Can A Feruchemist use another's metalminds?

[Aeshdan he/him]

Alright, so we know that one Feruchemist can't get at another Feruchemist's stored attributes. But what about the physical metalminds themselves? How are they affected by storage?

For example, suppose that after Tindwyl's death, Sazed had decided to keep one of her zincminds as a memento. Suppose further that the metalmind had a maximum capacity of 100 charges, and Tindwyl had already stored 20 charges in it.

I can think of three possible cases.

1. Sazed's and Tindwyl's attributes are unrelated, so Sazed can store the full 100 charges.

2. Tindwyl's 20 charges add onto any Sazed stores, so he can store 80 charges.

3. Tindwyl's charges mark the metalmind as hers, and Sazed can't store in it at all.

[lil_literalist he/him]

To store senses, a Feruchemist needs a different tinmind for each one. If the same Feruchemist cannot store different senses in one metal, I doubt that a different Feruchemist would be able to store a different sense. I would guess that once a Feruchemist has stored an attribute, the metal cannot be used by another.

[Aradel he/him]

Not the question I thought it'd be from the title.

My gut says #2 is more likely, but #3 is a close second. I'll have to spend some time thinking about this one.

I have a related question: What happens to a charged metalmind when the user dies or abandons it forever?

[Aeshdan he/him]

Not the question I thought it'd be from the title.

That's why i put in the subtitle.

[Aradel he/him]

Subtitles don't show on mobile.

[valkynphyre]

In the Mistborn Adventure Game, which is Canon unless Word of God conflicts with it, the Only way a feruchemist can use another's metalminds is if they have been Hemallurgically spiked with feruchemical powers from the person whose metalminds are trying to be accessed.

They can tell if another Feruchemist has stored anything in a piece of metal (Sazed mentioned this to Vin in TFE), but they cannot access it.

Alternately, you can steal invested attributes in a metalmind and store them as pure investiture in a Nicrosilmind, but doing so erases whatever is in the metalmind itself and transforms that power, be it memory, strength , or speed, int Investiture, which can be used in any way you can use any other metalmind. (probably excepting copper, though i guess you could plant false memories in your own head?)

Edited May 4, 2012 by valkynphyre

[Windrunner he/him]

Well, Brandon says this in the Mistborn Adventure Game as well.

That said, however, consider the implications of Aluminum in Feruchemy. With proper manipulation, it might be theoretically possible to tap someone else’s metalminds...

[valkynphyre]

Well, Brandon says this in the Mistborn Adventure Game as well.

hmm... it does say that. interesting.

[lil_literalist he/him]

In the Mistborn Adventure Game, which is Canon unless Word of God conflicts with it, the Only way a feruchemist can use another's metalminds is if they have been Hemallurgically spiked with feruchemical powers from the person whose metalminds are trying to be accessed.

I could have sworn that I had commented before, but this really makes sense.

[CrazyRioter she/her]

oh! I bet you could do something with hemalurgy to let a person claim somebody else's Breaths that were invested in an object.

[valkynphyre]

oh! I bet you could do something with hemalurgy to let a person claim somebody else's Breaths that were invested in an object.

You just took my breath away!

[Windrunner he/him]

I personally believe that you could use the same identity trick that is used to steal from a Feruchemists metalminds to withdraw Breaths invested in an object. If your identity level is low enough, it's possible that the metalmind won't realize that you aren't it's creator and the same could work for recalling Breath.

If you were going to use Hemalurgy to trick metalminds and Awakened objects, I bet that it would be some kind of Human attribute, one that moves a large portion of the spiritual identity from the victim to the receiver. Maybe Human Identity could be an unknown spike power?

[CrazyRioter she/her]

with metalminds you just need to steal the feruchemical ability from somebody and then you can use their metalminds. Or so sayeth the RPG.

[Windrunner he/him]

I was trying to get at a way to access all their metalminds of a Feruchemist instead of just the one you could access if you stole one Feruchemical power. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

[valkynphyre]

Actually, the Guide makes it pretty clear that if you're already a Feruchemist and get a spike for a feruchemical power, you can access any of their metalminds. In fact, this is the only benefit a feruchemist gains from a feruchemical spike. I imagine it's because you are taking the piece of their soul that has feruchemy and grafting it onto your spiritweb. Thus, when done, you are that feruchemist even more than they are.

Edited May 4, 2012 by valkynphyre

[Aeshdan he/him]

Uh, everyone from point 6 onwards has completely missed my question. I know that(weird hemalurgic or aluminum tricks aside) a feruchemist can't use another's stored attributes, but that's not what i'm talking about. I'm wondering about the actual, physical metalminds and whether you can store in them. Please read the OP before remarking on this.

[lil_literalist he/him]

I have no basis for this, but I'm starting to lean towards option 1 or 2. I just can't picture a Feruchemist somehow denying an empty metal by placing only a token amount of charge on it.

[Lance Alvein he/him]

I feel like it's option 3 - once a feruchemist has a charge stored in the metal, it is invested with a connection to that specific feruchemist's spiritweb. While that connection exists, there is no way for other feruchemists to invest any charges into it, and it would appear as a feruchemically inert metal.

[Inkthinker]

Hm. On the other hand, I could also see it working like a partitioned HDD, with each Feruchemist only being able to access that portion of the metalmind that they personally invested.

From a mechanics standpoint, option 2 has the most potential for fun application, but if the Treatise isn't clear on this point, then someone ought to ask Peter/Brandon.

Ooh! Plot hook suitable for the RPG (or a very good fan-fic writer): a group of feruchemists each puts a part of some great secret into a single metalmind, and at some later date they're being murdered one by one by spiking, to create one person who can access the whole thing (who is also going increasingly insane by being multi-spiked).

Edited May 5, 2012 by Inkthinker