[OB] Sja-anat, Glys, Renarin, and Cultivation

[Confused]

This month’s Shardcast concludes Sja-Anat “corrupts” a Truthwatcher spren, Glys. The Shardcasters believe Renarin both Voidbinds (foresees) and Surgebinds (heals). Many posters agree. I see another possibility: Maybe Cultivation transforms a Sja-Anat splinter, Glys, into a Nahel-bondable Radiant spren?

Sja-Anat says to Shallan during their Oathgate encounter (OB, Chapter 84, Kindle p. 817),

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We were made, then unmade, she agreed. But no, not an enemy! The figure turned humanlike again, though the eyes remained glowing white. It pressed its hands against the glass. Ask my son. Please.

“You’re of him. Odium.” The figure glanced to the sides, as if frightened. No. I am of me. Now, only of me….

Listen, Radiant. Listen to my plea. Ashertmarn fled on purpose. It is a trap. I was compelled to touch the spren of this device, so it will not function as you wish.

In the next chapter, Sja-Anat sadly tells Shallan (OB, Chapter 85, Kindle p. 822),

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Trust is not mine, said the figure in the mirror. You will not give my children a home. Not yet.

IMO, Sja-Anat juxtaposes her corruption of the Oathgate spren – which she was “compelled to touch” – with her “son” and other “children.” This suggests Sja-Anat’s children are not corrupted spren like “the spren of this device” (a cold description, I think). She doesn’t claim the Oathgate spren as her children or ask Shallan to check with them. Other Kholinar spren Sja-Anat corrupts appear to be pre-Shattering Adonalsium spren – exhaustionspren, painspren, and shamespren.

Spren “create” children. Their children share their Investiture. Syl is the Stormfather’s daughter. After the Recreance, the Stormfather “created only ten more” honorspren. (OB, Chapter 108, Kindle p. 1015.) Notum’s great-grandmother was one, who in turn “created” his grandfather, who then “created” his father, who “created” Notum. Ico’s father was a Radiant spren. Though it’s possible, I don’t believe spren “adopt” other spren’s children by injecting alien Investiture into them. The injected Investiture instead “corrupts” them (IMO).

Here’s my theory: I think Cultivation transforms Sja-Anat, freeing her from Odium’s influence – “I am of me. Now, only of me.” Sja-Anat remains Odium’s Investiture, but her mind now is her own. IOW, I believe Cultivation gives Sja-Anat free will.

Sja-Anat then creates her “son,” the voidspren Glys. I believe Cultivation transforms Glys to make him Nahel-bondable. Glys gives Renarin his powers through the Nahel bond. IMO, that makes Renarin a Surgebinder. A Nahel-bonded voidspren can process Stormlight to Focus any power Cultivation wants it to, including foresight and healing.

My “Pathways to Power” post concludes all Shards use the same powers. Brandon says Shards differ only in ”the means of getting powers,” the “WAY the magic is obtained.” Surgebinders IMO gain magic through the Cognitive Connection of the Nahel bond, which Renarin and Glys share.

I believe Cultivation wanted Renarin to have foresight. Renarin’s name implies his uniqueness: “Like one who was born unto himself.” (OB, Chapter 52, Kindle p. 515.) Cultivation needs a voidspren to provide foresight because humans personify foresight as “of Odium.”

In presenting my interpretation of Glys and Renarin, I don’t mean to impugn other interpretations. All are valid, but none rise to the level of “cosmere fact.” @Calderis, if you look again at my last post in our prior conversation, you’ll see I do account for your “context” when I disagree with you about Renarin’s Voidbinding. As I said there, you may be right, but there is ample room for other views.

I do think Sja-Anat is capable of corrupting Radiant spren, and she may have corrupted them in the past. It’s possible, though, Cultivation caused the earlier “corruption.” I believe Glys may be part of a far-reaching plan Cultivation’s long-considered.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Confused

[Zelly]

I think the idea of a spren being able to dual wield shard abilities (of Honor and Odium) is neat and plausible.  Reminds me slightly of Venli's situation at the end of OB, where her voidspren gives her her form, but she's also bonded Timbre and has potential surgebinding.

I've also previously thought that Sja-Anat might have some connection with Cultivation and/or the Nightwatcher, due to the similarity of their abilities and her "mother" aspect.

[Calderis he/him]

The sequence of events is plausible. I could definitely see Cultivation doing this. 

