Shard Total

[Zas678 he/him]

I don't think that there needs to be more than one. And I think Ruin meant that Ruin can't create, and neither can Preservation, because it is too different from what the shards are. However, a shard like Endowment could create life by "endowing" cells with movement, fishes with legs, and monkeys with brains. Or something like that.

EDIT-

Hey, I totally missed there was another page! I can read.

[Andrew the Great he/him]

That's what I was trying to get at earlier. On that note, however, it doesn't seem particularly likely that Odium would be able to create all that much, although I suppose Odium is not as much of a complete opposite to Creation as Ruin was, so He may be able to create some things as long as they're related to hate and bitterness. What a depressing existence.

Although I have to say, it's interesting to think that Odium probably created the Voidbringers, and yet the Parshendi, our only current candidates for Voidbringers (along with parshmen and chasmfiends, of course) seem to act with more honor than most men. They don't seem to be creatures of hate, particularly. Though, I suppose Odium could have created them based on his hatred of other things, and had them come out semi-normalish. Now I'm just rambling again. I do that.

Apparently the Almighty could create, and I have to wonder if Cultivation didn't play a major role in the development of Roshar. Seems like a handy Shard to have around when you're trying to get a group of people to grow and flourish.

[Zas678 he/him]

Hmm. Do we know that Odium is Rayse? It makes sense, but is it said anywhere? No, never mind, the epigraphs in part 2 say that Rayse has the worst shard, and Odium is pretty bad.

PS- I just realized Odium is a word. Who knew?

[Andrew the Great he/him]

I did, but only after I realized that the rest of the shard names were words as well, and googled Odium.

We aren't explicitly told anywhere that Rayse is Odium. Chaos in particular seems to rather avidly believe this. It makes a lot of sense, and I think it's the most likely possibility, but it's possible that Odium is in fact a different shard from the one Rayse inherited. In fact, if Bavadin possessed Odium, that would make things really interesting, as it would mean that Rayse is still out there with a worse shard than Odium.

[Chaos he/him]

PS- I just realized Odium is a word. Who knew?

Took me a while with that, too. I thought Odium was the person who held the Shard, because I had no idea it was actually a word. It means Hatred, essentially. I'm quite afraid.

I did, but only after I realized that the rest of the shard names were words as well, and googled Odium.

We aren't explicitly told anywhere that Rayse is Odium. Chaos in particular seems to rather avidly believe this. It makes a lot of sense, and I think it's the most likely possibility, but it's possible that Odium is in fact a different shard from the one Rayse inherited. In fact, if Bavadin possessed Odium, that would make things really interesting, as it would mean that Rayse is still out there with a worse shard than Odium.

Well, the discrepancy comes from the Shards not remembering their name, as I explained here http://www.17thshard.com/forum/index.php/topic,73.0.html The person who wrote the missive and its recipient, however, do know their names.

I, however, am quite certain that Rayse holds Odium.

[Ryan he/him]

If Shardholders don't remember their names, what does Sazed call himself? Preseruin?

[Andrew the Great he/him]

God.

Or if you insist on something more shard based, I'm more inclined to Ruination myself.

[Chaos he/him]

They would forget their name after a very long time due to the Shard's mental influence. Thousands of years.

[Andrew the Great he/him]

Well yeah. That's kind of the point of this conversation. What will Sazed refer to himself as, though? Or will he just say, "I'm Ruin and Preservation."

We're not necessarily talking about right now. This is on a long term basis. After all, we get some Mistborn books set quite a ways ahead....

[HardcorePooka he/him]

Well yeah. That's kind of the point of this conversation. What will Sazed refer to himself as, though? Or will he just say, "I'm Ruin and Preservation."

We're not necessarily talking about right now. This is on a long term basis. After all, we get some Mistborn books set quite a ways ahead....

I honestly think he would come up with a new name for himself. The combination of Ruin & Preservation... to tear down/destroy and to protect at the same time? I'm not even sure if there is a word for that... also... would containing two Shards protect Sazed from the loss of self that other Shard holders experience? Would the "battle" between the very natures of the two Shards he holds keep his sense of self intact?

[Andrew the Great he/him]

A thread on TWG discussing this issue.

Chaos came through and provided a quote to answer.

Q: Will Sazed eventually go mad trying to hold two Shard's power at the same time (being pushed to two different Purposes simultaneously for millennia)? Why hasn't anyone else tried this trick before in the Cosmere?

ANSWER: No.  Since they're so opposite they work together to create a whole.  However, after a LONG time it would change him as a person.

As to what he'd call himself, we really have no idea. Hence the idle speculation on the matter.

[Dryone]

Sazed's name should be obvious: Hero of Ages.

It says so in the first line of Mistborn: FE

[Earendil]

So, when I mentioned this in the "Forum suggestions" board, Chaos shot me down, but I actually think it's kind of interesting.  For a pantheon of "functionally immortal" demigods, we've been knocking them down really fast.

We know there are a total of 16 shards.  Of those, we know between 8 and 10 (probably 9--I agree with Chaos' logic totally there).  Now let's talk about what's happened to those we know about, though.

1. Leras (Preservation) - died giving Elend hope.

2. Ati (Ruin) - dead, killed by Vin

3. Aona - dead, killed by Rayse.  Shard has been destroyed

4. Skai - dead, killed by Rayse.  Shard has been destroyed

5. The Almighty (name and shard title unknown) - tells Dalinar that Rayse killed him (I'm inclined to believe)

6. Cultivation - presumed dead (where three of sixteen ruled, now the Broken One reigns)

That leaves us with:

1. Rayse, a jerk who holds the very worst shard

2. Bavadin (assuming Bavadin isn't Cultivation) - someone who's supporting Rayse

3. Endowment - hooray! We've got one (known) surviving kindly shard!

Add to this that Rayse better be neutralized by the end of the Stormlight Archive, and suddenly shards seem a lot less impressive, since we'll have killed off almost half of the pantheon...kind of depressing.

[Emeralis00 she/her]

I wonder what the other shards are doing at this point?

[Chaos he/him]

I wonder what the other shards are doing at this point?

Chilling on different planets?

[Zas678 he/him]

Well I suppose part of them all being knocked down is that when they die, that causes drastic changes in the world. Drastic changes in the world are a lot more interesting to read about (generally) than the same-old-same-old. Remember that Ruin and Preservation ruled for thousands and thousands of years before dying.

[KChan she/her]

And seemed to have very little sense of self (or even any form of cognition, in Preservation's case) by the end. Perhaps it's the nature of the Shards themselves that it's good to get a new Shardholder every few millennia or so.

[Andrew the Great he/him]

Preservation's kind of a unique case, though, as he sacrificed a large portion of himself to imprison ruin, and had to give part of himself in creating humanity as well. Although admittedly, Ruin had become, well....ruinous.

As to what the other shards are doing, I imagine the same thing all the other shards except Rayse we've seen running around - let's just hop to this planet and act as God for a while.....