Talenat'Elin?

[Chlehrma]

So at the end of WoK we are introduced to Taln...there are some things that stand out as off.

1. Most importantly, Hoid refers to him as "confused."

2. Taln is wearing a sacklike cloth as a wrap.

3. He is dark skinned, dark eyed and has long tangled hair.

4. Slaves wear sacklike clothing.

5. Kaladin saves a dark skinned slave with long, tied-back hair in chapter 53.

6. The man Kaladin saved and the man claiming to be Taln both have no accent.

So I guess my question/theory is that the man is a Herald, but is not actually Taln or Taln respawned on the shattered plains were he had died and then, for some unknown reason, went all the way to Kholinar to announce the Desolation.

Tear it apart please :-)

Edited February 3, 2014 by Chlehrma

[DiamondMind]

I think that the bridgeman kaladin slaved might be relevant later, but I don't think he's Taln or a Herald. Now, I can't disprove the last one (anyone could be a Herald) but this is why he can't be Taln:

 

Sacklike clothing: Bridgeman wear a vest and trousers, not a sack.

 

Description:

• Here is how the bridgeman is described: "He had dark brown skin and brown eyes, his thick black hair pulled back into a long, braided tail."
• And here is Taln: "...a solitary man with dark skin. His hair was long and matted, his clothing nothing more than a ragged, sacklike length of cloth wrapping his waist. He stood with head bowed, wet, ratty hair hanging down over his face and mixing with a beard that had bits of wood and leaves stuck in it." He's also wild, dazed, and wet. It doesn't sound like that's someone who was just healed on the battlefield, but one who came from the fires and the pain that was described in the prelude

Also, Hoid seems to be there specifically to greet Taln as he came back. Why wouldn't he just find him in the Shattered Plains?

 

I admit, the accent thing is weird and the description is similar, but I don't think they're actually the same person.

[DocHoliday]

Well to someone from Boston, another Bostonian doesn't have an accent either. 

So to another Alethi,Alethekar probably doesn't sound like it has an accent.

[Shardlet]

Consider that 60 or 70 years ago, it may have been notable if a man or woman, who was clearly Chinese by heritage but in the US, had no apparent accent.  It would have perhaps been atypical, but not unfeasible.  It may simply be that the bridgeman's family had been in Alethkar for several generations and thus he spoke reasonably perfect Alethi and Kaladin simply expected him to have a different accent due to his heritage.

[Aleksiel]

Most importantly, Hoid refers to him as "confused."

Well, I imagine anyone who spend thousands of years in Damnation will be at least confused afterwards.

 

If that was Taln, how did he become a bridgeman? I don't think anyone would be able to force him to carry a bridge around, the dude has Honorblade and centuries of experience with it. And even if he somehow ended up in Bridge 7 and was saved by Kaladin, how and why did he get to wherever Hoid found him? So far I have assumed Taln just appeared in the Herald's spawning point and Hoid simply knew where that was.

 

I disagree with your point that he could have died on the plains and respawned where we met him in the epilogue - first, the Heralds spend the entire time between Desolations in Damnation, like they have just one life per Desolation and when they die, they don't return during the same Desolation. So if he dies now, he won't come back. Second, it's not like he kept to himself his identity. He literally burst there and declared who and what he was. So had that man been Taln, he would have told Kaladin who he was.

[alylime]

I've been thinking about Hoid's conversation with guards just before the arrival and about Argent's comment from another thread:

 

 

Two remarks. 

1. I am pretty sure he is alive.
2. Every time - and I mean every time - Brandon has answered a question somehow related to the epilogue, he has used something along the lines of "someone who claims to be a Herald" instead of Taln's name. I still think that it is him we see materializing outside Kholinar, but I am slightly bothered by how Brandon never refers to him directly by name and/or title.

(from here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/5588-the-last-herald/)

 

Just before Taln breaks down the door, Hoid is talking at length about the critical nature of being the first to do something:

Given two works of artistic majesty, otherwise weighted equally, we will give greater acclaim to the one who did it first.  It doesn't matter what you create.  It matters what you create before anyone else.

 

Epilogue WoK, p. 1000

 

He says this and several other comparisons in the same vein literally right before Taln arrives.

 

Then Hoid says that Taln arrived too late.

 "What is it we value?" Wit whispered.  "Innovation.  Originality.  Novelty.  But most importantly... timeliness.  I fear you may be too late, my confused, unfortunate friend."

 

(final line of WoK)

 

Wouldn't it be interesting if someone else has preceded Taln in claiming to be a Herald?  I wouldn't put it past Taravangian or the Ghostbloods. 

[Aleksiel]

I think it means that Taln is late to stop the Desolation, though Heralds never stopped Desolations, they just fought in them, so may be I'm wrong. There could be more to what Wit said and not just a way to get to the cool 'timeliness' sentence.

 

I agree that Brandon never said that man was Taln, but he didn't deny it either. Plus, he RAFO-ed a question asking if all Heralds are from Roshar. If I find the source, I'll add it.

 

Edit:

 

Are the Heralds native to Roshar?

BRANDON SANDERSON

RAFO (Man, you're good at asking those, aren't you?)

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=977

Hoid was a Herald or knew someone from another world who was and that's why he knew Taln and where to find him?

