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@DeployParchate 1) I think a big reason is that Jasnah and Kaladin are both favorite characters for a lot of people, so they hope to put them together. 2) Kaladin is the only male lead at the moment that appears to have the scholarly back ground and thought process to keep up with her. That's not me calling anyone else dumb or anything like that, but Kaladin was insinuated as being a genius by his father and we saw how quickly he picked things up when Shallan was studying parts of the plains. 3) Jasnah admires persistance and the ability to structure an argument logically with reason. Is there anyone more persistent than Kaladin? He can definitely present an argument logically, when he's not clouded by resentment or his past. I mean he grew up having debates with is mother all the time. 4) Jasnah doesn't care for a lot of societies rules, like only women being allowed to read. She'd probably respect Kaladin for being one of the few male characters so far in the series that can read and write on his own. Plus it means she doesn't have to sit around being his secretary and he probably wouldn't care for her to do so. 5) Jasnah doesn't appear to be the type of person that dislikes or looks down on dark eyes. I'd assume Kaladin would appreciate her blunt honesty on the subject and its doubtful that he'd see her as being dishonest on the subject. 6) Both of them appear to have huge issues with being "beholden" to someone else. Kaladin would be the last person to force roles or rules on someone else that is supposed to be his equal. 7) Jasnah appears to dislike men, especially the "dishonorable" type (I'm inferring dishonorable from her hate of the thieves in the alley). How many male characters in the books have been anywhere near as honorable as Kaladin? 8) Jasnah considers Dalinar possibly the best man she's ever known, Kaladin might as well be a younger, more scholarly version of him (more immature as well) and Sanderson has shown similarities between the two on quite a few occasions. 9) Kaladin already breaks a lot of the preconceived notions of Alethi society. - First dark eyes captain - He can read and write as a male - He gives titles based out of respect, not because of the title society has given someone. - Became a Knight Radiant while being a dark eyes - Had 100s of bridgemen and turned a large number of them into soldiers. 10) I doubt he'd care or try to change her thoughts on society/religion and so forth. He's not the type to stick to how society should perceive people and I think that's apart of what Jasnah fears in marriage. She doesn't want to have to change herself to fit with her betrothed and present someone she is not because her husband wants her too. 11) Jasnah has a lot of freedom at the moment to study and search the globe for her scholarly pursuits and marriage would tie her down to another duty. I'd put money Kaladin would happily go with her to learn about the world too, he's shown himself to be the type to enjoy learning and willing to work hard to understand something new (his powers). A lot of this stuff is based on assumptions and obviously needs more fleshing out when the two of the meet. However, after seeing how Kaladin and Shallan get along, I'm guessing that this will turn into more of a Jasnah accepting Kaladin as the person courting Shallan or something along those lines.

Kaladin is too honorable to toy with the idea of making a move on her or telling her how he feels. He's not going to step between Adolin and her relationship, he's not the type and he's already admitted that he'll be happy for them since they work (he'll just hate that they work). He's already made his peace with his feelings and admitted to them, I doubt it's going to haunt him or make him constantly doubt himself, he's had enough of that through the first two books. I'm starting to think that Shallan will hitch a ride with Kaladin at the start of the next book. She already tried connecting to the other portals from where she is and they are locked, probably from their location. The next logical step is for her to go activate them or attempt to remove the lock at each portal in person, and the fastest way to move around the world right now without the portals working is Kaladin. There's literally 10's of thousands of lives on the line and the queen. His home is pretty close to the capital when you think about how he can fly and if Shallan wanted to move by land it'd take ages for her to get to the capitol and be too late by then. This is where I think the problem is going to be on Shallan's end, her characters had a huge amount of plot dedicated to self denial and she's already begun to deny how she feels about Kaladin. My very rough prediction is that as they travel together she continues falling harder for him (even if its not them traveling together, I see it going in this direction). However, with Adolin and probably finding out later that Kaladin killed her brother, she'll deny her feelings even more vehemently. Who'd want to admit to falling for the guy that killed their brother, even if it was understandable that he had no choice. However, she's a truth seeker, and denying her own feelings will hinder her ability to be a radiant and she'll have to come to terms with her feelings for Kaladin at a lot of anguish to herself. I could see this being her next step as a radiant, admitting to a truth about herself that she doesn't want too. With her mother and father it was more that she didn't want the truth about what she had done, but with this it's more about the truth of what she wants, not what she has done. I'm probably going to be way off, but who knows. I just don't see why she'd stay to study Urithiru when there's so many lives on the line at the moment and she's the one that knows the portal system (other than Jasnah).

