The Unmade were Odium's Perpendicularity

[Ripheus23]

I got the impression that the highstorms carry partial perpendicularities with them:

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Narkac

Where does the Stormlight in highstorms come from? Is there like a "rain cycle", but for the Stormlight?

Brandon Sanderson

The Stormlight in the highstorm is transferred from the Spiritual realm through the Stormfather into the highstorm.

source

So my theory is that Odium had a perpendicularity for conveying Voidlight, and this was broken into the Unmade---on Braize (for there to be nine of these beings). The Unmade who can provide Voidlight does so by being the specific sub-part of Odium's Perpendicularity that bridged the "region" with Voidlight (in the Spiritual Realm) with the Physical Realm (other Unmade correspond to other attributes/parts/powers of Odium's Perpendicularity).

[Szmit]

Every Shard we know of carries a prependicularity, and some ot them carry multiple ones - like Autonomy and Honor. While Highstorm is a perpendicularity, there is always another one (that is moving). Shardpool-Prependicularities seem to be gateways AND resting place for Investiture that automatically form during Investing on a planet or system. I don't thing that Unmade, even if they all were as strong as Stormfarthe could replace a Shardpool, especially  that they could be probably destroyed. Moreover Odium is invested mainly in Braize, and all Unmade are currently on Roshar, and if all Odiums perpendicularities were on Roshar he should also be mainly invested in Roshar.

I could dig theory of secoundary Perpendicularity (like the one Autonomy made in one of short stories in Arcanum)

Spoiler

lake in Sixth of the Dusk

and his main one on Braize beeing intact.

[Scion of the Mists]

7 minutes ago, Szmit said:

Every Shard we know of carries a prependicularity, and some ot them carry multiple ones - like Autonomy and Honor. While Highstorm is a perpendicularity, there is always another one (that is moving).

AFAIK, the main theory is that the highstorm is Honor's moving perpendicularity.  

8 minutes ago, Szmit said:

Shardpool-Prependicularities seem to be gateways AND resting place for Investiture that automatically form during Investing on a planet or system

This is somewhat backwards.  It's not that Investiture naturally pools near a perpendicularity, it's that the large concentration of Investiture forms a perpendicularity.  It pierces through the realms (similar to gravitational warping), which is what allows for transition to/from Shadesmar.  

 

15 minutes ago, Szmit said:

Moreover Odium is invested mainly in Braize, and all Unmade are currently on Roshar, and if all Odiums perpendicularities were on Roshar he should also be mainly invested in Roshar.

I agree that Odium's perpendicularity should be on Braize because that's where he's currently "residing."  (However, I think that, in parallel to Honor's highstorm, Odium's perpendicularity is the Everstorm, which was originally on Braize, but was transported to Roshar by the stormform Listeners)

[Szmit]

2 minutes ago, Scion of the Mists said:

AFAIK, the main theory is that the highstorm is Honor's moving perpendicularity.  

We have seen Honor's Perpendicularity when Dalinar did his thing. Moreover it was said that Honor's Perpendicularity can be used as the gateway to Shadesmar - and I really doubt that you could do that with Highstorm, othervise with the knowledge of their Spren, the Kalladin and his friends in Oathbringer would try to catch up to the Sphere of Highstorm that Kalladin touched and use it to transport themselves back to Phisical Realm.

2 minutes ago, Scion of the Mists said:

This is somewhat backwards.  It's not that Investiture naturally pools near a perpendicularity, it's that the large concentration of Investiture forms a perpendicularity.  It pierces through the realms (similar to gravitational warping), which is what allows for transition to/from Shadesmar.  

Yes Investiture causes Perpendicularity, but that only enforces idea that the places where Perpendicularity are, are resting places for Investiture. Especially considering how Shardpools in Mistborn were collectng used Investiture in diffrent forms (I know that cicrumstances were diffrent, but both of the Shardpools were collecting Investiture in diffrent ways and for diffrent reasons, what seems to imply that they are good places to collect investiture).

 

[Ripheus23]

5 hours ago, Scion of the Mists said:

I agree that Odium's perpendicularity should be on Braize because that's where he's currently "residing."

It was at one point. There are nine Unmade because Braize is 9-centric (per a WoB). If the Unmade were made on Roshar, there would be ten of them, so they were made, and then unmade, on Braize. Now, the Stormfather transfers Stormlight through a perpendicularity, so Ba-Ado-Mishram seems likely to transfer Voidlight through a perpendicularity. But I think all the Unmade represent aspects of Odium's Perpendicularity, so BAM is just the one who specifically represents the Physical-Spiritual vector (there'd also be a Cognitive-Physical and Cognitive-Spiritual vector, I suppose, so maybe the three highest Unmade correspond to these three vectors of the perpendicularity).

