Nature of the Cognitive Realm

[Chinsukolo]

So I've had this thought / view rattling around in my head for sometime and have been refining it as I reread books too.  For me it's a little bit of head canon that helps me process things I read and makes them fit together.  Arguably all I have is the same descriptions everyone else has and then some of my own brain storming on why, but anyways here goes.

The Cognitive Realm (CR) is a place of the "ideas" of the cosmere's sapient lifeforms.  The non-spren life forms with sapience such as humans and dragons, think about the things in the would around them and this forms in the cosmere as 'cognitive being' based on man's perception.   I.e. Human see's a stick, has thoughts about the stick, and ideas of what it can and can't do an where it came from.  All these thoughts related to that specific stick form the cognitive realms manifestation of the item.  - That's kind of my back ground understanding to how human perception/ideas lead to CR 'creations'.

Moving on to more of the actual theory portion:

I believe that the sphere's we see in Shadesmar (Roshar CR) are all individual ideas of an object in the physical realm (PR).  I think some people will say that's obvious maybe, but anyways.  I think this is demonstrated when the Soul Casting CR sections where Stick is it's own sphere, same with the goblet, and so on.  I'm of the opinion also that all items are separate, i.e. a chest on the boat was not 1 sphere, but 1 for the boat and a different one for the chest, even though the chest was "inside" the boat.  This is because 'man' see's them as different items despite being housed in one or another.

I think that the Shadesmar is a geographical opposite of Roshar because of the amount of ideas.  I.e. Land is a sea of spheres, and ocean is relatively solid but squishy.  This is because the land in the PR is full of physical objects all having their own idea/perception for 'man' so all needing a sphere.  Every blade of grass, every insect, all of it, it all adds up to a giant "ball pit" of ideas.  The ocean on the other hand is seen as 1 huge idea.  So it's much more solid because it's a single idea spread over a vast area.  Man still has ideas about fish and water plants, so those things still show up, but they show up as small sphere on a large firm squishy idea of an ocean.

I feel like this is supported also by Kelsier's experience in the Secret history, and explains why Scadrial's CR is different than Roshars.  That's because at the time Secret History happens, everything is dead and mostly covered in ash, so the humans of the region have significantly fewer idea/perceptions of the 'land" area so there are drastically less spheres.  This leads to "land" being one huge idea, just like the ocean, and it its spread out and firm but squishy.  Ash is an idea ll it's own and also spread over a huge area.  So the only areas that get deep or turn into ball pits are those few areas where lots of ideas/perceptions of the PR are condensed, everything else is relatively empty.

This same concept would also help explain the IRE and world hoppers abilities to move from planet to planet and why things are so "close" in the CR.  Because 'man' also sees "space" as 1 big huge idea that is empty minus the other planets.  So this to becomes "hard" walk-able area.  Since majority of 'man' doesn't realize the vastness of space, the equivalent area in the CR is also smaller, matching in size to the limited perception of spaces vastness.  (So basically if 'man' as a whole knew how fer things really were in space, I think everything between planets int he CR would be drastically farther, but cause the idea of vast difference is attached to the idea of space.  Since it's understood to be big, but not truly known how vast, the space is still large but but in reality much closer and usable for traveling then true space is, for now.)

So far this doesn't address spren, but i basically consider those to be idea spheres that receive a heavy investiture and/or have more significant PR cognitive force behind them.  I.e. Cryptics and Honor spren are more advanced in CR because in the PR humans devote a lot of thinking/cognition/emotion to that specific idea, more so than a stick receives, or a chull.  By that same thought though I do believe a CR sphere for a chull would be more 'advanced' than a stick if it was engaged in conversation by a soul caster.  Basically your CR level of sentience is directly related to the amount of PR cognitive force/thinking done my sentient life in relation to that exact object or idea.  

I think that's it, sorry for the wall of text.

 

 

TL:DR

1) Every PR object that is 'thought about' by a PR sentient being is an idea sphere in the CR.

2) PR areas with more objects perceived/thought about by humans = more idea spheres.

3) Large areas int he PR perceived as single thing (ocean) are a single sphere but spread out over more CR space in direct relation to how big it is perceived by sentient life.  (Ocean is huge, so 1 huge spread out idea.)

3) Idea sphere's are physically firm to slightly squishy in the CR.  This allows you to "walk" across the idea of the ocean.

4) Land on Roshar is a "ball pit" of idea spheres, so deep you can drowned because sentient life is aware of every stick, blade of grass, etc, so they all get to be an idea sphere. 

5) Land on Scadrial during Secret History is firm and walk-able because humans only perceive, "land" and "ash" in most places, so in the CR it responds like the idea of the "ocean"

6) More PR thought or cognition about an idea = more CR sentience for the idea.  I.e. A rock or a stick is quite dumb compared to Chull or a Boat.

