natc Posted February 29, 2016 Posted February 29, 2016 To be fair, the one directed at Siri is technically true. His lightweaving, as far as we know, is not self-taught but learned from his old master (a man named Hoid, our Hoid is not named Hoid and merely uses that name as an alias frequently). Though technically he already lies about his entire background and even his own name when he pops up somewhere.
nervousnerd he/him Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 Yeah. He either lies enough that nobody believes him when he tells the truth or vice versa.My problem with Hoid is that he is the only character who we have seen since the beginning. We haven't seen a lot of who he really is but we have seen a lot of what he has done. I'm not sure if I would like it to find out that he is not someone we should have been rooting for this whole time. He may say that he would let worlds burn in order to see his goals complete but his actions thus far have not shown this to be true. He has done things that may have seemed wrong on occasion but never really to the detriment of other people.I think the reason most people were surprised by his Secret Histories appearance is because this is the first time he appeared malicious physically (umm technically cognitively though) instread of verbally. 2
natc Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 He got Shai arrested and made off with her prize. I think that must've qualified as a detriment. 1
Landis963 he/him Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 (edited) I think the reason most people were surprised by his Secret Histories appearance is because this is the first time he appeared malicious physically (umm technically cognitively though) instread of verbally. This is mainly it, I'd say. We knew there were even odds of Hoid being less than squeaky clean, morally. We knew that ever since he warned Dalinar not to entirely trust him. Heck, as natc points out, we knew that back in TES when he helped Shai steal the Moon Scepter, and then left her holding the bag. But that's an astoundingly different context than kicking a man when he's down just because he can. Edited March 3, 2016 by Landis963 1
nervousnerd he/him Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 He got Shai arrested and made off with her prize. I think that must've qualified as a detriment. And she has every right to hate him for that but did he know the good that she would end up doing? Yes, she could have been executed but I can't see him actually believing that would happen and letting it just to get the Scepter. He isn't omnipotent but he really seems to know what he is doing and the consequences of it.
natc Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 Until the offer to forge a soul came in she was basically completely screwed, and it wasn't an easy job even then. Artificial intelligence is tough. Even then without having formed certain friendships things could've ended differently. Honestly I doubt Hoid would've cared what happened afterwards.
nervousnerd he/him Posted March 3, 2016 Posted March 3, 2016 And until we actually hear the story from his point of view it is impossible to say for sure. I can see why you believe that but I am not able to bring myself to agree. Perhaps I am the eternal optimist.That particular action may be the confirmation that he doesn't care who he hurts to achieve his goals but so far it seems like an outlier. That is why I think he knew Shai would get out alive.
thek9 he/him Posted March 7, 2016 Posted March 7, 2016 Rebuilding Adonalsium doesn't strike me as possible. The way it's talked about, Shattering seems to be a pretty permanent act. I doubt anyone could ever reassemble Devotion, Dominion, and Honor, no matter how hard they tried. Another idea I had was that Hoid might actually be trying to shatter all the Shards to make the Cosmere completely devoid of gods, believing the idea of higher beings to be intrinsically wrong or something. That would explain why he would help shatter Adonalsium yet would be on the bad side of several people at this point. WoB is that shardic power could be reconstituted. By implication, this would include Adonalsium itself. ChaosIs Splintering a Shard permanent? Brandon SandersonNo. http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=977#3 Mason WheelerYou've said that Splintering a shard is essentially the same thing as the shattering of Adonalsium, repeated on a smaller scale. Brandon SandersonYeah. Mason WheelerAnd a while ago, someone asked you if Splintering was permanent or reversible, and you said that it can be reversed. Brandon SandersonYeah. http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=948#2
holyground Posted March 14, 2016 Posted March 14, 2016 Just finished SH this weekend. Here's my thought: He's not breaking the rule that he can "hurt" people, because he's not hurting Kelsier. It's just like the matrix: Kel thinks what's happening to him should hurt, so it does. Hoid didn't hurt Kel, Kel is hurting himself.
Landis963 he/him Posted March 14, 2016 Posted March 14, 2016 Just finished SH this weekend. Here's my thought: He's not breaking the rule that he can "hurt" people, because he's not hurting Kelsier. It's just like the matrix: Kel thinks what's happening to him should hurt, so it does. Hoid didn't hurt Kel, Kel is hurting himself. And Hoid is gleefully exploiting that loophole for all its worth. And really, was stomping on Kel's shin like that necessary?
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