My issue remains with your idea of the way the powers work. From the evidence available, I believe that that the magic systems are separate, and the WoB on access only refers to the individual magic systems themselves, and not that all magic systems are capable of the same things. 

[Yata he/him]

In theory I could see Glys' life in the opposite order (created as voidspren by Sja-Anat and later corrupted by Cultivation) but I see it a bit unlikely.

First of all we don't know if the Unmade are able to craft new Spren, it's likely they could but for how the Spren's birth work I see unlikely they actually do it.

Regardless from that the Resulting spren would be a mostly Voidspren with "some of Cultivation" in it....And Glys seems the opposite, a mostly Radiant Spren with some Voidish Influence....But this is high speculative.

Lastly I wanted to make a note, if your idea is right. Glys is a Spren without Honor in him. Not a pro or a contro, it's simply interesting.

By the way, I disagree with your idea of Sja-Anad not be able to corrupt a Radiant Spren, to me she could.

[Confused]

Hi, @Yata! Finally getting back to you. Thanks for your patience. I assume in this post that spren are Roshar’s Focus. I know some disagree, but I don’t want to debate that here.

I think Cultivation “prunes” Sja-anat to give her free will: “A CAREFUL EXCISION TO LET YOU GROW,” as she explains pruning to Dalinar. (OB, Chapter 114, p. 1079.) I believe Cultivation keeps the bit of Sja-anat she cuts away – Glys – since Cultivation also keeps what she prunes from Dalinar: “IT WILL DO ME WELL TO HAVE A PART OF YOU.”

Cultivation IMO then transforms Glys into a Nahel-bondable voidspren who Focuses foresight and healing. Cultivation grafts her Investiture onto Glys (the opposite of pruning) to make this happen. This commingling of Investiture causes his red color.

[QUESTION: How come mixed Honor and Cultivation Investiture in Radiant spren doesn’t turn them red? Has Brandon answered this yet?]

Ivory identifies Glys as a voidspren: “That is a spren of Odium, Ivory said. Corrupted spren.” (OB, Chapter 116, p. 1098, bold added.) IOW, Glys is mostly of Odium. Cultivation IMO “corrupts” Glys when she transforms him.

Cultivation tells Dalinar, “I CONTROL ALL THINGS THAT CAN BE GROWN, NURTURED. THAT INCLUDES THE THORNS.” (OB, Chapter 114, p. 1079.) I read this to mean Cultivation controls all life including all spren. The “thorns” IMO are the sharp-edged lifeforms – dangerous creatures like Dalinar. I believe voidspren are also “thorns” that Cultivation controls. That’s why she can prune Sja-anat and transform Glys.

Spren IMO Focus the powers of the Shard whose Investiture composes the spren. This resembles the Allomantic use of atium (Preservation’s magic system) to access Ruin’s power. Voidspren Focus Odium; and Radiant spren Focus Honor and/or Cultivation (until Glys).

Glys does not hold Honor’s Investiture, and I don’t believe he needs to. Surgebinding to me has two magical components: the Radiant spren and the Nahel bond. I think Radiant spren Focus power, and the Nahel bond gives the Surgebinder control of the Focused power. Glys doesn’t need Honor to Focus foresight and healing; and Surgebinding doesn’t need spren holding Honor’s Investiture unless they Focus Honor’s power.

FWIW, I believe honorspren are 100% Honor, contrary to a recent Discord discussion. Captain Notum says Honor created honorspren but then delegated that duty to the Stormfather. Post-Recreance, the Stormfather made only ten more honorspren. These ten, according to Notum, “created” other honorspren. Syl is the only Stormfather-created honorspren to survive the Recreance. Unless Honor and the Stormfather could create honorspren made from Investiture not their own, then all honorspren are 100% Honor.

Finally, the OP says, “I do think Sja-anat is capable of corrupting Radiant spren, and she may have corrupted them in the past.” Pre-OB I wrote fear of Radiant spren corruption was the true reason for the Recreance. I still believe that, which is one reason (among many) I discount the Eila Stele translation.

[Calderis he/him]

31 minutes ago, Confused said:

[QUESTION: How come mixed Honor and Cultivation Investiture in Radiant spren doesn’t turn them red? Has Brandon answered this yet?]

As far as I can tell, it's because the Spren developed naturally. The Nahel bond was not planned or designed. Naturally occurring spren mimicked the Honorblades to create the Radiants. 

I think the difference is that one the way in which something developed, and in the cause of the red varieties... Something that developed naturally was later altered with foreign investiture.