It's Been Cultivation All Along, a theory

[Gelatinous Hypercube]

I have not seen widespread discussion of this and would love to see any information I may have missed that debunks or supports it. 

 

Since the release of Wind and Truth and her flight from the Rosharan system, I have seen a fair bit of Cultivation disregard and disrespect, which I feel is exactly the interpretation of her actions that she wanted outside observers to come away with.

It looks like she lost, but I think that the situation we see at the end of Wind and Truth is the best possible outcome for Cultivation, and is also the result of a conspiracy between herself and Endowment that has stretched over much of the Cosmere's publication-focused timeline. This conspiracy is the driving force behind the creation of the entire Cosmere-wide war that we see in later books.

Cultivation is now free of the Rosharan system, no longer tied to it but also leaving behind powerful actors and parts of herself that Retribution is ignorant of. She has been playing Taravangian since she first gave him his boon, and continued to use him for her own ends even after he took up Odium.

The Tower is now active, and is the only Investiture alternative to Retribution on Roshar. In terms of how Cultivation's Investiture and influence are spread, she is in close to the same situation as at the start of Wind and Truth - the largest difference is that she is now free to travel elsewhere and everyone else now has to deal with Odium/Retribution instead of it being just her and the cognitive shadow of her partner. She finally gets to see him put to rest fully as well.

The shard Honor itself is now growing and changing due to Dalinar's actions. The entirety of the Cosmere has been shaken from its static existence and is now forced to grow and respond to Retribution. Everyone else can no longer ignore Roshar and continue as they have been, and this eventually leads to the war between Roshar and Scadrial. If Odium had remained trapped on Roshar, the universe as a whole would not have changed.

 

Cultivation's powers and actions

We have seen that both Honor and Moelach were able to correctly predict the coming of the Night of Sorrows. We hear from a Tanavast POV chapter that Cultivation has better future sight than him, and that she likes to work from the shadows and cover her actions with misdirection, utilizing plans within plans. It is extremely reasonable to think that Cultivation also would have been able to see the coming of the Night of Sorrows we see at the end of Wind and Truth.

Cultivation gave her boons to 3 individuals. 

Dalinar and Taravangian were necessary for Retribution to be created. Taravangian also used Cultivation's boon to bring Szeth into the picture, the man who killed Rayse.

The third individual, Lift, is now the only Radiant in the system who is not aligned with Retribution and who has free access to Investiture. If Soulcast metal can be used to power Allomancy, it makes sense to me that food from anywhere would allow Lift to generate Lifelight. She is not tied to the Rosharan system. She is the only person we know of who is so heavily Invested by Cultivation. Brandon has stated that he is preparing her to be a major player in later Cosmere books. 

 

Endowment's powers and actions

Endowment gives Divine Breath to Returned, influencing the course of actions on her planet hundreds of years ahead of time. She's also big on planning ahead and making convoluted moves through others who don't know what they are doing on her behalf.

One of them is eventually sent back and named Warbreaker. We know from WoBs that his purpose is yet to be fulfilled. 

His name is Warbreaker. Retribution's light is Warlight. He still has a war to break. The largest war we've seen in the Cosmere is probably coming, and one side literally has the name War for their investiture.

From a WoB, she was involved in the creation of Nightblood more than normal, but likely not directly. This is the sword that would go on to kill Rayse and be necessary for the ascension of Retribution.

Endowment states to Hoid in a letter that she has plans to deal with Odium.

Other parts of the conspiracy

At least some of the Five Scholars visited Roshar at some time prior to Warbreaker. This trip is what inspired Nightblood, who eventually would contribute to the creation of Retribution. 

The easiest Perpendicularity to travel through would have been Cultivation's, and the Unkalaki have stories about travelers utilizing it. We also know that Azure traveled through it while chasing Zahel, and if he used it successfully once it makes sense that's the one he would travel through his second time.

