[OB]How was Honor splintered?

[Willshaping Crasher]

I am looking for everyone's input on how they believe Honor was splintered.  Not the obvious "he was killed by Odium" type thing. How did it play out?  Odium was restricted on Braize presumably since the final desolation, yet Honor did not die until slightly before the Recreance. Was Honor mortally wounded during one of the desolations (or even before them) and it took possibly thousands of years for him to die?  Did one of the unmade somehow do it?  Does Odium's splintering ability not require a physical proximity (only a cognitive or spiritual one)?  I am just looking for thoughts.

[Szmit]

I'm using spioler because there is no [OB] in the title

Spoiler

I don't belive Odium is strictly restricted to Braize. Even when there are no Voidbringers on Roshar, there are still some voidsprens and Unmade, therefore he is still invested there. However we know that he can not enact on the world to directly even during the true desolation or he would be too vurnelable for Cultivation attack. That is in my opinion what keeps him from appearing on Roshar without desolation - him not beeing invested enough on roshar to win that battle. 

For how Honor died  - I belive that Honor started the battle, but not on Roshar but 'neutral ground' like the space between the planets, where they are equally powerfull, or spiritual realm. Mabye Odium wanted to use the weaknes of oathpact and create Everstorm and Honor managed to stop him until the Talanel's surrender? 

Anyway I also don't belive that slow dyying is a posibility. Splintering is stealling investiture and not poisoning, and the 'deadly embrace' tactic that we saw in certain other book

Spoiler

Mistborn

wouldn't work when there are three gods, because Cultivation could just do some simple 'hit and run', to hurt Odium very badly.

 

Edited June 2, 2018 by Szmit
grammar

[RShara she/her]

We don't know exactly how Shards are Splintered. Rayse dealt Tanavast the killing blow quite a while before Tanavast completely died and Rayse could Splinter Honor. Tanavast's death took a long time, similar to

Mistborn spoilers

Spoiler

how long it took for Leras to die in Mistborn.

But we don't know exactly when or what it was. Just lots of questions still open about that entire series of events.

I don't think Rayse is bound to Braize, I think he's bound to the Rosharan system. So he can move around those planets as he wants.

Edited June 2, 2018 by RShara

[KalaDANG he/him]

Brandon has answered some questions that are similar to this. Before Honor and Odium even fought each other, Odium had already defeated and splintered both Devotion and Dominion on Sel. When Brandon was asked about this, he said that Honor was smart and wily, and he obviously prepared himself for the fight, he stopped creating honorspren and instead handed the task over to the stormfather, and when eventually they fought, Odium dealt a fatal blow, but Honor was somehow during the fight able to bind Odium to Braize. Obviously, the details of the fight aren't known to us. We've learned through the books that the shards are all equal parts of adonalsiums power, with none of them having more power than the others. The only way for one to overpower the other is by one of the god's losing some power by investing themselves somehow and losing a portion of their power, for example, when Preservation created mankind on Scadrial, he gave each of them a bit of his essense, leaving himself weakened and at the mercy of Ruin. So, it's logical to assume that in Honor's efforts on Roshar left him weakened to the point where it left him vulnerable to Odium and allowed him to overpower Honor. We've seen gods being stuck on planets in Mistborn where Ruin and Preservation were both unable to leave Scadrial because their powers were too invested in the planet, leading to ruin trying to destroy it in order to escape. We know that it takes a very long time for gods to die, like what RShara said with Preservation. Honor was able to create the visions that were eventually sent to Dalinar, and he tried to help them as much as he could before he died and was splintered. Rough life. It is possible though that Odium has found some new way to overpower other Shards, because he was the one to first splinter a god's power so no one could ascend and take the power back up, which hadn't ever been previously done.

[MountainKing]

I think you splinter a shard by killing its original body.

[RShara she/her]

3 hours ago, MountainKing said:

I think you splinter a shard by killing its original body.

When the Vessel is killed, there is a chance that the power will Splinter if it's not taken up. Brandon's said that it depends on a number of factors and any particular outcome (if it's not picked up) isn't guaranteed. I'm sure Splintering requires more than that.

[MountainKing]

Yes, but remember the body dissipates when someone takes up a shard, so first a shard you have to capture and resemble the body, and then kill the shardholder while they are at full power

[Calderis he/him]

The body of a Vessel is subsumed within the power. If the vessel is killed or gives up the power, the body then coalesces and reforms. 

In many ways, a splintering is the shattering in miniature. I personally don't believe that Adonalsium had a Vessel, but was something more akin to a massive spren. If what I believe is true, then it had no "body" and yet it was still shattered. 

Shattering/splintering is about splitting apart the power itself. The form of the thing containing that power shouldn't matter. Breaking a vase doesn't split the water it contains into its component molecules, it just spills out of the container. I think killing a Vessel is much the same. 

Edited June 7, 2018 by Calderis