Radiant Returned he/him Posted July 20, 2016 Posted July 20, 2016 We know that the final Mistborn Era trilogy will be a space opera story, presumably with a lot of Cosmere connections and answers and a finale to the Shard situation. My worry though is how far behind technology wise Scadrial may be from other planets. In Era 1 of Mistborn, during SH, we can assume that at least three other planets have far surpassed Scadrial in technology and Cosmere awareness: Sel - The Elantrians have a firm understanding of Realmatic Theory and world hopping since they have the technology to not only establish a base "between worlds" but also because they have magic that could have been used to allow them to take over Preservation's power. Threnody - The Elantrians worry that the Threnodites have infiltrated their base (actually Kelsier), so while the Threnodites are innocent here, this suggests that they and the Elantrians have not only made contact, but that the Threnodites have technology/cosmere awareness similar to Sel. Nazh is also from Threnody and is traveling with Khriss. Taldain - This is where Khriss is from, and she does/says several things that suggest Taldain is very Cosmere aware. She points a gun at Kelsier, which means that she either took this weapon from some other planet that has said technology, or guns are common on her home planet. She also mentions to Kelsier that she has been exiled, which could indicate that the Taldainians are cosmere aware enough to know there are other worlds and have told her not to return to theirs. Mistborn Era 2 takes place 300 years after Era 1, and is chronologically around the same time as SA. So while Scadrial has now surpassed Roshar in technology, and they have advanced to gun-level technology, they are still only marginally cosmere-aware and the planets mentioned above have also had a further 300 years to develop. My concern is, by Era 4 will Scadrial still be miles behind other major players in the universe?
CaptainRyan he/him Posted July 20, 2016 Posted July 20, 2016 1 hour ago, Radiant Returned said: Sel - The Elantrians have a firm understanding of Realmatic Theory and world hopping since they have the technology to not only establish a base "between worlds" but also because they have magic that could have been used to allow them to take over Preservation's power. The IRE are a bit of an enigma as we are not sure where they fall in the Elantris timeline. If they are pre-Reod Elantrians who became stuck in the CR after the shattering of Devotion/Dominion then they might have some serious Cosmere-awareness but be relatively isolated from Sel. During Elantris itself we saw that most of the older, and more powerful, Elantrians died during the Reod so Elantris has definitely taken a hit in their Cosmere growth. Otoh, Elantris is one of the first books in the Cosmere timeline so they also have had some time to advance. Otooh (on the other other hand), we have a WoB that worldhopping from Sel is hard as all get out haha so they can also affect their growth. 1 hour ago, Radiant Returned said: Threnody - The Elantrians worry that the Threnodites have infiltrated their base (actually Kelsier), so while the Threnodites are innocent here, this suggests that they and the Elantrians have not only made contact, but that the Threnodites have technology/cosmere awareness similar to Sel. Nazh is also from Threnody and is traveling with Khriss. Threnody is another special case I think. Threnody does not, currently, have a Shard on it so that limits the planet in some ways. Also, I think the IRE worry about Threnody because the shades (which are some form of a deadly Cognitive Shadow) can roam somewhat. I do not think the actual populace of Threnody have much in the way of Cosmere-awareness. Nazh may be the only Threnody world-hopper or one of a small group. 1 hour ago, Radiant Returned said: Taldain - This is where Khriss is from, and she does/says several things that suggest Taldain is very Cosmere aware. She points a gun at Kelsier, which means that she either took this weapon from some other planet that has said technology, or guns are common on her home planet. She also mentions to Kelsier that she has been exiled, which could indicate that the Taldainians are cosmere aware enough to know there are other worlds and have told her not to return to theirs. Khriss herself is arguably top 3 for most "Cosmere-aware" person in the Cosmere haha. She does not, however and as far as I know, reflect the general situation on Taldain. In fact, Taldain might be somewhat inaccessible and this is what Khriss means by being exiled. She is also a part of/has worked with the 17th Shard (the in-Cosmere group, not us haha) and is therefore very, very Cosmere-aware. If you read White Sands (the graphic novel though I assume the info is in the prose as well) then you will know that: Spoiler the Darksiders have guns. White Sands also seems to occur somewhat early on in the Cosmere timeline so it is possible that they have time to "tech up". Anywho, despite what I wrote above I think you do have cause to worry. I know Sanderson has said he does not plan on "balancing" the Cosmere as if it were an RPG so there is a real possibility of civilizations being left behind. Sixth of Dusk gives us a great example of Spoiler a low-tech society being exploited by a high-tech society and they are being "relatively" friendly. Who knows what would happen if a group like Derethi gained tech-superiority over other worlds. *shudder* I am very interested to see how Sanderson handles the Cosmere coming together! Only another 15-20 years and we should have our first look! 1
Oversleep Posted July 20, 2016 Posted July 20, 2016 Well, that's what Scadrial gets for having such two Shards - one is hell bent on destructing the world and the other is opposed to any change. Before Deepness they were pretty advanced (they had at least trains IIRC) but then Deepness came, world almost ended and then Rashek conquered most of the Northern hemisphere, destroying most of the advancements and repressing any technological growth. Then the world almost ended again and... well, there is a whole thread about whether advancements since Catacendre were fast or not. So Scadrial lost at least a 1000 years (or more, as they had to start from scratch after Catacendre) of advancement. Roshar was multiple (vorinism says there were 100 Desolations but we don't know whether it's accurate) times pushed down to stone age (or even more) with Desolations... and Desolations killed 90% of population. Yikes. I can't imagine how far they would been have advanced by now if there was no Odium. Now I'm getting the hell out of here as I just realized that this is Secret History subforum and I haven't read that yet. 1
CaptainRyan he/him Posted July 20, 2016 Posted July 20, 2016 12 minutes ago, Oversleep said: Now I'm getting the hell out of here as I just realized that this is Secret History subforum and I haven't read that yet. GET OUT! GET OUT @Oversleep AND DON'T LOOK BACK! Also, good points about Scadrial and Roshar. Sel had the Reod which hampered some things but definitely not on the same scale as the Lord Ruler/Catacendre or the Desolations.