1) You already saw Kaladin and Shallan in the chasm and he had numerous opportunities to be overprotective or underestimate her, he didn't. They formed a team and she metaphorically gave him the "right" to protect her by giving him her sword. Even the scene where they are walking and running through the chasm, Shallan gets annoyed with Kaladin because he won't take her bag from her, but it shows he trusted her to keep up (or he's just rude, but I doubt he wants to get her hurt/killed by falling behind). The irony is she probably wouldn't have accepted it if he asked her to give it to him right away because she'd assume he was underestimating her. He knew she was a radiant after being in the chasm with her and at the end he didn't give it a second thought when he found out it was true because he believed in her, I highly doubt there'd be an overprotective issue between the two. - Someone else pointed out earlier in the thread how well their dislike for people being overprotective or caging them. 2) Shallan might have a tendency to lie, but she is supposed to be about truth and throughout the book she was forced to face the truth of her past to progress as a radiant. She lies to protect herself, but as noted by her, it holds her back as well. Kaladin has already drawn her into admitting a large portion of her past and he's been able to pull out her real persona in every meeting between the two. He's the perfect character to force her into being truthful and not lying to herself because he can "read" her, it's one the reasons she gets so uncomfortable and points out how analyzing/passionate his gaze is because she's worried he'll see through her (which he does seem too). - The other problem she's going to run into is that she's going to have two fake personalities, the one she shows to most people right now as Shallan and the one joining the Ghostbloods. It's probably going to be pretty difficult to find the truth in things when you don't even know who you really are, especially when Ghostbloods are going to muddle the way she thinks with their talk of "truths". This is where Kaladin's ability to draw her real personality out would be a pretty nice benefit more than bane. - For Kaladin to find out she's a Ghostblood probably would anger him, but that's apart of creating any interesting relationship in a good story. If everything came neatly together and there was zero issues between the two it'd be pretty boring and not very satisfying. 3) Syl left because he broke his code as a radiant, dating someone she dislikes would probably irritate her, but I doubt she'd kill herself over it. Also, the irony between Syl being prejudice against a group of spren while she has lectured Kaladin for ages on "light eyes" would be humorous. Like you, I'd much rather prefer Jasnah and Kaladin, but I doubt Sanderson put in as much effort as he has with their interactions just to throw it away in the next book or two. There's a lot of depth here and a large portion of it points towards romance between the two of them, but who knows, it's not like authors have never changed their minds. He'd just have a lot of work ahead of him to redirect all the work he put into the Adolin/Shallan/Kaladin situation.