Now, another premise for the theory is that the Unmade are Splinters of Odium, which I'm not sure has been confirmed (IDK if there's a WoB to this effect, and the stuff in the books themselves is ambiguous IIRC). If the Shard of Odium itself caused the perpendicularity originally, it might not be too much of a stretch to say that the perpendicularity was originally part of Odium's soul, so fragments of it would count as Splinters, I suppose.

[Calderis he/him]

23 minutes ago, Ripheus23 said:

Now, another premise for the theory is that the Unmade are Splinters of Odium, which I'm not sure has been confirmed (IDK if there's a WoB to this effect, and the stuff in the books themselves is ambiguous IIRC). If the Shard of Odium itself caused the perpendicularity originally, it might not be too much of a stretch to say that the perpendicularity was originally part of Odium's soul, so fragments of it would count as Splinters, I suppose.

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Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

1) The Nightwatcher and Stormfather are parallel entities such that Nighwatcher:Cultivation :: Stormfather:Honor.

2) There is sort of a parallel for Odium, but the parallel is the various Unmade instead of a single entity.

3) They are parallel in that they are all Splinters.

4) The Unmade are voluntary Splinters, because Odium ("like almost all of the other Shards") voluntarily Splintered part of it's power.

5) The Stormfather is different from the others because it's a Sliver.

source

 

[RShara she/her]

I don't think the Unmade contain enough investiture to be perpendicularities.

 

25 minutes ago, Ripheus23 said:

Now, another premise for the theory is that the Unmade are Splinters of Odium, which I'm not sure has been confirmed (IDK if there's a WoB to this effect, and the stuff in the books themselves is ambiguous IIRC)

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WeiryWriter

Are the Unmade Splinters of Odium?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. Good guess.

source

 

[Ripheus23]

Well then, here's my amended version of my theory: there is a weather phenomenon on Braize that is comparable to the highstorms, and somehow this is related to the Unmade.

[Scion of the Mists]

1 hour ago, Ripheus23 said:

But I think all the Unmade represent aspects of Odium's Perpendicularity

Is there any indication in the books or WoBs that perpendicularities can be divided into aspects?  

[Ripheus23]

1 hour ago, Scion of the Mists said:

Is there any indication in the books or WoBs that perpendicularities can be divided into aspects?  

If perpendicularities have more than one attribute/property/predicate/power/function/w/e, then conceptually for sure they can be divided. Now, also, I daresay if Adonalsium could be Shattered, why not a mere perpendicularity?

[Calderis he/him]

A perpendicularity isn't an entity... The various properties it may possess aren't separate things. The ability to transition is a side effect of the accumulation of investiture in a single location pulling the Realms closer together. If you were to split that into smaller chunks, it would mean less of an accumulation and less of a "pull" and less ability to draw on the other realms.

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Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

In our universe, mass and energy curve space. I was wondering if Investiture does the same or something similar

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

It does something similar. It draws the three Realms together. So it's got like-- Imagine a gravitational pull piercing Realms. Right? Of kind of--

Questioner [PENDING REVIEW]

And that's how a perpendicularity works?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

That's not the only way a perpendicularity works, but one surefire way to create a perpendicularity is a massive collection of Investiture in the Cognitive or mostly Physical realm. But Cognitive's weird, doesn't always work the right way. But there are ways to do it that way too.

source

 

Edited September 19, 2018 by Calderis

[+Child of Hodor]

45 minutes ago, Calderis said:

A perpendicularity isn't an entity... The various properties it may possess aren't separate things. The ability to transition is a side effect of the accumulation of investiture in a single location pulling the Realms closer together. If you were to split that into smaller chunks, it would mean less of an accumulation and less of a "pull" and less ability to draw on the other realms.

 

I never said it was an entity ... I said the Stormfather was CONNECTED to the perpendicularity. Because he is connected to the remnants of honor now that honor is dead. 

I never said the Stormfather had been a perpendicularity pre-shattering ... I said he is connected to a perpendicularity because he absorbed Honor’s cognitive shadow. 

The cognitive shadow could only be absorbed after honor died. 

[Calderis he/him]

19 minutes ago, Child of Hodor said:

I never said it was an entity ...

I didn't say that you did. That was directed at Ripheus23, who posted directly before me. 

 

[Ripheus23]

17 hours ago, Calderis said:

A perpendicularity isn't an entity...

That's open to debate. All kinds of things are sentient/saptient/w/e, in the Cosmere, that aren't IRL. Like pure concepts (spren) or metal swords (Nightblood) or floating balls of light (Seons) or countries (on Sel) or sticks or palaces or mists and so on and on. Since a perpendicularity is made from Investiture, which is naturally conscious when condensed sufficiently or whatever, I don't see why it would be impossible for there to be a sentient/sapient/w/e perpendicularity. In fact I would rather suspect that it would be more unlikely that a perpendicularity was unconscious than not.

EDIT: After all, if cakes have souls, so to speak, why not perpendicularities?

Edited September 19, 2018 by Ripheus23