I am not completely sure on this part of the timeline, but if the Scholars visited after the Recreance then Odium's Perpendicularity would have been largely inaccessible and Honor's would have been constantly moving and hard to predict where you'd exit from or where to find it to return to Nalthis.

 

So,

All of the pieces that were necessary for Retribution to come about were created by Cultivation and Endowment, and there are indications that the people they have influence over have interacted in the past (and this was actually necessary for the creation of Retribution).

 

How Cultivation manipulated Taravangian, even after he took up the shard

She now likely has knowledge of a possible source of power over him or way to attack him: the fact that Kharbranth still exists. 

She WANTS him to be confident, she taught him that he should be confident in his planning and foresight when he is intelligent and touched by divinity.

Taravangian recognizes her strategy and what she wants done to improve the Cosmere, but doesn't realize that the last sentence can also describe her actions towards him.

Quote

“What do we do instead?” Cultivation said.

“You want me to say,” he whispered, “that we create systems—teachings, incentives—that encourage the right decisions. That we prevent war by building up societies where people choose peace. We prevent greed by nurturing governments where the greedy are held accountable. We take time, and we steer, but we do not dominate.”

“Yes.”

This quote is her trying to trick him into combining the shards into Retribution, leading him to believe it was the conclusion he came to himself. It also indicates that he is unaware that Cultivation and Sja-Anat set him up to take the power of Odium, and indicates that even as a god he is still being moved by her. It reinforces his belief in his own powers, but he completely misses that the powers he used to destroy his predecessor were actually HER power.

Quote

She held his eyes. He saw in them the depths of eternity, as he was sure she saw in his—for these forms they wore were but cloaks across a vast essence that was itself infinite.

“Not until what?” she demanded.

“Not until there is but one god,” Odium whispered.

“Do not go down this path. It destroyed your predecessor.”

“I destroyed my predecessor,” he said. “Leave me. I am finished with your ‘lessons.’ ”

Taravangian thought that it was his usage of the tools present (Szeth and Nightblood) that led to Rayse's death and his taking up the shard, but he didn't realize they were all Cultivation's tools.

The payoff

Investiture is being used and combined in completely new and unique ways, and entire planets of people are now being connected to the wider Cosmere through the imperial policies of Roshar and Scadrial as they fight a cold (and possibly hot in places?) war across the universe. People and parts of Investiture itself are growing and changing in unexpected and fresh ways. Cultivation does not appear to be openly under attack or even understood as existing by most people involved in the war.

Endowment's arguably most successful chosen Invested person is now teaching Cultivation's chosen Invested person and we know that she will be a large part of the story in the future, however neither they nor their influence have been openly present in any future Cosmere novels so far. This seems like a reveal that would come out in a later Era and so Brandon is not touching on any of the systems or players in his later Era novels at the moment.

[Nitpicking]

38 minutes ago, Gelatinous Hypercube said:

The Tower is now active, and is the only Investiture alternative to Retribution on Roshar ...

Except the Nightwatcher, Cultivation's "daughter". I would be amazed if the Nightwatcher can't give Lifelight to Radiants, should she decide to. The re-creation of the Heralds protected the spren, including the Nightwatcher.

And except for Ba-Ado-Mishram, but she's currently in the Cognitive Realm (as far as we know).

 

Quote

The third individual, Lift, is now the only Radiant in the system who is not aligned with Retribution and who has free access to Investiture.

Technicality, but at least two Heralds are Fifth Ideal Radiants, who have access to unlimited Stormlight even though Stormlight doesn't exist. We know that Towerlight still works, and that's half Stormlight.

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

40 minutes ago, Nitpicking said:

Technicality, but at least two Heralds are Fifth Ideal Radiants, who have access to unlimited Stormlight even though Stormlight doesn't exist. We know that Towerlight still works, and that's half Stormlight.

Where does it say 5th ideal radiants have infinite stormlight? I don’t remember that being said in books.