6a) CR idea sphere's with enough Sentience either were invested by Honor/Cultivation, or reached a 'critical mass' that attracted enough Investiture that they became spren. 

[SylphrenaHonorSpren]

I really like this idea. It kind of gels with what we know of the Cognitive Realm thanks to The Emperor's Soul. Things are convinced that they are what they are until they are manipulated to think otherwise. It's easy enough for a stick to become fire (unless it's a particularly stubborn stick) because it's small. The ocean, on the other hand, is massive and to convince the ocean that it is something else would be a massive task. We'll definitely have to see more of the Cognitive Realm to be certain, though.

 

[Calderis he/him]

@Chinsukolo I think you are exactly right,but only for Shadesmar, the specific section of the Cognitive Realm that represents Roshar.

The Cognitive Realm for every world presents itself differently. The form of the mists on Scadrial is the way it manifests there. In a city like Luthadel, with as large of a population as exists there, and as many trade goods and clothing items and food and coins, etc, etc... If all of that presented itself as spheres, we'd have seen more than enough to make a sea at least around the city. The mists are how Scadrial's Cognitive Realm manifests. The most interesting part of this to me is the question of how Soulcasting would work on Scadrial. 

As far as space is concerned... I think it's more that once there is something that exists physically and has been observed and thought about it extends a bubble of Cognitive reality around it. So a world has a Cognitive presence, visible celestial bodies would as well, but the absence of anything existing becomes, not a void as in the physical, but an actual absence. There is still space between worlds because of the Cognitive bubbles that are manifested by the sky and clouds and celestial bodies between worlds. 

Lot of my opinion in there obviously as none of this is confirmed, but like I said said, limit your interpretation to Roshar and I totally agree. 

[Chinsukolo]

11 minutes ago, Calderis said:

The Cognitive Realm for every world presents itself differently. The form of the mists on Scadrial is the way it manifests there. In a city like Luthadel, with as large of a population as exists there, and as many trade goods and clothing items and food and coins, etc, etc... If all of that presented itself as spheres, we'd have seen more than enough to make a sea at least around the city. The mists are how Scadrial's Cognitive Realm manifests. The most interesting part of this to me is the question of how Soulcasting would work on Scadrial. 

Good point! I forgot that because I was thinking of the part where he is out over the Ocean heading towards the IRE.

 

13 minutes ago, Calderis said:

As far as space is concerned... I think it's more that once there is something that exists physically and has been observed and thought about it extends a bubble of Cognitive reality around it. So a world has a Cognitive presence, visible celestial bodies would as well, but the absence of anything existing becomes, not a void as in the physical, but an actual absence. There is still space between worlds because of the Cognitive bubbles that are manifested by the sky and clouds and celestial bodies between worlds. 

I can support that, and that actual "absence" would mean the cognitive boards are touching which still allows world-hopping. So I think the outcome would be the same.  The onlt time i think a difference would appear in the CR between the two ideas is when Space travel starts.  If it stays more condensed and close together (so absence) vs the space between CR areas expands (so idea based).

 

What is your opinion on the spren subtheory that it's some type of critical mass, or at least enough CR sentience to attract Investiture?

[Calderis he/him]

9 minutes ago, Chinsukolo said:

What is your opinion on the spren subtheory that it's some type of critical mass, or at least enough CR sentience to attract Investiture?

I think I agree with you, but I would word it a bit differently. I don't think that they would start as a sphere exactly, but as a non physical concept/idea is thought about, it will gain a manifestation in the Cognitive Realm composed of investiture. The more thought dedicated, and more importantly the more complex that concept/idea, the more complex the entity becomes resulting in a more complex and sapient entity in the Cognitive. So for a simple emotional concept like hunger or pain you end up with a more animalistic spren. For a complex idea like Honor you end up with something like Syl. 

[Chinsukolo]

4 minutes ago, Calderis said:

I think I agree with you, but I would word it a bit differently. I don't think that they would start as a sphere exactly, but as a non physical concept/idea is thought about, it will gain a manifestation in the Cognitive Realm composed of investiture. The more thought dedicated, and more importantly the more complex that concept/idea, the more complex the entity becomes resulting in a more complex and sapient entity in the Cognitive. So for a simple emotional concept like hunger or pain you end up with a more animalistic spren. For a complex idea like Honor you end up with something like Syl. 

Reading through the question section and someone asked about Shardblades cutting in the spirit realm, and that reminded me that most investiture (not Selish) resides there.

It occurred to me to expand on your description to suggest maybe it's ideas that develop spiritual "concepts' that becomes spren.  "Fear of god", "Spiritual Hunger" "Joy of creation"  Stick's have no need of a Spiritual component (except maybe Stick!), same for a boat, so maybe the missing "spiritual concept" is why we don't have boat spren.