BasementDwellingRadiant Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 We've been told since the beginning that Odium is better than Honor at seeing the future, and seen evidence in Renarin. But... a question: Does this make sense? Does it make sense for the divine manifestation of passion and hate to be good at seeing the future? I know when I get emotional, I'm not all that good about thinking through the consequences of my actions. Why would one burdened with such - but on the scale of Gods - be so talented at doing so? On a side note... Has anyone else noticed that Odium is essentially a personification of the dark side of the force?
RShara she/her Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) I disagree that Odium is passion. I have to say that. But let's not debate it (agree to disagree, please don't start. Look at at you Leyrann ). But you're thinking of hatred as a hot firebrand type thing. Remember the saying that "Revenge is best served cold." Hatred can be, and often is, coldly calculated, planned and exacted. Think of someone who is completely devoured by their hatred of a person or object. The lengths and calculations and steps they will figure out and go through to resolve that hatred. Time, effort, money and emotion are all devoured by that hatred and the singular focus on that goal leaves no room for any other emotion, even anger. That's what I see Odium as. (And also one of the reasons I don't think he's Passion ) Edited February 20, 2018 by RShara 3
The One Who Connects he/him Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 (edited) 43 minutes ago, RShara said: And also one of the reasons I don't think he's Passion As one who no longer cares, I get to play devil's advocate all I want. Think of someone who is completely devoured by their passion for a project. The lengths and calculations and steps they will figure out and go through to achieve that goal. Time, effort, money and emotion are all devoured by that obsession and the singular focus on that goal leaves no room for any other emotion, even anger. But I agree with you that, regardless of which he ends up as, his future sight would always be better. 54 minutes ago, BasementDwellingRadiant said: Does it make sense for the divine manifestation of passion and hate to be good at seeing the future? Yes, actually. Hate =/= Anger/Rage If you want an example of rage, look no further than the Thrill, with anger as Thrill Lite. Rage clouds your mind, but hate clears your mind, and passion is no different. With rage, you can't think about much of anything because the anger distracts you, keeps you in the moment. With hate/passion, you can't think about much of anything else because you are too focused on a singular thing. The effect looks similar from the outside, but from a Realmatic perspective, it's very different. Ruin is rage in this example. His future-sight is bad because he can't maintain focus on anything. Preservation is hate/passion in the example. His future-sight is rather good because he has no distractions to divide his focus. Edited February 20, 2018 by The One Who Connects 1
RShara she/her Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said: As one who no longer cares, I get to play devil's advocate all I want. Think of someone who is completely devoured by their passion for a project. The lengths and calculations and steps they will figure out and go through to achieve that goal. Time, effort, money and emotion are all devoured by that obsession and the singular focus on that goal leaves no room for any other emotion, even anger. Don't make me hate you
Song she/her Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 I think there would be good reasons why Honour would be terrible at future sight. He would struggle to understand people who break there word or act in hate. Basically humans aren't very honourable so how does Honour plan for what he can't understand?
Carla Bridge Four Posted February 20, 2018 Posted February 20, 2018 I'm on the "I don't think Odium is Passion" side, but I do think it is such a clever lie. Because hate is such a strong passion. It's dark, damaging and awful, but certainly strong. So, if he pictured himself as passion at some point, the lie spread on and now even he's confused. Because everything he feels is hate, and it's a passionate one, so he truly thinks his intent could be Passion. 1
Willshaping Crasher Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 18 hours ago, Carla Bridge Four said: I'm on the "I don't think Odium is Passion" side, but I do think it is such a clever lie. Because hate is such a strong passion. It's dark, damaging and awful, but certainly strong. So, if he pictured himself as passion at some point, the lie spread on and now even he's confused. Because everything he feels is hate, and it's a passionate one, so he truly thinks his intent could be Passion. I agree for a slightly different reason. I still think we need to consider the original meaning of passion (suffering). Sanderson has a religious background and the use of passion in the archaic makes sense. Think "the passion of the Christ" and a lot of the use of term "passion" makes sense. Passion (Suffering), according to Moash is contained within voidlight. Rayse wants Dalinar to give him his pain. Pain + Time = Suffering. While this isn't necessarily "hatred", they are sometimes connected. Also, Rayse is not Odium. There is strong influence over time as Sanderson has stated, however the individual bearer of the shard can still act. This may be Rayse's personal influence on the situation and it comes out as suffering being the result of hatred. 1
Willshaping Crasher Posted February 21, 2018 Posted February 21, 2018 On 2/19/2018 at 4:11 PM, RShara said: Hatred can be, and often is, coldly calculated, planned and exacted. Think of someone who is completely devoured by their hatred of a person or object. The lengths and calculations and steps they will figure out and go through to resolve that hatred. Time, effort, money and emotion are all devoured by that hatred and the singular focus on that goal leaves no room for any other emotion, even anger. Agreed. Intense hatred is all that is really necessary. How many movies have been made about revenge? Sometimes several every year and they often involve sophisticated planning.
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