1 hour ago, Gelatinous Hypercube said:

Investiture is being used and combined in completely new and unique ways, and entire planets of people are now being connected to the wider Cosmere through the imperial policies of Roshar and Scadrial as they fight a cold (and possibly hot in places?) war across the universe. People and parts of Investiture itself are growing and changing in unexpected and fresh ways. Cultivation does not appear to be openly under attack or even understood as existing by most people involved in the war.

Cultivation may want this because of the wars and technological advancements, but does the Vessel? I haven’t read WaT recently, but was trying to avoid war and death. She got rid of Rayse because of his conflict with Tanavast, and tried to encourage Taravangian to avoid war and domination. She would like rather have Odium be locked away for a time with the current deal instead of making huge gambles that could get her killed imo. Retribution is just too risky a play that could kill everyone.

[Schizoposting]

I remember how right after RoW came out, at least half of the fandom was absolutely convinced that Hoid had outsmarted Taravangian somehow, despite all evidence to the contrary. Now, we have same thing, except with Cultivation. I understand that it's scary reading about a world where the villains have won, but this does not mean that it's divinely preordained that everything will turn out alright for our heroes.

And if you don't believe me, we have a WoB that directly states that Cultivation is "part of the problem, not the solution":

Spoiler

Kaymyth

A lot of people were disappointed when Cultivation just yeeted herself off Roshar and fled. Is what happened what she expected to happen, or was this like her Plan C, her Plan F, Plan Z, like how many layers were there?

Brandon Sanderson

So, Cultivation does have more plans, but let's just say if Cultivation were as capable of handling Odium as she thought, we wouldn't need a book series.

Kaymyth

Oh my.

Brandon Sanderson

That's one thing to keep in mind, right? If Honor and Cultivation could handle Rayse, could handle Odium really, the power behind Rayse, The Stormlight Archive wouldn't need to be written. And so, I wouldn't count Cultivation out entirely, but I would say that Cultivation is part of the problem, not the solution, and that's how you should be looking at Cultivation. I mean, there's some good reasons that some members of the Heralds did not get along with her. And, you know, this is one of the problems that I run into in writing this book series is I want the viewpoint characters to be the ones that are solving problems, not necessarily the people who we can't really grasp and understand. And so, from the get-go, Cultivation I would, as I said, I consider Cultivation, you know she's part of the solution, but I also consider her part of the problem. So, there you are, I'll leave you with that. You are very much allowed to be disappointed in her and you should be.

Shardcast Interview (May 25, 2025)

 

[Gelatinous Hypercube]

1 hour ago, Through The Living Grub said:

Where does it say 5th ideal radiants have infinite stormlight? I don’t remember that being said in books.

Cultivation may want this because of the wars and technological advancements, but does the Vessel? I haven’t read WaT recently, but was trying to avoid war and death. She got rid of Rayse because of his conflict with Tanavast, and tried to encourage Taravangian to avoid war and domination. She would like rather have Odium be locked away for a time with the current deal instead of making huge gambles that could get her killed imo. Retribution is just too risky a play that could kill everyone.

I don't know that we have enough of her actually acting on her own personal ideals as a Vessel to know one way or another. Sacrificing Roshar for the greater good of getting the Cosmere to stop ignoring that Odium is killing shards seems like the kind of possibly unethical plan that would lead to Taln trying to kill you.

 

19 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

I remember how right after RoW came out, at least half of the fandom was absolutely convinced that Hoid had outsmarted Taravangian somehow, despite all evidence to the contrary. Now, we have same thing, except with Cultivation. I understand that it's scary reading about a world where the villains have won, but this does not mean that it's divinely preordained that everything will turn out alright for our heroes.

And if you don't believe me, we have a WoB that directly states that Cultivation is "part of the problem, not the solution":

  Hide contents

Kaymyth

A lot of people were disappointed when Cultivation just yeeted herself off Roshar and fled. Is what happened what she expected to happen, or was this like her Plan C, her Plan F, Plan Z, like how many layers were there?

Brandon Sanderson

So, Cultivation does have more plans, but let's just say if Cultivation were as capable of handling Odium as she thought, we wouldn't need a book series.

