The listeners

[Passion he/him]

Was rereading the eshonai chapters and was shocked by how many things I missed. One thing that stood out is that eshonai clearly implies venly was already being manipulated by the unmade even before getting storm form. It's noted venly didn't seem to chafe much after getting storm form and also that venly couldn't have pos. Figured out stormform just from the fragmented listener songs alone.

 

one question I have is that the date of the parshendi escape from the unmade by transforming into full form is placed at centuries ago(I'm coming from the chapters where eshonai gets some details from her mother) but then it was long after the last desolation ended because that was millenniums ago... so they were controlled by unmadeway after desolation ended and were being destroyed still? That's strange

one more thing I noted is that eshonai doesn't know who gave them their songs bec before their escape they knew nothing of the forms of power and needed the unmade to transform so any one have any ideas who did teach them the songs and the little info they had(this is also from the same chapter as conversation with mom- I think)

 

p.s. I had assumed the whole time the parshendi didn't know Sezth was using an honorblade but noticed that when trying to assess how kaladin used his surges they note it can be an honorblade bec. Those are around and they themselves left one floating around the capital

Edited September 29, 2017 by Passion

[Yata he/him]

On 28/9/2017 at 9:48 AM, Passion said:

Was rereading the eshonai chapters and was shocked by how many things I missed. One thing that stood out is that eshonai clearly implies venly was already being manipulated by the unmade even before getting storm form. It's noted venly didn't seem to chafe much after getting storm form and also that venly couldn't have pos. Figured out stormform just from the fragmented listener songs alone.

Yeah the book seems to imply Venli is already attuned to Odium-ish attitude. This is a weird as also if it's possible Venli already tested the Stormform before proposing the "test" to Eshonai, she lefted that form to return to the Workform....But she retains her Odium-aligned attitude, while we see Eshonai be trapped inside herself.

The only way I could think the events went. It's Venli as already natural Odium-aligned and therefore the change to the Forms of Power left her almost herself (changed but free).

On 28/9/2017 at 9:48 AM, Passion said:

one question I have is that the date of the parshendi escape from the unmade by transforming into full form is placed at centuries ago(I'm coming from the chapters where eshonai gets some details from her mother) but then it was long after the last desolation ended because that was millenniums ago... so they were controlled by unmadeway after desolation ended and were being destroyed still? That's strange

We don't know, it have to be a really ancient time as the Parshmen are deeply radicated into Roshar's culture. At least Recreance's time if not still ancier.

On 28/9/2017 at 9:48 AM, Passion said:

one more thing I noted is that eshonai doesn't know who gave them their songs bec before their escape they knew nothing of the forms of power and needed the unmade to transform so any one have any ideas who did teach them the songs and the little info they had(this is also from the same chapter as conversation with mom- I think)

Probably the Unmade simply explained to them and they recorded in Songs to remember the istructions.

[Krandacth]

On 28/09/2017 at 8:48 AM, Passion said:

one more thing I noted is that eshonai doesn't know who gave them their songs bec before their escape they knew nothing of the forms of power and needed the unmade to transform so any one have any ideas who did teach them the songs and the little info they had(this is also from the same chapter as conversation with mom- I think)

As far as I could tell, most of the songs were originally composed by the first generation of the listeners who escaped their Gods. They were then added to/revised, and new songs composed by successive generations. There were some few others that are referenced by the songs we have examples of (e.g. "'Tis said it was warm in the land far away\\When Voidbringers entered our songs") from (I assume) between desolations, but they still seem to be composed by Listeners.

Also, the listeners are naturally symbiotic with Spren, being native to Roshar, so they would have had many of the more normal forms before. IIRC it is stated that most forms ended up being considered to be "given by the gods", but that was probably because the gods could pretty much force forms on the Listeners: any form their Gods made/let them have was "given" by them, even if it wasn't made by them; and after so long having forms dictated to them, they would likely struggle to return to the old ways.