@Paradox You see her getting angry at Adolin in a few scenes when he tries to be protective of her. Not just Adolin, but in a few other scenes you see her let out her resentment to people trying to protect her or underestimate her. However, in the chasm, Kaladin and her eventually became more of a team than anything else, Kaladin trusted her and took blame when he was wrong about the direction they were going. They came to a mutual understanding that both of them made a mistake and as a team they managed to figure out how the planes were formed (Kaladin's insight gave her the epiphany). When Kaladin basically said he'd sacrifice himself to save her, he didn't do it out of some need to protect the more "fragile" Shallan, but because she was more important to get back. That's why Shallan for once in the book gave into someone protecting her, and she quickly trusted him with her sword because she was planning to help him.Otherwise she'd have probably fought tooth and nail for him to go back since she obviously would have her abilities to protect herself. It was a sign of absolute trust when she gave him that sword, essentially giving him "permission" to protect her as she went to get her things. Even when Kaladin figured out that she most likely was a radiant like he used to be, there was no jealousy or resentment, Kaladin had just lost his last and most precious gift, one thing he never wanted to give away and he still didn't feel any resentment or jealousy towards her. In contrast, you have Adolin beginning to feel some jealousy at the end of the book and considering their relationship from where each of them was ranked in society. It's understandable, Adolin grew up being the son of a prince, possibly an heir to the throne, and has always protected others with his skills. Now his formerly low ranked fiance, that needed his families power to save her family is now considered his better by societies standards, I can see it getting to anyone. I wonder how much it boils over in the next book with his brother, father, fiance and Kaladin all being knights. Honestly, I consider Sanderson a great writer, but I'm surprised how much subtlety and depth he's put into the interactions between these three characters. Especially when you think about the length of the book and how little Shallan/Kaladin interacted with one another. A lot of good/great writers have a hard time writing a good love story and so far this one seems to have a "light touch" to it, which in my opinion makes for the best ones. Being able to go back, see hints, connections and depth you didn't see the first time is always enjoyable. I'd still prefer Jasnah and Kaladin, just because I like both characters far more than I do Shallan, but I can live with this one if he keeps writing it as well as he has.

I agree with your first point, I expect the Adolin and Shallan relationship to be figured out before anything happens with Kaladin. You really don't expect Kaladin to upset Syl ever again? Or vice versa? That sounds pretty boring if Kaladin has to walk on egg shells around Syl, especially since their little arguments are enjoyable to read. She had to leave him because of messing with his oaths and that's what upset her. I doubt she's going to choose to leave Kaladin and become a regular spren just because he's dating a girl that has a spren that she will dislike. Especially since she's spent a huge portion of the book wanting him to laugh and smile, which is something Shallan brought out of him. I'd assume his happiness is more important than her dislike for Pattern. Also, if anyone hasn't noticed, Syl and Shallan have similar personalities in quite a few ways. Additionally, plot wise, I would think Sanderson would enjoy writing about the added drama from Syl and Pattern not liking each other, and how it effects the relationship between Kaladin/Shallan. Kaladin killing her brother and it being avoided for now is foreshadowing for future drama between the two. It'd be a perfect method to slow down a relationship between the two and create a rift they need to repair. He's already foreshadowing multiple issues to them getting together, while writing them as two people that complement one another very well, which would lead into an actually interesting love story progression. The most interesting part for me is seeing the "real" Shallan come out the more she interacts with Kaladin. I want to see more of her that isn't a persona just created to protect herself. Kaladin in almost every scene with her managed to get to the "real" her and it was enjoyable seeing those small moments where her persona cracks. He already figured out she was putting up a "fake smile" and was on the verge of telling her that always being witty doesn't mean she can avoid certain issues, before they ran from the chasmfiend.

