Wayne Doppelganger

[Trusk'our he/him]

In TLM, Gertruda and Dumad attempt to mimic and take the places of Wayne and Wax respectively, and at least Gertruda is going so far that she's trying to brute-force herself into enjoying pain because of a one-off situation where Wayne pretended to be crazy.

I'm imagining that such a level of obsession in a person with Feruchemical gold might actually lead to them shape-shifting into a form more identical to that of the person they're trying to be. Not immediately, because that's a big cognitive change, and because gold isn't typically tapped for no apparent reason and when it is it is focused on repairing vital damage.

But if Telsin and the doppelgangers lived I think Gertruda might eventually have stolen more than Wayne's hat.

 

I suppose the real question of this post is then- what exactly could change a person's perception in such a way that they heal into a new body? Could it be as simple as some mental gymnastics and training, as Returned can do? Or, does it typically take an innate sense of self to be misaligned with how your body currently is, or could that sense of self organically evolve over time?

Thoughts?

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

1 hour ago, Trusk'our said:

I suppose the real question of this post is then- what exactly could change a person's perception in such a way that they heal into a new body? Could it be as simple as some mental gymnastics and training, as Returned can do?

Gertrude would probably have a cognitive shift because she is hyper fixating on Wayne. She is trying to brute force a new identity, and gold might help that along. But I don't think F-Gold is enough for simply mental gymnastics to have a big change. Returned are highly Invested, among the highest in the cosmere. That amount of power lets them bend the rules imo, but gold can't match that level.

1 hour ago, Trusk'our said:

Or, does it typically take an innate sense of self to be misaligned with how your body currently is, or could that sense of self organically evolve over time?

The former sounds like what you are suggesting: Gertrude was constantly portrayed not as Gertrude, but a not-Wayne that existed solely to become/kill him. For the latter, that feels more like someone naturally trying to emulate another person. People are constantly changing, and who they are around or focus on play into how they change.

[Nitpicking]

A bond makes shapechanging easier. See Painter in Yumi and the Singers and their forms. 

[Qianweilian He/him]

On 2/27/2026 at 5:47 PM, Xiahida said:

But I don't think F-Gold is enough for simply mental gymnastics to have a big change. Returned are highly Invested, among the highest in the cosmere. That amount of power lets them bend the rules imo, but gold can't match that level.

It might…Gold can heal Shardblade wounds and even restore powers stolen with Hemalurgy.

Quote

HazelCharm47

Let's say we have a hypothetical situation with Miles Hundredlives. In this scenario, he is wearing a gold metalmind filled to the brim with stored healing power. He is then spiked with a cadmium spike and loses his gold allomancy.

Now, if I recall from various WoBs, he would be able to heal using the gold metalmind and regain his gold allomancy. I could be misremembering and he cannot heal it, but I believe he would be able to since it is part of his Identity.

However, one question I have never seen the answer to is this: what happens to the ability in the spike? Is the allomantic ability still contained in the spike, leading to a duplicate? Or is the spike's ability lost? Or maybe I have this whole thing wrong and Miles could never have regained the ability in the first place.

If the ability duplicates (which I doubt), that could lead to some crazy things. Also, this applies to any Twinborn with gold Feruchemy, I just thought Miles was a good example I guess

Brandon Sanderson

I'd like to see the exact WoB's here to make sure I'm being consistent, as I don't know that I confirmed you could regain lost powers--only that you could heal from hemalurgic soul damage. Most likely, what you'd end up with is a person who has been healed and can remove the spike from their body without damage, and without needing it to hold their soul together--but who has lost the ability in the spike.

Regardless, though, what you want here (the mass production of spikes charged and even blanked) is possible with the right levels of investiture. It's an energy, like things in our world. The difficulty is finding out how to 1) get enough investiture and 2) key it to the right people and/or magic.

Hope that's a little more clear.

That said, a lot of times people just ask me if something is possible--and a lot of things are possible, but just very difficult. And with the right boost of investiture, in the right circumstances, it WOULD be possible to regrow lost (to spikes) powers. It's just highly unlikely.

