Shard blades vs honorblades and invested entities.

[Valigus]

So given that honorblades are significantly more invested than shard blades, do we think that this has a bearing on their ability to cut more invested entities? For example let’s say you can’t cut some entities with enough investiture (tbh I think this is highly unlikely given that we have seen them cut people invested by unmade and heralds.) would an honor blade do better given its much greater investiture?

[Trusk'our he/him]

1 hour ago, Valigus said:

So given that honorblades are significantly more invested than shard blades, do we think that this has a bearing on their ability to cut more invested entities? For example let’s say you can’t cut some entities with enough investiture (tbh I think this is highly unlikely given that we have seen them cut people invested by unmade and heralds.) would an honor blade do better given its much greater investiture?

If I may ask, where did we learn Honorblades were significantly more Invested than standard Shardblades?

[Sophrosyne He/any]

I don't recall seeing anywhere that they, the honourblades, are more invested then shardblades. if anything, they'd be roughly the same or LESS so due to having lesser sentience compared to radiant spren. 

But if we presuppose Honourblades are more invested then shardblades the effect on cutting force would be proportional to how much more invested they are. Full metalminds, shardplate, spren, etc. resist being cut because investiture resists investiture. My understanding is that it takes a large difference in investure level to overcome that resistance (or tricks). A radiant holding stomlight , or a mostly empty metalmind offer minimal resistance because they have, relative to the blade, little investiture.
 

Sooo... I doubt that helps much but there my 12am thoughts.

[Valigus]

7 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

If I may ask, where did we learn Honorblades were significantly more Invested than standard Shardblades?

It seems reasonable to conclude given that they are known to be significant splinters of honors power. Whereas shardblades are not. I do not believe it’s ever directly stated but honorblades are proper splinters of honors power whereas shardblades are never referred to as such.

a point regarding their sentience though is that it may not actually be indicative of lower levels of investiture given that the sentient spren of Roshar were seemingly intentionally shaped, furthermore they only gain sentience in the physical world with the bond, and honorblades connection to their wielders seeming to be much weaker than bonded spren, it could be they cannot manifest minds as easily. 

Edited August 8, 2025 by Valigus

[Trusk'our he/him]

40 minutes ago, Valigus said:

It seems reasonable to conclude given that they are known to be significant splinters of honors power. Whereas shardblades are not. I do not believe it’s ever directly stated but honorblades are proper splinters of honors power whereas shardblades are never referred to as such.

I think it would be best to state this idea as an idea then, not as fact. It's kind of misleading otherwise.

But anyway, in regard to whether Honorblades dish out more damage than other Blades, I don't think so. Heralds have been slaying Fused and fighting Unmade for millenia, yet not one has been permanently put to rest as far as we know (with the exception of the Thunderclast and probably the beings possessing Sadeas's forces slain by Nightblood or Raboniel and Lezian killed by Anti-Light).

[Nitpicking]

On 8/8/2025 at 3:45 AM, Valigus said:

It seems reasonable to conclude given that they are known to be significant splinters of honors power. Whereas shardblades are not. I do not believe it’s ever directly stated but honorblades are proper splinters of honors power whereas shardblades are never referred to as such.

Excuse me? Shardblades are spren trapped in (or choosing to be in) the form of a sword. The spren of Roshar are made of Honor's power, Cultivation's power, or a mixture of the two. So yes, some of them (e. g. Honorspren blades) are by definition splinters of Honor's power. That's what a spren is, a fragment of a god's power.

Hey! Why don't any Voidspren ever become Blades?

[Sophrosyne He/any]

On 8/8/2025 at 5:45 AM, Valigus said:

a point regarding their sentience though is that it may not actually be indicative of lower levels of investiture given that the sentient spren of Roshar were seemingly intentionally shaped, furthermore they only gain sentience in the physical world with the bond, and honorblades connection to their wielders seeming to be much weaker than bonded spren, it could be they cannot manifest minds as easily. 

Point heard but I think you misunderstood mine. I'm saying that seeing as larger lumps of investure seem to be more sentient then smaller ones the fact that radiant spren talk is a indicator that they have more investure. I'm not sure that connection has anything to do with it. (Thinking Emoji)

 

On 8/8/2025 at 6:33 AM, Trusk'our said:

I think it would be best to state this idea as an idea then, not as fact. It's kind of misleading otherwise.

I'm going to hard agree here. We could debate this. Pulling out books and siting page numbers and that fact alone which makes this an opinion, a valid opinion to hold as it's clear there's something special about the honourblades, but opinion none the less.

it is however a fact that all spren are slinters of one shard or another.
 

4 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

Hey! Why don't any Voidspren ever become Blades?

I don't think any void spren bond. and in case you meant for Enlighted spren, I don't think anyone's sworn a high enough oath.

[Nitpicking]

2 hours ago, Sophrosyne said:

I don't think any void spren bond. and in case you meant for Enlighted spren, I don't think anyone's sworn a high enough oath.

Well, I mean, non-sapient voidspren bind Singers to make the Regals. The Unmade can seemingly bond Singers by entering their gemhearts, and at least one can bond a human by having him swallow a gemstone. Ulim can bond Singers by dwelling in their gemhearts, too.

In Tress of the Emerald Sea we find

Spoiler

That Painter, bonded to the Cognitive Shadow of Yumi, can summon a Shardbrush.

It seems to be a pretty general but not universal thing about Splinters.

[Sophrosyne He/any]

11 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

In Tress of the Emerald Sea we find

Is this a mistake? Cause that's a Yumi spoiler, which apparently I need to re read.

11 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

It seems to be a pretty general but not universal thing about Splinters.

I'm not sure that I follow our logic. Are you saying that because we've seen some splinters can become shardweapons, all splinters should be able to? In which case I'll again point to seons. But don't let me straw man you.

 

[Nitpicking]

51 minutes ago, Sophrosyne said:

Is this a mistake?

Yes.

51 minutes ago, Sophrosyne said:

I'm not sure that I follow our logic. Are you saying that because we've seen some splinters can become shardweapons, all splinters should be able to? In which case I'll again point to seons. But don't let me straw man you.

Brandon has said that Seons could be Blades under the right circumstances: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/221/#e6197

 

Spoiler

paperstones

Could a seon or a skaze turn into some sort of Shardblade on their home planet?

Brandon Sanderson

That is theoretically possible.  They work under the same fundamentals but they would need to have something to pull them more into the Physical Realm.  

 

[Sophrosyne He/any]

Oh! Neat~ that's why we haven't seen voidspren or other splinters do it then. Haven't had the right circumstances!