 

 

How many Heralds appear in The Way of Kings

BRANDON SANDERSON

More than you might expect. Some have appeared, some have been mentioned but not appeared.

 

So Shallash was said to appear (guess that sort of confirms she is Baxill's mistress), Brandon hints that Jezrien appears as well (http://s70.photobucket.com/user/Terez27/media/WOKtitlepage.jpg.html; which kind of supports the 'Have you seen me'-was-said-by-Jezrien theory, though Brandon wrote 'Where is Jezrien', not 'Did you see Jezrien', but I might be overthinking this).

 

So It's possible that another Herald was there as well. But the man Kal saved just didn't feel that strange to me (he wasn't talking nonsense or doing weird things, though carrying a bridge is weird, I admit). 

Edited February 4, 2014 by Aleksiel

[ShadowsFell]

I've been thinking about Hoid's conversation with guards just before the arrival and about Argent's comment from another thread:

 

 

Two remarks. 

1. I am pretty sure he is alive.
2. Every time - and I mean every time - Brandon has answered a question somehow related to the epilogue, he has used something along the lines of "someone who claims to be a Herald" instead of Taln's name. I still think that it is him we see materializing outside Kholinar, but I am slightly bothered by how Brandon never refers to him directly by name and/or title.

(from here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/5588-the-last-herald/)

 

Just before Taln breaks down the door, Hoid is talking at length about the critical nature of being the first to do something:

Epilogue WoK, p. 1000

 

He says this and several other comparisons in the same vein literally right before Taln arrives.

 

Then Hoid says that Taln arrived too late.

(final line of WoK)

 

Wouldn't it be interesting if someone else has preceded Taln in claiming to be a Herald?  I wouldn't put it past Taravangian or the Ghostbloods. 

 

I really like your theory.  I personally think that Hoid was referring to the fact that Taln showed up too late, but that's a very valid interpretation -- it very well could be an imposter that showed up, and thats what Hoid is referring to.   I wonder what motive he would have though, for espousing the coming Desolation if he was a Ghostblood or from some other organization, instead of Taln?

[SirVarrock]

I was always under the impression that Taln was too late to warn about the desolation.  And how did he get leaves and wood in his beard?

[junior]

I really like your theory.  I personally think that Hoid was referring to the fact that Taln showed up too late, but that's a very valid interpretation -- it very well could be an imposter that showed up, and thats what Hoid is referring to.   I wonder what motive he would have though, for espousing the coming Desolation if he was a Ghostblood or from some other organization, instead of Taln?

 

If you accurately predict a calamity, then people will believe you.  But if you give slightly inaccurate advice about how to deal with it...

 

That's just one possible rationale.  I'm sure there are others, but they'd probably all work along similar lines.

[SirVarrock]

I had a realization earlier today, and I just got my copy of WoK back so I could check it, Taln is mentioned as having brown eyes, and his gem is topaz, which can be brown.  So, going off of the theory that honourblades change eye colour, Taln's natural eye colour might be different from what's mentioned.

[Scott]

The man arriving at the gates of Kholinar has a few things going for him:

 

1) He has sticks and leaves in his beard.  The only place there are sticks and leaves on Roshar is in Shinovar, and that is a long long way from Alethkar.  It is unlikely someone would carry these from Shinovar, put them in their beard, and then cut down a door.  It doesn't make sense.  The best explanation is that he "appeared" there, from some sort of Surgebinding.

2) His Blade does not disappear when he goes unconscious.  All Shardblades we've seen disappear when their holder loses control of it.  The man's Blade does not, implying that it is a different kind of Blade.  We have WoB that there are 3 kinds of Blades, and we know from the Prelude that Honorblades exhibit this behaviour.  We can assume that the Blade the man carries is therefor an Honorblade, with the chance that it could be the third, unknown, kind of blade.

3) He appears to be covered in condensation, similar to a Shardblade that has just been summoned.  It is likely he has appeared via similar means to Shardblade transportation, and something special is going on with him.

4) His eyes are dark even when carrying his Blade.  It is said (although not proven) that Shardblades change the eyecolour of their weilders to a light colour regardless of what they started as.  As this has not been seen occurring in the text it may be incorrect, but is still suggestive that this Blade is different from a typical Shardblade.

 

The conclusions I draw from this are as follows.  The man at the gates:

- Is carrying a Blade that is not a normal Shardblade

- Did not arrive by normal means (aka walking), and instead transported from between Realms or using a Surge

 

I strongly suspect he's who he says he is.  However, if he's not, he's still someone pretty special.

[DocHoliday]

@Scott

I presented similar ideas  concerning Taln and Shinovar, but on review we found many mentions of leaves and branches.

So it's not really supporting evidence.

[Scott]

@Scott

I presented similar ideas  concerning Taln and Shinovar, but on review we found many mentions of leaves and branches.

So it's not really supporting evidence.

 

I suppose he could be a strange hermit with an Honorblade

[Torian'Omil Stonespark]

I am not sure he is Taln, but I am really looking forward to seeing what he has experienced after he was abandoned by his peers...also I strongly disagree with the premise that the bridge man was or is a herald.

 

The Hoid allusion to humans having the most reverence for the person doing something first, just prior to his arrival is an interesting item to examine as we speculate on who the person is, but I am really willing to wait a little longer for a couple of more pieces before I start speculating about the series.