on this matter. I know stopping new members from making new topics would hardly deter a determined spammer. The best it would do is cause a temporary decline and after that it would be business as usual for spambots. Therefore count on me to hit the report button regularly.

...

The suggestion is not a bad one, but I do worry, because often a member does post in Introduce Yourself when they register. I could have it enabled so new members can post new topics there, but then wouldn't bots just spam there, and then upon them doing that, spam elsewhere?

I guess it is worth thinking about but it seems like a band-aid solution that isn't good to new members. The features I want from something like Twitch chat would be words that ban people for using certain terms. And unfortunately such methods don't exist for some stupid reason. It annoys me to no end.

...

Perhaps we could have a trial run for a month or two. New members can post a reply in someone else's topic in Introduce Yourself and then open their own topics there if they want. New members can be informed about this while signing up so there is no confusion.

I agree it's a stop gap measure. However if helps the moderators in fighting spammers then great. If this doesn't work or a better system comes along then it can always be abandoned later.

So I have been hanging around the Oneplus forums for the past week (recently bought a Oneplus One, no surprises) and I noticed a few good things about that forum.

Firstly it's design is very good. Lightweight, hence fast. Our mobile site is very fast as well but the desktop site is only moderately so. (I stay mostly on 2G network, so I feel it more)

Second point I noticed is the Oneplus forum doesn't have separate mobile and desktop versions. So the site has full functionality. The editor is fully loaded. No need for BBcodes. That's a real boon. Now I know we are expecting a major overhaul of our dear site and its going to have all these features. All I can say I am eagerly awaiting it.

Lastly about the spammers. The Oneplus forum doesn't allow new members to start a discussion or thread. They have to post once in another thread to become eligible for opening a discussion. This set me thinking and I realised it's the very thing we need on our forum to stop spambot because guess what they always open their own threads and never post in another thread. So what do our moderators think. Can this be done?

My memory is a little rusty but don't modern fabrials have spren imprisoned inside them. While we have seen Radiants of old using fabrials based on Surges, those fabrials most definitely didn't have spren trapped inside them.

Since the Soulcasting fabrials used in present day are Surge based fabrials, its unlikely their technology has been reproduced yet. So these soulcaster fabrials are most likely relics from an older period in Roshar's history and considered holy as well.

Of the bat I would say you don't need Adhesion to "coat" an object with Storm light. Infuse would be the appropriate word to use here as per examples from text. And Adhesion is not necessary to infuse objects with Stormlight. We have seen Shallan infuse spheres with Stormlight.

Second point would be Reverse Lashing is always "external" in the sense that Szeth or Kaladin when full of Stormlight have never pulled objects towards themselves. Best example would be when Kaladin used to Reverse lash Parshendi arrows to the bridge he was carrying. Not once did the arrows hit him. Otherwise the story would have been too different.

Interesting topic. I believe its a demonstration of Jasnah's expertise at soulcasting. Changing only a part of the paper instead of the whole thing means Jasnah is at her peak of soulcasting expertise. On the question of whether it's should be actually possible or not to do something like this is debatable. While I have no definite idea how to force only a part of a paper's cognitive aspect to change, I think it's only a step up from changing the whole thing.

Here let me point out the example of half lashings which means only half of an object's spiritual bond is changed. Granted lashings and soulcasting have entirely different mechanisms (one is spiritual other is cognitive) yet we can draw some parallels between a half lashing and selectively soulcasting portions of paper into fire.

Disclaimer: posting after a long gap. So naturally I must got a few things wrong. Just don't eat me OK.

I have been following this topic and decided to post after a long gap. I would like to suggest two simple modifications to the downvote mechanism to minimise downvote abuse.

First, the colour of the down vote button can be changed to some neutral colour like blue or yellow. The red down vote button and red coloured negative reputations do look very damaging in a sharder's posts and profile. Changing the colour would go a long way in alleviating the negative implications of the downvote.

Second, the downvotes can be excluded from the reputation count - both total and for individual posts. The forumwide reputation can be comprised of total upvotes only while the downvotes shouldn't be counted at all. This will let downvotes to used as originally intended - as a criticism of the specific post- and useless as means of personal vendetta if anyone is inclined to do so.

That's my two cents.

I thought of something similar few days back. So yeah I can agree with you.

Perhaps I was a bit careless with my phrasing. When Brandon said that fighting abilities isnt the Windrunner Quirk, I took that to mean that other orders will also have exceptional fighting abilities- it isn't just unique to Windrunners.(I would expect the Skybreakers, Releasers, Stonewards, Willshapers too have supernatural fighting abilities)