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*Spoilers* The many false statements of that one guy.


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I didn't want to say the Stormfather lies in the title. Incase someone wasn't to that point in the book.

There are at least two things we see are untrue that the storm father says. The first is that he tells Kaladin, "You will not ride the winds again." or something like that. It turns out that Kal, infact does ride those winds again, after he blurts out the third ideal. Which at the time, I think the Stormfather thought was true. That neither now, nor ever, would Kaladin regain his Windrunner abilities. So, he obviously doesn't have much, if any, future sight.

Another thing is that he tells Syl, "I forbid this!" right before Kal's recitation of the third ideal. Which means his power is limited to some regard. It may have been something he couldn't interfere with, since Syl had made a covenant with Kaladin, when he agreed to allow her to keep the bond. That means though, that he is not what you would expect from a god. His tone and words make me think that he's cocksure of himself, but in the end, may honestly just be a Herald that was given power through the nature of spren. Meaning, that it appears that the idea/ideals of people form the existence of spren. Like the boat wanted to remain a boat because many people had an idea and understanding of what that boat was. Which gave it a form of power. The stick, was simply a stick. If Shallan weren't talking to it. It likely wouldn't even have enough sentience to understand what it was. So, when the men and women of Roshar, over the years, formulated that Jezerezen was THE Stormfather. It became so. Then as each generation sweared and prayed to him, he gained power and strength. Maybe even from the soul of the Herald himself. Whether this was always the Stormfather or not, I don't know.
Finally, we hear him say, "You shall be a Radiant, without shards." to Dalinar. Which, to me, means that it is not set in stone. The Stormfather is not infallible, is my point. It seems that he pretends he's a deity and is a bit pompous about himself, but in fact, he is wrong just as often as a regular person.

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Treating those words is probably the wrong way to interpret them. Think of the Stormfather as a normal person, not... as whatever you think of him as. It makes a lot more sense then:

  1. "MEN RIDE THE STORMS NO LONGER"
    Sounds like a simple statement of fact - the Windrunners have been gone for thousands of years. If it's really the Stormfather who kicked Kaladin out of his vision / storm ride, it's probably because he considers the highstorms to be his domain now, and he protects them fiercely from the people who dislikes so strongly. You know, because they essentially killed a ton of his daughters.
  2. The Stormfather is not a god. We haven't seen gods in any of Brandon's books, The Stormfather is just a vessel for most of the power of Honor, who was the closest thing to a god this world has seen.
  3. This is a statement of intent, not a prophecy. "I won't be your Shards" is what he says.
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Treating those words is probably the wrong way to interpret them. Think of the Stormfather as a normal person, not... as whatever you think of him as. It makes a lot more sense then:

  1. "MEN RIDE THE STORMS NO LONGER"

    Sounds like a simple statement of fact - the Windrunners have been gone for thousands of years. If it's really the Stormfather who kicked Kaladin out of his vision / storm ride, it's probably because he considers the highstorms to be his domain now, and he protects them fiercely from the people who dislikes so strongly. You know, because they essentially killed a ton of his daughters.

  2. The Stormfather is not a god. We haven't seen gods in any of Brandon's books, The Stormfather is just a vessel for most of the power of Honor, who was the closest thing to a god this world has seen.
  3. This is a statement of intent, not a prophecy. "I won't be your Shards" is what he says.

 

I appreciate and understand what you're saying. The first point though isn't the scene I am referring to and is honestly the main point that I am hung up on. When Kaladin and Shallan are stuck in the Chasm when the Highstorm passes over. The vision that Kaladin has is of the Stormfather. Inside that vision he tells Kaladin two lies, one more blatant than the other. I just realized the one about Syl being dead is the one I kept grasping for in my memory when I made the first post. My brain would not spit out that information. Anyway, The Stormfather tells Kaladin that he won't ride the winds again which turns out false. The he tells him that Syl is dead, which also turns out to be false. Why not be honest though? If he cares so deeply for his spren children that he either refers to them as a whole or Syl specifically as "My most beloved" then why not explain to Kaladin that he dun goofed. That he is about to end her mental capacity forever, when he went against his oaths. I also was going to point out the fact that he said the Everstorm couldn't be stopped. Which may also be misstatement of fact.