I think you`re giving Adolin way too much credit here, Shallan specifically told him about the inner plateaus and the rock formations on them. He didn't figure it out on his own, and he could barely recall what she said: During the scene you`re referring too, she doesn't say anything to Adolin other than to "slay" the moss like he's some kind of big brute to do her bidding. No explaining her reasoning, which is extremely telling since she assumes he either won't understand or he won't care. It corresponds to how she see's him throughout the book, a superficial appeal, always discussing how good he looks or giving him generalized characteristics like being "genuine". However, her interpretation of Kaladin is far more specific and deep, practically swooning thinking about just what his eyes convey about his personality. The scene is another contrast between the two characters and how they interact with Shallan. Adolin didn't care about her interest and he didn't want to learn more about her through understanding what she was doing. Kaladin on the other hand wanted to figure out what she was doing to understand her more and appeared to be genuinely interested after he got his first guess wrong. It's just another demonstration of how well the two of them complement one another and how Adolin is on a different wavelength. It's become almost too obvious that Kaladin and Shallan is the direction Sanderson wants to go, which makes me believe that he's leading people on with the idea of a love triangle and plans to cut the Adolin/Shallan relationship before anything deep develops between Kaladin and Shallan. Additionally, in that scene, Shallan gets so frustrated with Kaladin that she snaps her pencil in half while drawing. I mean how many times have you seen her distracted from finishing a drawing and get so irritated that she snaps a pencil in half? Has Adolin even once managed to get an emotional response from her anywhere near that? Kaladin easily penetrates her "fake" personality and gets her to do things that are true to who she really is. At the moment Kaladin appears to be the perfect character to bring out the real Shallan and get her to completely own up to her past.

To be honest, I don't know if Adolin is really interested in her either, other than superficially. Their conversations are a little awkward to me as well, it's like a tutor and student or she tries to lower the "complexity" of the conversation to keep him in the loop. Not to say Adolin is an idiot, but his entire life revolves around battle. Additionally, it seems like Adolin is pushing for this relationship to work out because he's desperate to just make a relationship with a woman work for once. Politically speaking, Shallan is a knight radiant now, as Adolin mentioned, she's above him at this point and can protect her family on her own. I don't know if he'll continue with the love triangle angle, I think it's going to go more the route of Adolin and Shallan breaking up in the next book. - Adolin is going to be haunted by what he did, as much as it was awesome, it goes against EVERYTHING his father taught him and who he has grown up to be. - I think the last scene hinted at him being jealous as well, Shallan, Kaladin, his father, Jasnah and his brother are all Knight Radiants. Bridge 4 are squires of Kaladin it seems as well now. I don't see how you don't feel jealous or at least find something wrong with yourself if you`re the only one left out. - No problems have cropped up with how Adolin is a womanizer, only discussions how Shallan doesn't care if his eyes wonder. - As much as it makes Shallan seem like a bitch, as Adolin distances himself because of his problems, I expect her to start seeing problems in their engagement, especially since she no longer needs the marriage to save her family. - I don't think you`re going to see much of Kaladin and her until Anderson wraps up the Adolin/Shallan relationship, except maybe keeping in contact through spanreed. I don't know who Shallan ends up with at the end of the day, but it'd be poor writing in my opinion if he keeps these two together. Unless Adolin becomes a totally different character or somehow their interactions with one another have a real connection, I just don't see how they work at all. Especially after seeing how well her and Kaladin interact, I actually looked forward to more scenes between the two.

I think it'd work better at this point if he ended things between Shallan and Adolin, more than not putting Shallan/Kaladin ever together. After seeing their characters interact in the chasms, they complement one another way too well. I'd prefer no love triangle, they almost always turn out poorly, but I think Shallan and Kaladin make a much better pairing than the superficial one between Adolin and her.

I think you`re right with your first point about being saved for when Kaladin isn't around; however, I don't think their feelings for one another have developed to the point where it'd be useful early in the next book. For Kaladin it seems he has realized he has some feelings for her but he's already conceded that Adolin and her make a good couple, so he won't be jealous/petty. Shallan seems to be fighting the idea she likes him at all and so far their doesn't seem to be any thoughts of Kaladin when she's with Adolin other than that one scene as they move out on the plateau. Their feelings for one another seem like more of a growing thought for both of them and needs more interaction between the two before it becomes something deeper. I mean Kaladin obviously still hates light eyes to some degree and Shallan is still enamored with Adolin (at least how he looks) to the point she can push any feelings for someone else out. It just doesn't appear their feelings have developed to the point where it'd be a huge issue right now, I think it's more likely to come up when they've both given into their feelings and are on the brink of getting together. There's been too much work put into avoiding the issue up to this point for it to be used so early in a budding romance, at least to me.