Kaymyth

Oh my.

Brandon Sanderson

That's one thing to keep in mind, right? If Honor and Cultivation could handle Rayse, could handle Odium really, the power behind Rayse, The Stormlight Archive wouldn't need to be written. And so, I wouldn't count Cultivation out entirely, but I would say that Cultivation is part of the problem, not the solution, and that's how you should be looking at Cultivation. I mean, there's some good reasons that some members of the Heralds did not get along with her. And, you know, this is one of the problems that I run into in writing this book series is I want the viewpoint characters to be the ones that are solving problems, not necessarily the people who we can't really grasp and understand. And so, from the get-go, Cultivation I would, as I said, I consider Cultivation, you know she's part of the solution, but I also consider her part of the problem. So, there you are, I'll leave you with that. You are very much allowed to be disappointed in her and you should be.

Shardcast Interview (May 25, 2025)

 

In the same vein as my previous response, wouldn't manufacturing a galaxy-wide war to take care of something that was only your personal system's problem previously be both a solution and part of the problem? I don't think she was able to handle Odium, in terms of "handle" as in conquer or resolve the underlying issue, but she could influence its Vessel towards a path. That total defeat or subjugation seems like something that would take the effort from everyone else, and this is the only real way we've seen to get other shards involved and caring about Odium (other than waiting until after Cultivation was possibly also destroyed and he controlled the entire system and got to do his training plans, make his army fully, etc.).

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

20 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

I remember how right after RoW came out, at least half of the fandom was absolutely convinced that Hoid had outsmarted Taravangian somehow, despite all evidence to the contrary. Now, we have same thing, except with Cultivation. I understand that it's scary reading about a world where the villains have won, but this does not mean that it's divinely preordained that everything will turn out alright for our heroes.

And if you don't believe me, we have a WoB that directly states that Cultivation is "part of the problem, not the solution":

  Reveal hidden contents

Kaymyth

A lot of people were disappointed when Cultivation just yeeted herself off Roshar and fled. Is what happened what she expected to happen, or was this like her Plan C, her Plan F, Plan Z, like how many layers were there?

Brandon Sanderson

So, Cultivation does have more plans, but let's just say if Cultivation were as capable of handling Odium as she thought, we wouldn't need a book series.

Kaymyth

Oh my.

Brandon Sanderson

That's one thing to keep in mind, right? If Honor and Cultivation could handle Rayse, could handle Odium really, the power behind Rayse, The Stormlight Archive wouldn't need to be written. And so, I wouldn't count Cultivation out entirely, but I would say that Cultivation is part of the problem, not the solution, and that's how you should be looking at Cultivation. I mean, there's some good reasons that some members of the Heralds did not get along with her. And, you know, this is one of the problems that I run into in writing this book series is I want the viewpoint characters to be the ones that are solving problems, not necessarily the people who we can't really grasp and understand. And so, from the get-go, Cultivation I would, as I said, I consider Cultivation, you know she's part of the solution, but I also consider her part of the problem. So, there you are, I'll leave you with that. You are very much allowed to be disappointed in her and you should be.

Shardcast Interview (May 25, 2025)

 

I actually like that Brandon is letting the villain win. I'm actually willing and excited to say that it may be possible that Retribution wins in the back half and becomes the villain of the space age. It'd be a wonderful splash of terrifying that I just can't get anywhere else.

I will say, I don't agree that this WoB says "Cultivation created Retribution". She tried to make fix the Odium problem, caused a TOdium problem, tried to fix TOdium, and made Retribution. Her failure does not mean her plan was to make Taravangian even more of a problem. She's doing her best, but it's not enough.

1 minute ago, Gelatinous Hypercube said:

I don't know that we have enough of her actually acting on her own personal ideals as a Vessel to know one way or another. Sacrificing Roshar for the greater good of getting the Cosmere to stop ignoring that Odium is killing shards seems like the kind of possibly unethical plan that would lead to Taln trying to kill you.