I know he isn't a god, but the Stormfather himself says in his verbose way, "I am the shadow of a god!" Which I feel is him being arrogant. It seems to me that for 4,500 years, at least, the most important thing in the world was the Stormfather. He is the big boss of planet Roshar. So, to have some mortal stand and shout at him. Wanting him to be bound to that person? That is just beneath him. Then he says, "I will not be bound to you in a way that will allow you to kill me." I also took this as him saying "No" I won't be your spren. Then in almost the next breath he says, "The words are accepted. I will not be a simple sword to you. You will be a radiant without shards." as if he is now bonded to Dalinar in the same way he originally said he wouldn't be. The fact he makes Dalinar get rid of his sword and says he won't be a simple sword and that he won't have a shard at all, is to me, very unlikely. I bet that at some point Dalinar is stuck between a rock and a hard place with shards being the only way out. Then like the blowhard he is, the Stormfather will jump in to save the day.

I feel like the Stormfather has forgotten the purpose that he was left for. That either Cultivation or Honor left him or made him to look out for the people, or to bind Odium in some way. Yet, for 4,500 years he has been free to roam and watch the people and has given up on them. It's almost like he wants the era of humanity to be gone. Whether he is just suffering from immortal depression. Where you don't die but everything you'll ever know, will die or he is just a dick. I don't know. Either way, I think he isn't what he claims nor appears.

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Treating those words is probably the wrong way to interpret them. Think of the Stormfather as a normal person, not... as whatever you think of him as. It makes a lot more sense then:

  • "MEN RIDE THE STORMS NO LONGER"

    Sounds like a simple statement of fact - the Windrunners have been gone for thousands of years. If it's really the Stormfather who kicked Kaladin out of his vision / storm ride, it's probably because he considers the highstorms to be his domain now, and he protects them fiercely from the people who dislikes so strongly. You know, because they essentially killed a ton of his daughters.

  • The Stormfather is not a god. We haven't seen gods in any of Brandon's books, The Stormfather is just a vessel for most of the power of Honor, who was the closest thing to a god this world has seen.
  • This is a statement of intent, not a prophecy. "I won't be your Shards" is what he says.
A matter of semantics: Roshar "bears the touch and design of Adonalsium". Presumably, THAT is much closer to godhood than Honor. About 16 times closer, in fact.

His "lies" are more him asserting more power than he has. He can rush high storms, maybe direct them more specifically, speak to those within them, etc., but his domain is the storm, and his control over even that seems quite crude and predictable, if his patterns can be calculated with pen and paper by hobbiests and meteorologists alike.1

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The Stormfather has a very pesimistic outlook on humans. When he says to Kaladin that he killed Syl and won´t ride the storms again he does so because he things it is true. From his PoV Kaladin is just a hateful human that has betrayed his oaths. Which means he won´t revive his oaths. Which means that Syl will stay "dead." Which, as we know, is false but that just shows us a Splinter of a Shard of something that may be god can still be flawed.

Just take everything he says wit a hefty dose of arrogance and predjeduce, which may or may not be justified by the KR abandoning their oaths in the past.

 

On what he tell Dalinar. My guess is that given that he can think just fine on his own, he won´t "die" as long as he won´t take on a physical form. If Dalinar can convince the Stormfather that he won´t betray his oaths and is trustworthy he might get Shard but until then the Stormfather won´t take the risk.

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You all make some fine points. I agree with almost everything said. I was mainly just pointing out the flaws he exhibits. I was also wanting to make sure I understood what he was about. There is a chapter heading quote that says something to the effect of, "The Bondsmiths were never as numerous as the other orders. Three came and at one point only one was bound in service to Urithiru. They never did strive to expand their numbers to match the others. They bonded a very specific type of the spren because of this. Growing their numbers was seen as cruel." That is way off the actual quote, but the gist is there. Maybe, all the Bondsmiths bind to "The Stormfather" which is why he is personified as the Bondsmith Herald. It may be that he is somehow the only spren capable of granting their powers and is like a bit of a way to leapfrog some information into the future. Maybe that's why they won't grow their numbers, because it would only strain the SF to an unbearable degree.

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You all make some fine points. I agree with almost everything said. I was mainly just pointing out the flaws he exhibits. I was also wanting to make sure I understood what he was about. There is a chapter heading quote that says something to the effect of, "The Bondsmiths were never as numerous as the other orders. Three came and at one point only one was bound in service to Urithiru. They never did strive to expand their numbers to match the others. They bonded a very specific type of the spren because of this. Growing their numbers was seen as cruel." That is way off the actual quote, but the gist is there. Maybe, all the Bondsmiths bind to "The Stormfather" which is why he is personified as the Bondsmith Herald. It may be that he is somehow the only spren capable of granting their powers and is like a bit of a way to leapfrog some information into the future. Maybe that's why they won't grow their numbers, because it would only strain the SF to an unbearable degree.

 

There is a thread that has some good discussion on that very topic (started by yours truly) called the Bondsmiths 3 that you should check out!

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