@Seloun I wish I put the whole Kaladin/Shallan/Adolin situation as eloquently as you did . I don't think he's going to end up with them not together, seeing how they interact with one another and how well they complemented one another, it'd be almost a crime not to see the story go in that direction. I am curious what you think of Sanderson having a love triangle and an obvious one (a lot of people predicated this from the last book)? Also, how you expect Kaladin to take things, will he accept them or pine/hate their relationship?

My guess is he's saving it for the right moment, where Shallan can confront him about it or something to delay the two of them getting together at some point. Seems like another cliche with the whole love triangle, I'm really not enjoying how he's progressing the love story in the series so far, other than Kaladin and Shallan being extremely well written when together in scenes.

I agree, I do like the pairing of Shallan and Kaladin now, far more than Adolin and Shallan. Kaladin actually keeps Shallan on her toes in an argument and she puts him in his place too. I think Sanderson at the moment made it pretty obvious that's the direction he's going for. - Shallan so far has seen Adolin superficially, every scene with him she talks about his looks and it appears to be a major aspect for her. The first scene where she see's Kaladin in a good light, she thought he was brilliant (plus a few other deep thoughts about his personality) and hasn't really mentioned how he looked to her. Adolin to her seems to be a bunch of generalities, honorable, genuine and so forth, while Kaladin she's specific about what she see's in him. - Shallan has been fake around Adolin as well, being someone she was obviously not (at least in their first few encounters with each other), and she's only shown her true self to Kaladin. - She compares the two and tries to convince herself Kaladin isn't all that great. - Future hurdles already in place with how Kaladin killed her brother on the field. The annoying part for me with this is that it's pretty obvious he's going in the Shallan/Kaladin direction, but he created this superficial relationship at the moment between her and Adolin as a "stop gap". I might be wrong, maybe it develops into something more, but right now it feels like Adolin and Shallan is just a way to slow down Shallan/Kaladin more than something really meaningful. I just really hope he doesn't go the route of having Kaladin pining and hating their relationship, he's done enough of that (as I said before). The whole Adolin and Shallan relationship developed much too quickly for my taste too. From getting to know one another and then all of a sudden finding safety in one another's presence like they've been together for a long time.

I'll start with how I enjoyed the book a ton, and I had a few gripes with it, but overall I'm sad to be finished (even though I enjoyed the end) and it sucks we have to wait at least a year for the next one. Was I the only one that found Shallan extremely annoying for parts of the book? It was just frustrating at times seeing everything go right for her and barely any hurdles. Yes, her past was dark, but otherwise in the "present" whatever she did or wanted to do pretty much happened. From when she got lowered into the water until the end of the book, everything worked out for Shallan. She got Adolin enamored with her (a guy notoriously bad at sticking to one woman), found what Jasnah was looking for, became a knight radiant, turned a bunch of broken and honor less men with one speech, joined a powerful secret society (tricked them first of course), out conned a practiced con woman, partnered with a prince and leveraged him all in one meeting, and the list goes on. When did she fail? Every other major character in the book had hurdles, plans that failed and hard (even brutal) lessons to learn. The love triangle development was another annoying part in the book for me. I didn't expect Sanderson to go for the most obvious relationships. Kaladin of course has now basically become friends with Adolin (which was awesome to see) and he's fallen for Adolins fiance, so now he's stuck in a horrible position like always. I did have some hope when he said he'd be happy for them, but we'll see how that develops with him saying he'd "hate" that they were a good match for each other. I just pray it won't be Kaladin pining over Shallan now, he's done enough pining and hating, it's time to show another side of him for more than a few chapters at the end of each book. I do have to admit though, Shallan and Kaladin interacting was some of the best dialogue in the book and their interactions made them a really appealing pairing, even if I didn't like the idea of them getting together before this book.