I'm not sure if the questions people are asking me are ones I've qualified, or not, in these instances. Also, this is all something I'm playing with still behind the scenes as we enter the modern age of Mistborn.

HazelCharm47

As requested, here are the WoBs I believe are related. They might be obsolete, however. And I assume things will get changed a lot before Era 4, but hey, it's fun to ask anyways

WoB #1:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/331/#e9434

This one states that as long as Miles still has his Identity, he would be able to use his Feruchemical metalminds after being spiked and would be able to heal.

WoB #2:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/102/#e983

This one says that Miles would be able to heal his soul using Feruchemical healing and regain his gold Allomancy (assuming he survives the spiking). I think this is the most essential one!

WoB #3:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/76/#e6335

This one is only somewhat related - implies that the Feruchemical and Allomantic powers are spiritually part of him.

WoB #4:

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/7/#e6435

Also tangentially related - damage to the soul from Hemalurgy can be healed (Although this might just be a Hoid thing). I guess the question could be expanded to include non-Feruchemical healing as a way to repair the soul after being spiked.

Brandon Sanderson

Well, I don't think any of those are specifically inaccurate. I just didn't quite understand what people were trying to get out of me. A lot of times, I don't know quite what people are trying to get out of me. I can see now they're trying to figure out.

I see now, and I appreciate you putting this all together for me so I can see what the fans are trying to figure out. So the answer is a cautious yes. The problem here is that he'd need to compound a TON of healing first--but yes, it would work. You could theoretically turn someone like Miles into an invested spike factory.

If he didn't have enough healing stored, though, he'd end up with a healed soul but a gap (like a scar on his soul) where his spiked-out abilities were. That could theoretically be healed with application of more investiture, depending on things like how he views himself, and if you could get the right type of investiture.

General Reddit 2020 (Nov. 6, 2020)

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

21 hours ago, Qianweilian said:

It might…Gold can heal Shardblade wounds and even restore powers stolen with Hemalurgy.

My point was that smaller amounts of Investiture are limited to restoring the physical body to a spiritual ideal. People like Returned have so much Investiture that they can force a desired change. Healing a Shardblade wound restores the body, but growing an extra arm would require someone to alter their Spiritweb or some other Identity shenanigans.

[Qianweilian He/him]

6 minutes ago, Xiahida said:

My point was that smaller amounts of Investiture are limited to restoring the physical body to a spiritual ideal. People like Returned have so much Investiture that they can force a desired change. Healing a Shardblade wound restores the body, but growing an extra arm would require someone to alter their Spiritweb or some other Identity shenanigans.

Stormlight can do it. I don’t have access to Dawnshard right now, but afaik someone (offscreen) changes their body to match their internal identity.

[Through The Living Grub He/Him]

1 minute ago, Qianweilian said:

Stormlight can do it. I don’t have access to Dawnshard right now, but afaik someone (offscreen) changes their body to match their internal identity.

Just to make sure we're on the same page, you are saying that Stormlight healed someone to match their internal identity, not that stormlight changed their internal identity? Because I would agree that stormlight did not change their identity.

As a side note, if Rysn could fully use her Dawnshard, she could probably heal her legs. That well of power should be more than enough to change her spiritweb imo, if she had the ability to fully use it.

[Qianweilian He/him]

29 minutes ago, Xiahida said:

Just to make sure we're on the same page, you are saying that Stormlight healed someone to match their internal identity, not that stormlight changed their internal identity? Because I would agree that stormlight did not change their identity.

Yes, that is what I’m saying.

30 minutes ago, Xiahida said:

As a side note, if Rysn could fully use her Dawnshard, she could probably heal her legs. That well of power should be more than enough to change her spiritweb imo, if she had the ability to fully use it.

Probably not. It’s mentioned in OB that her loss of the use of her legs had become part of her identity. She sees herself as unable to walk. Healing probably wouldn’t change that, and I doubt changing a spiritweb will either, unless she changes her internal image. Plus, they need investiture to do anything, so Rysn having full knowledge of the dawnshard probably wouldn’t do much.