[Hemalurgy] What spike would you use to steal stubbornness?

[Cephandrious Maxtori Fae/Faer]

Specifically, would stubbornness fall under emotional fortitude (zinc), mental fortitude (copper), either/both, or something else entirely.

and if it's one of those things you determine on a case by case basis, Kenton's.

[PanLin they/he]

24 minutes ago, Ati_Simp said:

I think you misread, my friend, electrum stores feruchemical determination,  but it hemalurgically steals allomantic enhancement abilities, and while you could use a copper spike to steal mental fortitude, you could also make an equally convincing argument for emotional fortitude.

You're so right  my b, I've updated my answer so it's actually about hemalurgy. Essentially, I think stubbornness (if we assume you mean it as a positive trait) is a more emotional than cognitive trait, so I'd go for zinc over copper.

[PanLin they/he]

2 hours ago, Ati_Simp said:

Specifically, would stubbornness fall under emotional fortitude (zinc), mental fortitude (copper), either/both, or something else entirely.

Hiding my first answer in a spoiler in shame because I misread and managed to answer for feruchemical traits, not hemalurgy (but my thought process is mostly the same):

Spoiler

My immediate first thought on reading this was actually that stubbornness could come from a lack of mental capacity, something that gets stronger while storing mental capacity.

Alternatively, I think electrum for determination might work.

But then, saying that, 'stubbornness' isn't really an attribute in the same way the other cognitive metals are (for this sort of thinking, I like to keep in mind that brass and electrum swapped places during development), it's more just a character trait. It's the sort of thing that you might accidentally end up with anyway when trying to spike something else from someone.

So I think it kind of depends on what exactly you mean by 'stubbornness':

• unflinching adherence to a goal/purpose/faction? I'd try electrum
• inability to adapt one's thinking and position when presented with new evidence? Sounds like someone filling a coppermind rather than tapping anything

 

I still want to give a kind of two-part answer based on your reading of 'stubbornness'.

If it's about the inability or unwillingness to adapt when faced with new information or evidence, then that's actually a sign of either lower cognitive capacity (being unable to form new reasoning and adapt existing thought processes) or lower emotional capacity (refusing to abandon a previously held belief purely because it's more comfortable).

But if you're coming from the angle of stubbornness as a positive trait to stick to one's convictions and hold to what is true even when it's difficult to do so, then I would either suggest:

• gold for access to F-electrum
• zinc for the emotional capacity

For this second reading of stubbornness, I think zinc is a better fit than copper—it's not about being able to rationalise what's right, it's about sticking to it even when it's difficult or when you're in the minority, which is emotional resilience.

It's annoying that warmth and determination did swap places, or else brass would've been a great candidate.

Edited April 10 by PanLin

[Cephandrious Maxtori Fae/Faer]

1 hour ago, PanLin said:

Alternatively, I think electrum for determination might work.

But then, saying that, 'stubbornness' isn't really an attribute in the same way the other cognitive metals are (for this sort of thinking, I like to keep in mind that brass and electrum swapped places during development), it's more just a character trait. It's the sort of thing that you might accidentally end up with anyway when trying to spike something else from someone.

So I think it kind of depends on what exactly you mean by 'stubbornness':

• unflinching adherence to a goal/purpose/faction? I'd try electrum
• inability to adapt one's thinking and position when presented with new evidence? Sounds like someone filling a coppermind rather than tapping anything

I think you misread, my friend, electrum stores feruchemical determination,  but it hemalurgically steals allomantic enhancement abilities, and while you could use a copper spike to steal mental fortitude, you could also make an equally convincing argument for emotional fortitude.