Yeah, we still don't know much about Koravellium Avast (It took me forever to actually remember the Vessel's name). But Taln tried to kill Kor thousands of years before WaT. There is no precedence of future sight working on that scale (Mistorn Era 1 was 1000 years but this is a lot longer with more direct Shardic influence), and we don't know why Taln acted the way he did.

[Schizoposting]

15 minutes ago, Gelatinous Hypercube said:

In the same vein as my previous response, wouldn't manufacturing a galaxy-wide war to take care of something that was only your personal system's problem previously be both a solution and part of the problem? I don't think she was able to handle Odium, in terms of "handle" as in conquer or resolve the underlying issue, but she could influence its Vessel towards a path. That total defeat or subjugation seems like something that would take the effort from everyone else, and this is the only real way we've seen to get other shards involved and caring about Odium (other than waiting until after Cultivation was possibly also destroyed and he controlled the entire system and got to do his training plans, make his army fully, etc.).

The fundamental problem with this is that it takes away Dalinar's agency—giving up Honor is no longer a brilliant gambit, but rather something that he was manipulated into doing by a higher power. A big theme of the Cosmere is that the divine are just as fallible as the mortals, if not more so. Having everything be the result of Cultivations master plan would completely undercut this. 

12 minutes ago, Through The Living Grub said:

I actually like that Brandon is letting the villain win. I'm actually willing and excited to say that it may be possible that Retribution wins in the back half and becomes the villain of the space age. It'd be a wonderful splash of terrifying that I just can't get anywhere else.

It's hard to imagine the series ending without the heroes getting some kind of victory, given Brandon's general style. But since that the fascists win the Scadrian cold war, it's not impossible that something similar happens with Roshar.

16 minutes ago, Through The Living Grub said:

I will say, I don't agree that this WoB says "Cultivation created Retribution". She tried to make fix the Odium problem, caused a TOdium problem, tried to fix TOdium, and made Retribution. Her failure does not mean her plan was to make Taravangian even more of a problem. She's doing her best, but it's not enough.

I'm not sure where you're getting this from—I actually said the opposite: that what happened in WaT wasn't part of Cultivations plan.

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

10 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

I'm not sure where you're getting this from—I actually said the opposite: that what happened in WaT wasn't part of Cultivations plan.

I must have misread your post. 

12 minutes ago, Schizoposting said:

It's hard to imagine the series ending without the heroes getting some kind of victory, given Brandon's general style. But since that the fascists win the Scadrian cold war, it's not impossible that something similar happens with Roshar.

Even though the fascist government won, its was still the main characters side, which gives them some plot armor.

One could argue Dalinar won by forcing Retribution onto the field, but that may not matter much depending on how Retribution responds in the back half. 

[Nitpicking]

4 hours ago, Through The Living Grub said:

Where does it say 5th ideal radiants have infinite stormlight? I don’t remember that being said in books.

It doesn't, that I know of.

Heralds have unlimited access to Stormlight. They don't seem to be able to fill gemstones like a Bondsmith, but they never run out of Investiture (just as the Fused don't, or Elantrians).

[Deception He/Him]

But remember that Odium, if successful, would probably halt war and growth as a whole. This is not what Cultivation wants, so either she messed up, or she has some kind of genius plan to make sure that Odium doesn't end up ruling the cosmere.

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

8 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

Heralds have unlimited access to Stormlight. They don't seem to be able to fill gemstones like a Bondsmith, but they never run out of Investiture (just as the Fused don't, or Elantrians).

Then why did they need to get gemstone stashes with Nale? They left behind squires because they leaked too much Light and his stores would not have been sufficient.

7 hours ago, Deception said:

 

But remember that Odium, if successful, would probably halt war and growth as a whole. This is not what Cultivation wants, so either she messed up, or she has some kind of genius plan to make sure that Odium doesn't end up ruling the cosmere.

 

I doubt Cultivation has a plan situation that couldn’t have existed before. Odium was physically incapable of leaving, so she has no plans in place for him being able to leave.