Oversleep Posted July 20, 2016 Posted July 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, CaptainRyan said: GET OUT! GET OUT @Oversleep AND DON'T LOOK BACK! Also, good points about Scadrial and Roshar. Sel had the Reod which hampered some things but definitely not on the same scale as the Lord Ruler/Catacendre or the Desolations. I already know a ton of spoilers from SH Unfortunately. (I think I'll buy the ebook since in Poland it was pushed from November to January and I already know too much from SH) I'm really curious about Elantris sequel to know what level of advancement Elantrians are on. Reod lasted 10 years, that's not much... they still have the libraries but IIRC some of the Elantrians died and some might have gone insane, but I hope they'll be alright generally. I really want some advanced magic from Realmatically aware users. (Ire doesn't count)
Yata he/him Posted July 21, 2016 Posted July 21, 2016 (edited) 8 hours ago, Oversleep said: I already know a ton of spoilers from SH Unfortunately. (I think I'll buy the ebook since in Poland it was pushed from November to January and I already know too much from SH) I'm really curious about Elantris sequel to know what level of advancement Elantrians are on. Reod lasted 10 years, that's not much... they still have the libraries but IIRC some of the Elantrians died and some might have gone insane, but I hope they'll be alright generally. I really want some advanced magic from Realmatically aware users. (Ire doesn't count) I don't know how fast they may recover knowledge, as far as I know there isn't much Libraries untouched like the Galladon's one. But with a large Magic Users base, it's possible through experimentation to develop fast new Magic knowledges (If I don't remember wrong Elantris 2 is about 10 years after Elantris 1 therefore they have probably grow Sapient but not too much) PS: I know how you feel, I gived up to wait the Cosmere's books in my own Language. I began to read them in English to avoid being too far back here on the forum (Here Sanderson fan are still waiting Shadow of Self ) Edited July 21, 2016 by Yata
Thunder_93 Posted July 21, 2016 Posted July 21, 2016 Same here, as I normaly read books on german, I started to read Sandersons books on english as well (for german, they're also waiting for Shadow of Self). Other question... Oversleep said, that before the deepness, Scadrial had at least trains... Where do you know that from? I don't think that was mentioned in a book, was it? And about the technical advancement on Scadrial: I honestly think, for only 300 years, they got pretty far... guns, cars, electricity... all not bad, if you look what they had before. Plus, the Southerns of Scadrial are maybe from the "normal" technology not as advanced, but surely are regarding to Allomancy and Feruchemy. It's probably not as spread as in the North, but it seems like they understand it much better (thanks to Kelsier). Also, they're really far using that to enhance their technology. And how I imagine it so far: As Sanderson said in the end of the Mistborn series, they're going to spacetravel, I guess this is going to be like Science Fiction, not with worldhopping. So, they won't really need worldhopping, and I'm sure once they come together with people of other planets, they'll quickly get really cosmere-aware
Oversleep Posted July 21, 2016 Posted July 21, 2016 15 hours ago, Thunder_93 said: Oversleep said, that before the deepness, Scadrial had at least trains... Where do you know that from? I don't think that was mentioned in a book, was it? A WoB about classic Scadrial (not sure about the term. Try searching for before Deepness or something like that). 16 hours ago, Yata said: I don't know how fast they may recover knowledge, as far as I know there isn't much Libraries untouched like the Galladon's one. There was this library which was hidden (one of the Hoed revealed it). The one with the more basic level books. Okay, I'm really pulling out of this thread so you can discuss properly without looking out for me not to get spoiled. So I have request: don't tag me here more, and if you want to reply to something I said, PM me. If you can, try avoiding quoting me as I get notifications for being quoted See you when I read SH!
Argel he/him Posted July 28, 2016 Posted July 28, 2016 On 7/20/2016 at 4:23 PM, CaptainRyan said: Khriss herself is arguably top 3 for most "Cosmere-aware" person in the Cosmere haha There is a WoB that Khriss knows the most about the Cosmere, even more than Hoid, out of all the worldhoppers. Likely because she's the scholar and thus focused on learning/understanding.
asterion137 he/him Posted July 28, 2016 Posted July 28, 2016 wait since when did pre deepness Scadrial have trains? That seems a little off since its roughly the same tech as a primitive car and a civilization with cars shouldn't have had any trouble with koloss. Also, how could they have had trains but not gunpowder? Gunpowder seems a lot less advanced than a train
RenegadeShroom Posted July 28, 2016 Posted July 28, 2016 Classical Scadrial didn't have trains, but they were close to having them. They had steam technology, and Rashek had sufficient knowledge of gunpowder to repress that technology so that he could maintain better control over the Final Empire, as mentioned in the Hero of Ages epigraphs, I believe. Quote BRANDON: They had steam technology, and were just about to hit the railroad era. Something near early 1800s in our world.
Oversleep Posted July 28, 2016 Posted July 28, 2016 13 hours ago, InsurrectionistFungus said: Classical Scadrial didn't have trains, but they were close to having them. They had steam technology, and Rashek had sufficient knowledge of gunpowder to repress that technology so that he could maintain better control over the Final Empire, as mentioned in the Hero of Ages epigraphs, I believe. Oh, so I mixed it up a little.
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